NFL Draft

[Niner Outlaw]

It's clear that the Niners FO wanted THEIR guys. That can go really well, or it can go really badly (ala Pettis).

I loved the move back of one spot. We got a 4th for free. Good move.

Surprised we passed on Lamb and Jeudy. Very surprised. WR is a desperate need (and seems to be every year). With the DL being rather deep, I was surprised that we took a DT at 14. If we're gonna go with DT in rd 1, it's tough to argue with Kinlaw, as he was the best interior DL still on the board. His knees worry me, since we've already got 2 injury-prone starters on the DL (Armstead and Ford).

We moved up from 31, using the 4th we just acquired and a 5th. So, we basically only paid a 5th to move up a half dozen spots in rd 1--great value.

Since was passed on a WR at 14, and all the good CBs and OTs were gone, it was practically a lock that we were gonna go WR with the move up. Aiyuk was one of the better options left, but I figured we'd go for the Clemson guy. Still, this ASU product seems a lot like Deebo last year--not prototype tall, but long armed, tough, and good run after catch. With the way the FO missed on Pettis, they really need that to work.

From here, we've got nothing left until Day 3 b/c I don't see anyone giving us a day 2 pick for Goodwin and Breida.

OVerall, it's good to see that we filled 2 of our biggest holes. It woud've been nice to get a CB and a OT, but with as few picks as we had, we did pretty well. Honestly, is Kinlaw/Aiyuk better or worse than Lamb/PlayerX? I'm not sure, but I'm not really disappointed. I think had we gone with Lamb at 14, we'd have moved down (or tried to, as there were a lot of teams not wanting to move from early Rd 2).

 

[Ricky Roma]

It's clear that the Niners FO wanted THEIR guys. That can go really well, or it can go really badly (ala Pettis).

I loved the move back of one spot. We got a 4th for free. Good move.

Surprised we passed on Lamb and Jeudy. Very surprised. WR is a desperate need (and seems to be every year). With the DL being rather deep, I was surprised that we took a DT at 14. If we're gonna go with DT in rd 1, it's tough to argue with Kinlaw, as he was the best interior DL still on the board. His knees worry me, since we've already got 2 injury-prone starters on the DL (Armstead and Ford).

We moved up from 31, using the 4th we just acquired and a 5th. So, we basically only paid a 5th to move up a half dozen spots in rd 1--great value.

Since was passed on a WR at 14, and all the good CBs and OTs were gone, it was practically a lock that we were gonna go WR with the move up. Aiyuk was one of the better options left, but I figured we'd go for the Clemson guy. Still, this ASU product seems a lot like Deebo last year--not prototype tall, but long armed, tough, and good run after catch. With the way the FO missed on Pettis, they really need that to work.

From here, we've got nothing left until Day 3 b/c I don't see anyone giving us a day 2 pick for Goodwin and Breida.

OVerall, it's good to see that we filled 2 of our biggest holes. It woud've been nice to get a CB and a OT, but with as few picks as we had, we did pretty well. Honestly, is Kinlaw/Aiyuk better or worse than Lamb/PlayerX? I'm not sure, but I'm not really disappointed. I think had we gone with Lamb at 14, we'd have moved down (or tried to, as there were a lot of teams not wanting to move from early Rd 2).

Yup....if the move up to get Aiyuk with limited resources isn't convincing enough....this regime doesn't really care about BPA. As you said, it can go bad as well....S. Thomas, Pettis....but at least they are putting their own stamp on the draft instead of just taking the best player when it's your turn.

As for a better scenario had we selected Lamb, I guess if they went with Blacklock at 31st it would be considered an even haul. I'm not sure because Aiyuk is very much a Shanahan-type of receiver, and to get Kinlaw as well, whom was one of my three favourites that SF could consider a possibility at 13.....I think they really did themselves well on Day 1.

A silver lining with Lynch and Shanahan is that they have added some really solid players in Rounds 5 and lower - Kittle, Greenlaw, DJ Jones, Julian Taylor....so hopefully they add a corner/OL tomorrow.

