MBBRL C league??

[leftypower]

I guess what I am most frustrated with is that some of you guys think things have to be done a certain way because that is how they have been done in the past. The MBBRL is a great league, but it can be even better. Failure to adapt can make things stale.

I want to compete against the best of the best. Adding more people makes us stronger. The unworthy owners will never make it up to the A league.

It's not often that we disagree, but on this point we do. I do not think that 'more' is necessarily good or better. Do we miss out on some potentially, fine forthright players, sure, but I think that needs to be proven first. I personally know very little about any of the guys up for nomination, so I will not be endorsing or campaigning one way or the other.
As I stated early on, there is absolutely no reason another ten, 20 or 50 guys for that matter cannot create a splinter league. They only have take the initiative to do so. ...

 

[Trudem]

It's not often that we disagree, but on this point we do. I do not think that 'more' is necessarily good or better. Do we miss out on some potentially, fine forthright players, sure, but I think that needs to be proven first. I personally know very little about any of the guys up for nomination, so I will not be endorsing or campaigning one way or the other.
As I stated early on, there is absolutely no reason another ten, 20 or 50 guys for that matter cannot create a splinter league. They only have take the initiative to do so. ...

This is what I am leaning towards.

1. It will show their interest
2. It will give them a chance to show their stuff
3. It will give the MBBRL leagues a pool of hopefully quality managers to pull from to replace those in oblivion.

I am with Lefty on this one. However I do approve of several of the names that were listed as possibilities. Both through quality posting and other MBBRL folks vouching for them.

 

[bksballer89]

I'm still torn. Some good points are being made for both sides.

 

[TREFF]

I honestly don't get this at all. Does not make sense.

If not for you all be willing to "degrade" and "dilute" your precious league 5 years ago, I would not be here. Most of the great competitors currently in the league today were originally brought on through and because of the B league. You don't need 12 people to make it viable.

Also, I will never vote against a current member of the 24 unless they are in the bottom 2 on a regular basis or if they have been inactive. I know others feel the same. So Treff, if you want somebody out, then no more beating around the bush. If you have an issue with somebody, then you need to specifically state your case against. Otherwise it ain't happening.

Guys like @ehb5 and @femurov and @richig07 and @DUB should be in. All of them. Like I said before, it does not hurt to give a couple others a chance. @Barilko was a complete unkown when he joined. You guys are assuming the worst in people. We have 4 great candidates, 3 good ones and a few unknowns.

Guess what? Some of the unknowns will be Barilkos. Some will be busts. The busts get replaced.

I think C should be a go, but with one modification:

ALL C league owners not advancing to B can be replaced or "cast to oblivion" if not meeting the posting/competition standards.

Lastly, C league does not have to mirror A and B. Take away the point. Comparison element and it does not matter. Call the C league MBBRL minors. Make it 8 teams if that is all we have. Top 2 automatically move up, bottom 2 B leaguers move down. In time, if C grows to 12 people we can use the same rules as we have in A and B.

I have no issues, wanting anyone specific out. However, I do want the league to operate under rules we have in place, I don't want anyone to forget or simply brush aside the simple truths that with the 24 we have, there have been issues none of us ever thought would be a problem. Not do I want it simply overlooked that adding another 12 ontop of that isn't begging for more. We're trying to weed that out, not invite it in, regardless how badly I'd love for everyone who we know is worthy, to get a spot. I'm not willing to risk this turning into a league where people are bitching about the way someone else is our isn't running their team just so everyone gets to have a place, even though, just like you, I'd love for all the nominees to get in and Micro, and Stomp to stick around. That's not what we have set up, and given what's already happened, the potential for it to get worse and ruin everything for all of us, is greater than I care to risk

 

[tlance]

Last thing I will say for now:

Another reason why I am so taken aback by such negative sentiments toward exapnsion is that we have been here before.

When we first moved over to SportsHoopla, it was not easy establishing the BATG league. There was nowhere close to 12 definite candidates to make it happen, but we took some chances and moved on anyway. Clearly, it worked out for the best because the league is as strong as ever. Not everyone fit in and those that didn't were weeded out. Heck, when the BATG league was formed on in CBS, there were 2 drone teams just to make it work.

I think right now we are in a very similar place as to where we were at that time. I can confidently say that had we chosen to move forward without a B league, it would have been a huge mistake. This is essentially the same situation.

I would love to hear @wilwhite weigh in in this, but I believe he would be in favor of expansion. It is consistent with the ideal and upon which MBBRL was originally formed. We have never been, nor should be an exclusive club. I fear some of the loudest voices in here are trying to make it that.

 

[TREFF]

Last thing I will say for now:

Another reason why I am so taken aback by such negative sentiments toward exapnsion is that we have been here before.

When we first moved over to SportsHoopla, it was not easy establishing the BATG league. There was nowhere close to 12 definite candidates to make it happen, but we took some chances and moved on anyway. Clearly, it worked out for the best because the league is as strong as ever. Not everyone fit in and those that didn't were weeded out. Heck, when the BATG league was formed on in CBS, there were 2 drone teams just to make it work.

