NFL robs the Steelers

[Vitamike]

Give it a rest. You already admitted to using Wiki as a source today

Never said Wiki was a source, but I did click over and read all of the citations associated on the Wiki page in years past and linked those 'sources' in other debates back in the day. This go around, some of those Wiki links listed have expired and are no longer available.

Good enough for me, because I've been there and done that and read the actual sources.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Never said Wiki was a source, but I did click over and read all of the citations associated on the Wiki page in years past and linked those 'sources' in other debates back in the day. This go around, some of those Wiki links listed have expired and are no longer available.

Good enough for me, because I've been there and done that and read the actual sources.

Great now go watch the game and then come back and discuss. Otherwise the imaginary speculation board is over there>>>>>>>>>>

 

[Vitamike]

Are you serious? You been arguing this wasn't an infraction, and quoting rules while ignoring a 3x SB champs knowledge and you only saw the screen shot?

Does anyone to include family members even take you seriously

I said from the get that I was watching the Rams destroy the Seahawks and didn't watch the game. Also in my original said based on the screen shot in the tweet that both O lineman 'looked engaged in a block' and stipulated then if that was the case, that it was probably the reason they picked up the flag.

I am actually taken quite seriously by many and more than a few Pats fans who are very good friends, since you asked.

Why don't you answer the question and forget about relying on another mans opinion.

Why do you think they picked up the flag? Those lineman were clearly beyond the LOS, right?

Here's another question, if they were engaged in a block or if the pass is thrown behind the LOS, is it still a penalty for the lineman to past the LOS for any reason?

 

[NWPATSFAN]

I said from the get that I was watching the Rams destroy the Seahawks and didn't watch the game. Also in my original said based on the screen shot in the tweet that both O lineman 'looked engaged in a block' and stipulated then if that was the case, that it was probably the reason they picked up the flag.

I am actually taken quite seriously by many and more than a few Pats fans who are very good friends, since you asked.

Why don't you answer the question and forget about relying on another mans opinion.

Why do you think they picked up the flag? Those lineman were clearly beyond the LOS, right?

Here's another question, if they were engaged in a block or if the pass is thrown behind the LOS, is it still a penalty for the lineman to past the LOS for any reason?

You're exhausting. How could you dispute anything I'd say? You would reguritate the rule book AGAIN and only have a screen shot to argue your useless point? Seriously! You want to debate something you didn't even see?

 

[Vitamike]

I'll even admit, I watch a lot of College football and I could be mixing up the 'engaged rule' exception. Just trying to make sense to why they would pick up a flag for Ineligible Receivers down field when there were two linemen past the LOS yet they still picked up the flag. I do know that in the NFL it has to be a forward pass, so that lateral screen play is an exception. Still know idea if that was a forward pass or a screen lateral.

 

[Vitamike]

You're exhausting. How could you dispute anything I'd say? You would reguritate the rule book AGAIN and only have a screen shot to argue your useless point? Seriously! You want to debate something you didn't even see?

LOL, I said it from the start and asked what the scenario was from my very first post, but you want to put words in my mouth that I was saying that picking up that flag was legit, when in fact all I was doing was speculating on why they might do so.

To be honest, I don't think you know how to debate at all, it requires understanding what the other is saying, and you clearly failed from the start.

 

[dbldwn711]

 

[TP76]

So goes that theory... obviously down field and blocking during the pass.

From the NFL rule book:

Item 2. Illegally Downfield. An ineligible offensive player is illegally downfield if:

1. he moves more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage without contacting an opponent
2. after losing contact with an opponent within one yard of the line of scrimmage, he advances more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage
3. after losing contact with an opponent more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage, he continues to move in any direction.

I think it's pretty clear there is no exemption in the NFL - except for a one yard buffer.

Source: 2017 NFL Rulebook | NFL Football Operations

 

[Vitamike]

Yeah if that exception is for College only, I don't know why they picked up the flag it was clearly a forward pass. The linemen were both well beyond the LOS (Just like in the screen shot ) but since they were both were engaged in a block at the time of the pass makes me think that exception is for the NFL too.