 

[Niner Outlaw]

As for a better scenario had we selected Lamb, I guess if they went with Blacklock at 31st it would be considered an even haul. I'm not sure because Aiyuk is very much a Shanahan-type of receiver, and to get Kinlaw as well, whom was one of my three favourites that SF could consider a possibility at 13.....I think they really did themselves well on Day 1.

A silver lining with Lynch and Shanahan is that they have added some really solid players in Rounds 5 and lower - Kittle, Greenlaw, DJ Jones, Julian Taylor....so hopefully they add a corner/OL tomorrow.

Good point on Lamb/Blacklock. That would've been about an even trade. Lamb the better WR, but Kinlaw the better DT.

I've got some old grad school friends in SC and they flipped the hell out when the Niners took Kinlaw. When healthy, they see him as Aaron Donald (crazy talk). They LOVE the guy and told me that it'll be a shock if he isn't at least an above average player, assuming he can stay healthy (...shit). Other than his health, he tended to disappear at times, so they wondered whether he was fighting a small injury or was his motor not up to the task. They raved about how he played against Alabama and UGA, who have GREAT offensive lines. So, that made me feel a little better about the pick.

As for the later rounds, who knows? Most of them never work out, but like you said, the FO has found a few gems there over the last few years. Both this and previous FOs managed to mine out a few later rounders that turned out to be serviceable, ok, or better, by finding the best players on tiny teams (Person was the LT for Montana), under-utilized players on bad teams (Kittle), and the best athletes on really bad Div. I teams (Greenlaw at Arkansas). I have some faith we'll track down a player in these later rounds.

 

[deep9er]

It's clear that the Niners FO wanted THEIR guys. That can go really well, or it can go really badly (ala Pettis).

I loved the move back of one spot. We got a 4th for free. Good move.

Surprised we passed on Lamb and Jeudy. Very surprised. WR is a desperate need (and seems to be every year). With the DL being rather deep, I was surprised that we took a DT at 14. If we're gonna go with DT in rd 1, it's tough to argue with Kinlaw, as he was the best interior DL still on the board. His knees worry me, since we've already got 2 injury-prone starters on the DL (Armstead and Ford).

We moved up from 31, using the 4th we just acquired and a 5th. So, we basically only paid a 5th to move up a half dozen spots in rd 1--great value.

Since was passed on a WR at 14, and all the good CBs and OTs were gone, it was practically a lock that we were gonna go WR with the move up. Aiyuk was one of the better options left, but I figured we'd go for the Clemson guy. Still, this ASU product seems a lot like Deebo last year--not prototype tall, but long armed, tough, and good run after catch. With the way the FO missed on Pettis, they really need that to work.

From here, we've got nothing left until Day 3 b/c I don't see anyone giving us a day 2 pick for Goodwin and Breida.

Overall, it's good to see that we filled 2 of our biggest holes. It woud've been nice to get a CB and a OT, but with as few picks as we had, we did pretty well. Honestly, is Kinlaw/Aiyuk better or worse than Lamb/PlayerX? I'm not sure, but I'm not really disappointed. I think had we gone with Lamb at 14, we'd have moved down (or tried to, as there were a lot of teams not wanting to move from early Rd 2).

Yep, every pick that goes bad hurts. No team can get every pick right but you'd think the Round 1 and 2 picks would contribute more than what Pettis has. Other higher picks that missed include Thomas and Foster.

While i don't expect all 3rd and 4th round picks to hit either, do think we should hit 2 of 3 IMO. 'Hit' also includes making the team and contribute whether ST's, back-up, or role. Fred Warner panning out extra well is gravy. So far we seem to be ok at this level assuming Jalen Hurd plays to his 3rd round.

 

[deep9er]

Yup....if the move up to get Aiyuk with limited resources isn't convincing enough....this regime doesn't really care about BPA. As you said, it can go bad as well....S. Thomas, Pettis....but at least they are putting their own stamp on the draft instead of just taking the best player when it's your turn.

As for a better scenario had we selected Lamb, I guess if they went with Blacklock at 31st it would be considered an even haul. I'm not sure because Aiyuk is very much a Shanahan-type of receiver, and to get Kinlaw as well, whom was one of my three favourites that SF could consider a possibility at 13.....I think they really did themselves well on Day 1.