I think right now we are in a very similar place as to where we were at that time. I can confidently say that had we chosen to move forward without a B league, it would have been a huge mistake. This is essentially the same situation.

I would love to hear @wilwhite weigh in in this, but I believe he would be in favor of expansion. It is consistent with the ideal and upon which MBBRL was originally formed. We have never been, nor should be an exclusive club. I fear some of the loudest voices in here are trying to make it that.

Actually having requirements for membership, nominations and a voting process to get in is the definition of an exclusive club, and it's what we've always had. Sorry but that literally makes no sense

 

[TKOSpikes]

I am all for a C league.

However, there are obstacles that we cannot dismiss.

1. Having anything other than the exact same league is not something I would ever consider. An 8 team league? It's just way too different to apply any "movin' up, movin' down" criteria. So I don't see the point of how it is connected. I know I want no part of an 8 team league should I have two terrible seasons in a row.

2. We would have to get 11 or 12 absolutes.... not, okay sure I'll join. (creep's interest is what I would be looking for in ALL new members)

3. If by chance, we do have one or two or four owners that just don't feel the MBBRL, or do not keep up with the standards, then we are in for a mess each new season trying to find more. I don't think we should be finding more... I think inquiring minds would be here already. I'd much rather have a tough vote on oblivian, than needing to open it up to anyone who feels like it that year.



As I've said, if there were inquiring owners already, who have my undoubted confidence, there wouldn't be a problem.

DUB (if he stays this time), ehb, femurov and molsan are of that requirement. DUB, an original; ehb and femur part of our Dynasty D2; molsan an already great competitor in MBBRL Baseball... And creep is showing the interest needed. Good.
That's five.... Bad.


For that reason I have voted no.

But I would absolutely change that if 11 or 12 owners consistently put in the effort to inquire, show interest, and show "respect" to the league. (I don't mean that in a prissy kind of way)... so that leaves 6 at least.

The others nominated would have to show that. Richig, hasn't replied to his nomination tag as of yet (I don't think), and I realize the others mentioned have not received a tag....


The reason I think a lot of us are on the fence is because we have a returnee, and two D2 nominees... of course all of us want those three involved. Molsan is known by us baseballers and would be a great addition.... and we hate casting off members to "oblivian".


It's tough for sure.

 

[Trudem]

I am all for a C league.

However, there are obstacles that we cannot dismiss.

1. Having anything other than the exact same league is not something I would ever consider. An 8 team league? It's just way too different to apply any "movin' up, movin' down" criteria. So I don't see the point of how it is connected. I know I want no part of an 8 team league should I have two terrible seasons in a row.

2. We would have to get 11 or 12 absolutes.... not, okay sure I'll join. (creep's interest is what I would be looking for in ALL new members)

3. If by chance, we do have one or two or four owners that just don't feel the MBBRL, or do not keep up with the standards, then we are in for a mess each new season trying to find more. I don't think we should be finding more... I think inquiring minds would be here already. I'd much rather have a tough vote on oblivian, than needing to open it up to anyone who feels like it that year.



As I've said, if there were inquiring owners already, who have my undoubted confidence, there wouldn't be a problem.

DUB (if he stays this time), ehb, femurov and molsan are of that requirement. DUB, an original; ehb and femur part of our Dynasty D2; molsan an already great competitor in MBBRL Baseball... And creep is showing the interest needed. Good.
That's five.... Bad.


For that reason I have voted no.

But I would absolutely change that if 11 or 12 owners consistently put in the effort to inquire, show interest, and show "respect" to the league. (I don't mean that in a prissy kind of way)... so that leaves 6 at least.

The others nominated would have to show that. Richig, hasn't replied to his nomination tag as of yet (I don't think), and I realize the others mentioned have not received a tag....


The reason I think a lot of us are on the fence is because we have a returnee, and two D2 nominees... of course all of us want those three involved. Molsan is known by us baseballers and would be a great addition.... and we hate casting off members to "oblivian".


It's tough for sure.

This is why I would support a stand alone league for the new guys to continue to show their interest for the two on the bottom of the B league for the next season. Also if two B leagues do go into oblivion this would give them a place to play and still be part of the community and fight to stay active and come back with a vengeance the next year!

 

[SteelersPride]

Well, I'll just say this - there are currently 4 people on my ignore list - he is one. So, I think it pretty clear where I stand on him.

i hope u know i'm 100% kidding

 

[SteelersPride]

times aren't great, it's the holidays, i need a laugh, and this new iphone 7 plus

 

[MilkSpiller22]

i hope u know i'm 100% kidding

Is it truly a 100% joke, or is there like 10% of seriousness??

 

[TKOSpikes]

times aren't great, it's the holidays, i need a laugh, and this new iphone 7 plus

Shoveled my driveway the other day... pretty wide. Have a new (year old) Jeep, and the wife has a car she takes to work, but doesn't use other than that.

The car is usually on the road in front of the house (I live in a Cul de sac). But had to put it in the driveway as to not block the plow which would come by a some point.