I have a good friend who is a referee, and he refs multiple leagues. He complains that both he and his coworker refs struggle to keep the variance in league rules in their proper place, says sometimes its a real challenge and what they discuss when they huddle before making the call on the field or court. LOL.

 

[TP76]

TBH the rule book is becoming so large and poorly worded, it's no wonder these refs are having such a bad go of it lately...

The game was so much cleaner and pure pre-1978.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Thanks for posting this. I just spent 30 minutes looking for a vid of the play and then trying to backtrace CPT Debate's posts on this threadIt gave me a headache. Every time he's proven wrong he moves the goal posts and redirects. He says he had no dog in the fight which may be true? But, it certainly appears he has an axe to grind. Maybe it's residual from superbowl 50. No I mean 36. Wait a minute I didn't see either of them I just stayed in a Holiday Inn Express and play CPT Debate on tv. But but but my friend is a ref and he said...

 

[Vitamike]

Item 2. Illegally Downfield. An ineligible offensive player is illegally downfield if:

1. he moves more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage without contacting an opponent
2. after losing contact with an opponent within one yard of the line of scrimmage, he advances more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage
3. after losing contact with an opponent more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage, he continues to move in any direction.Source: 2017 NFL Rulebook | NFL Football Operations

Okay, I'll take the apologies whenever you all want to give them.

The Right Guard never loses contact with his opponent beyond one yard, so he is not an ineligible receiver and why the flag was picked up.

So, my speculation about the lineman being engaged was spot on.

 

[Vitamike]

Thanks for posting this. I just spent 30 minutes looking for a vid of the play and then trying to backtrace CPT Debate's posts on this threadIt gave me a headache. Every time he's proven wrong he moves the goal posts and redirects. He says he had no dog in the fight which may be true? But, it certainly appears he has an axe to grind. Maybe it's residual from superbowl 50. No I mean 36. Wait a minute I didn't see either of them I just stayed in a Holiday Inn Express and play CPT Debate on tv. But but but my friend is a ref and he said...

But read it and understand it, it actually says exactly what I speculated the rule was from the very beginning....

Geez!

 

[TP76]

Okay, I take the apologies whenever you all want to give them.

The Right Guard never loses contact with his opponent beyond one yard, so he is not an ineligible receiver and why the flag was picked up.

So, my speculation about the lineman being engaged was spot on.

Watch again - the Guard contacts a player within one yard, then engages another player 3 yards down field, before the ball is even thrown.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Watch again - the Guard contacts a player within one yard, then engages another player 3 yards down field, before the ball is even thrown.

Exactly but but but my friend and but but but geeze

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Watch again - the Guard contacts a player within one yard, then engages another player 3 yards down field, before the ball is even thrown.

I'm done with this ass clown.

 

[dbldwn711]

I'll freely admit that I don't know/understand the rule. Probably why I've enjoyed this back and forth. To me, ANY problems that MAY arise with the lineman downfield I think has to do with Bens decision to throw late in the play which was a designed run. Obviously he makes a great read and a perfect throw for a classic TD pass but in the process the lineman may have been playing the run. That's gotta be why they were downfield so far

 

[broncosmitty]

Can e'ryone agree this (these) stupid fucking rules need to go away?


The end zone fumble/touchback shit too.

 

[TP76]

Vitamike was correct in his assumption, according to the rules... just didn't happen that way.

 

[Vitamike]

Watch again - the Guard contacts a player within one yard, then engages another player 3 yards down field, before the ball is even thrown.

Yeah, it may revert to his entire body, much like the QB throwing a pass beyond the LOS, every part of the QB has to be completely beyond the LOS and if you look at it (I did in super slow motion) the Guard's back foot is about a yard and a half past the LOS when he engages the second defender.

At that point, I think it's really splitting hairs to argue the flag being picked up even though to the letter of the rule it was illegal. That said, the refs go by what they see on the field, and in their view it probably looked close enough by rule, and is one of those situations where they don't want to take points off the scoreboard if they weren't absolutely sure.

Besides, my whole position on 'why' they picked up the flag was speculated on the offensive lineman being legally downfield because he was engaged in a block based on that screen shot. This was the first time I actually saw the entire play as I said from the very start.