A silver lining with Lynch and Shanahan is that they have added some really solid players in Rounds 5 and lower - Kittle, Greenlaw, DJ Jones, Julian Taylor....so hopefully they add a corner/OL tomorrow.

What is the difference between BPA and "Their guys"?

You're implying 'Their Guys' are not the best talent on the board? So i'd better make sure i get what this means?

 

[Ricky Roma]

Good point on Lamb/Blacklock. That would've been about an even trade. Lamb the better WR, but Kinlaw the better DT.

I've got some old grad school friends in SC and they flipped the hell out when the Niners took Kinlaw. When healthy, they see him as Aaron Donald (crazy talk). They LOVE the guy and told me that it'll be a shock if he isn't at least an above average player, assuming he can stay healthy (...shit). Other than his health, he tended to disappear at times, so they wondered whether he was fighting a small injury or was his motor not up to the task. They raved about how he played against Alabama and UGA, who have GREAT offensive lines. So, that made me feel a little better about the pick.

As for the later rounds, who knows? Most of them never work out, but like you said, the FO has found a few gems there over the last few years. Both this and previous FOs managed to mine out a few later rounders that turned out to be serviceable, ok, or better, by finding the best players on tiny teams (Person was the LT for Montana), under-utilized players on bad teams (Kittle), and the best athletes on really bad Div. I teams (Greenlaw at Arkansas). I have some faith we'll track down a player in these later rounds.

That's basically everything I've read about Kinlaw - he doesn't go full out every play/nicks and bruises/excelled against elite competition.

The Aaron Donald comparison is not a good one IMO.....he's much taller and raw right now, whereas Donald was fairly polished....the best comparison I've read is the Chiefs' Chris Jones. In college, he was asked to do a lot of two-gapping, but I think in Kocurek's scheme, he could turn out to be a super player. If he developes technique and varying moves, and decides to kick ass on every play, he'll be wrecking games.

 

[Niner Outlaw]

Yep, every pick that goes bad hurts. No team can get every pick right but you'd think the Round 1 and 2 picks would contribute more than what Pettis has. Other higher picks that missed include Thomas and Foster.

While i don't expect all 3rd and 4th round picks to hit either, do think we should hit 2 of 3 IMO. 'Hit' also includes making the team and contribute whether ST's, back-up, or role. Fred Warner panning out extra well is gravy. So far we seem to be ok at this level assuming Jalen Hurd plays to his 3rd round.

I think there is a BIG difference between a pick not working out and "your guy" not working out. The "your guy" thing tends to blind a FO and costs a lot more than a missed pick when it involves a move up to get "your guy.". That is what happened with Pettis and Joe Williams and Beathard (all rightly criticized at the time) and Ronald Johnson and K.Balmer in previous regimes.

The Williams thing is a great example of how the "our guy" problem creates a ripple of problems beyond the "it didn't work out" issue. We literally traded back-then-up to take Williams, when we knew that the Saints were taking Kamara with the pick we traded back from. When Williams washed out of the NFL after a year or so, "our guy" at RB became the free agent, McKinnon, where we got into a bidding war at the most disposable position in football and ended up overpaying for a guy that had never stayed healthy in his life.

That is why guys like T.Moore and Hurd are big question marks, as is Aiyuk. Goodness knows that we need at least 1 of them to eventually become a decent starter, but if we had a choice, it needs to be Aiyuk.

 

[Ricky Roma]

What is the difference between BPA and "Their guys"?

You're implying 'Their Guys' are not the best talent on the board? So i'd better make sure i get what this means?

Guys that fit their scheme. A perfect example was Cowboy for a 49ers fan. As a Bengal, he was a solid 4-3 defensive end....but his career totally took off as a 3-4 Tackle with the 49ers. That example is blatantly obvious, but most are more subtle. A lot of teams will try and force round pegs into square holes - Lynch and Shanahan get guys specifically suited for their program.

 

[deep9er]

Guys that fit their scheme. A perfect example was Cowboy for a 49ers fan. As a Bengal, he was a solid 4-3 defensive end....but his career totally took off as a 3-4 Tackle with the 49ers. That example is blatantly obvious, but most are more subtle. A lot of teams will try and force round pegs into square holes - Lynch and Shanahan get guys specifically suited for their program.

Ok

No NFL team goes by what the national polls say, every NFL team will evaluate prospects that fit their own schemes. Yes, you might cite a few examples where they thought "versatility", and made a mistake. But ALL prospects are selected for a team's specific schemes, how else do you do it?

So when i read "their guys", i'm wondering why is this different for Lynch and Shannahan? To me it isn't different and why i'm not getting your posts. Of course they'll say afterward why they really liked these guys, and it had better be because they fit our schemes. Every GM of every team will say it.

Anyway, mixing together "their guy" and BPA is wrong from the start. The other extreme for BPA is Need. "their guy" is only one factor in determining your team's BPA.

 

[Pattersonca65]

Guys that fit their scheme. A perfect example was Cowboy for a 49ers fan. As a Bengal, he was a solid 4-3 defensive end....but his career totally took off as a 3-4 Tackle with the 49ers. That example is blatantly obvious, but most are more subtle. A lot of teams will try and force round pegs into square holes - Lynch and Shanahan get guys specifically suited for their program.

Trent Baalke says hello

 

[Pattersonca65]

I am okay with the picks. I wasn't thrilled with trading up to No 25 and giving up the 4th rounder the team acquired earlier.

 

[deep9er]

Trent Baalke says hello

I think Baalke's worse trait was continuing to draft ACL players. His picks weren't THAT bad (minus AJ Jenkins) if you go back in time. Of course NOW we all dislike the picks.

I was beginning to think Shannahan was "over exerting" his influence on offensive players, ie drafting them too early? CJ Beathard, Joe Williams, and Dante Pettis. With Brandon Aiyuk it appears Lynch was very on board too so not counting him.

 

[deep9er]

I am okay with the picks. I wasn't thrilled with trading up to No 25 and giving up the 4th rounder the team acquired earlier.

This is the only issue i have too.

That said did read an article saying Miami was going to draft Aiyuk? But since the 49er's got him, they moved back and picked another position.

 

[poewelch84]

This is the only issue i have too.

That said did read an article saying Miami was going to draft Aiyuk? But since the 49er's got him, they moved back and picked another position.

I suspect he would not have lasted that long Miami does need WR help. I think we all believed they were likely only filling two of the three biggest holes in DT, WR, and CB.

 

[Montalban]

George Kittle, Fred Warner, Mike McGlinchey, Joe Staley, and Richard Sherman just to name a few on the 49ers roster that played College ball as a senior. So yeah that idea is completely false and foolish.

Don't be a fool. Only one of those guys was as high as a top 15 first round pick. if you are going to try to be cute, at least know what you are talking abut. Otherwise you just look foolish.

 

[Montalban]

Weel, the 49ers are nothing if not consistent with their draft pickes. They continue to select injured players. Aiyuk just came off surgery for a core injury and kinlaw's knee was so bad he couldn't participate in the Combine in February.

 

[poewelch84]

Don't be a fool. Only one of those guys was as high as a top 15 first round pick. if you are going to try to be cute, at least know what you are talking abut. Otherwise you just look foolish.

Staley and McGlinchey were first round picks but what you posted was that if he was any good he wouldn't have been a senior playing college football. Now to justify your bipolar irrational thinking the person has to be a top 15 first round pick. I'm going to have faith in people with more knowledge than either of us on his talent level.

 

[Pattersonca65]

I think Baalke's worse trait was continuing to draft ACL players. His picks weren't THAT bad (minus AJ Jenkins) if you go back in time. Of course NOW we all dislike the picks.

I was beginning to think Shannahan was "over exerting" his influence on offensive players, ie drafting them too early? CJ Beathard, Joe Williams, and Dante Pettis. With Brandon Aiyuk it appears Lynch was very on board too so not counting him.

I think the ACL was a bit overblown. Most came back but just weren't good players. Baalkes record overall when drafting wasnt better than the ACLs.

 

[Pattersonca65]

This is the only issue i have too.

That said did read an article saying Miami was going to draft Aiyuk? But since the 49er's got him, they moved back and picked another position.

Didnt here that. Wonder how much truth there really was to that

 

[RobertPhD01]

?Rumour Trent Williams LT trade?