So, after shoveling, I moved the car right up against the grass in my front yard to leave enough room for me to back the jeep out.

Five seconds after moving the car to the side, out of the way... I jump in the jeep, and like I hadn't done anything in the past 10 seconds, pop 'er in reverse, let 'er go and ..................WHAM!

Backed right into the damn thing. Not much damage to the jeep, a little dent and cracked reverse light. The car? Smashed the driver side head light, and cracked all around the fender and front bumper.

Merry Christmas to me!

 

[Trudem]

Shoveled my driveway the other day... pretty wide. Have a new (year old) Jeep, and the wife has a car she takes to work, but doesn't use other than that.

The car is usually on the road in front of the house (I live in a Cul de sac). But had to put it in the driveway as to not block the plow which would come by a some point.

So, after shoveling, I moved the car right up against the grass in my front yard to leave enough room for me to back the jeep out.

Five seconds after moving the car to the side, out of the way... I jump in the jeep, and like I hadn't done anything in the past 10 seconds, pop 'er in reverse, let 'er go and ..................WHAM!

Backed right into the damn thing. Not much damage to the jeep, a little dent and cracked reverse light. The car? Smashed the driver side head light, and cracked all around the fender and front bumper.

Merry Christmas to me!

sorry man that sucks. Did you just misjudge the angle or something?

 

[MilkSpiller22]

I feel like we are making an issue out of something that may not even be necessary... do we have a clue how many owners are interested... It seems like we have only 5 Great nominees... even in a minor league league, not sure if 5 is enough especially if at least one of them replaces a B' member...

I mean, I can definitely make the rules to make a FUN 5 team league... certainly wont be close to the MBBRL rules...

I really think we are fixated on the tradition of this league... the tradition would be shit if we didn't find great owners... I mean lets face it, this league is as standard as can be, it is not the league that makes this league so good...

It is the work bandit does with his breakdowns, the work chef/TKO/obxyankee do with their recaps, the work Treff does as commish... and the active board...


take that away, and we have a vanilla league... and that is not a complaint, even Treff called it that in his explanation of the league to the potential new comers...

 

[TKOSpikes]

sorry man that sucks. Did you just misjudge the angle or something?

Nope... just a total and absolute brain fart. (was taking my daughter's friend home, and just spazzed out I guess, while in conversation with her)

 

[Trudem]

Nope... just a total and absolute brain fart. (was taking my daughter's friend home, and just spazzed out I guess, while in conversation with her)

Stop hitting on the young ladies

In all seriousness that sucks man I am sorry to hear that. Not that there is any good time for that but the holidays make it that much worse.

 

[TKOSpikes]

I feel like we are making an issue out of something that may not even be necessary... do we have a clue how many owners are interested... It seems like we have only 5 Great nominees... even in a minor league league, not sure if 5 is enough especially if at least one of them replaces a B' member...

I mean, I can definitely make the rules to make a FUN 5 team league... certainly wont be close to the MBBRL rules...

I really think we are fixated on the tradition of this league... the tradition would be shit if we didn't find great owners... I mean lets face it, this league is as standard as can be, it is not the league that makes this league so good...

It is the work bandit does with his breakdowns, the work chef/TKO/obxyankee do with their recaps, the work Treff does as commish... and the active board...


take that away, and we have a vanilla league... and that is not a complaint, even Treff called it that in his explanation of the league to the potential new comers...

yeah, my point exactly.

If we had 12 owners begging to get in... no problem.

 

[TKOSpikes]

Stop hitting on the young ladies

In all seriousness that sucks man I am sorry to hear that. Not that there is any good time for that but the holidays make it that much worse.

Actually, I was just trying to make @SteelersPride laugh. A few hundred bucks down the drain... oh well. Nobody was hurt and I won't have to go through insurance, so it's all good.

 

[leftypower]

I'm going to throw a couple of more thing out there and I promise this is really the last time. ....

1. One MAJOR aspect of expansion that has yet to come up is the added burden it creates on @TREFF and @canesandfinsfanatic. They both spend a lot of time keeping stats, writing up recaps, defining senarios, etc. And additionally, for Treff fielding and acting on issues that come up (and there have been some I know of this year).
Since they both voted NO, I have to think that perhaps subconsciously (or maybe consciously) they see the added burden. We may find ourselves without their willingness to devote even more time to keep up with yet another league. ....

2. Along the same line, the point has been made that there is absolutely nothing stopping a splinter group from starting their own loosely affiliated (or totally separate) league - if MBBRL members wish to compete in that league there is nothing preventing them from being in both.

 

[Sam Sportboy]

I'm going to throw a couple of more thing out there and I promise this is really the last time. ....

1. One MAJOR aspect of expansion that has yet to come up is the added burden it creates on @TREFF and @canesandfinsfanatic. QUOTE]

QUOTE]

.[/

Believe it or not, I actually took that into consideration when I changed my vote. Look, TKO makes a great point as to where there are only 5 nominees at the moment. I guess if we had more there would be a better argument for expansion. Bottom line is this is the best league I play in by far (some of the teams I have posted along with some of yoose guys will prove that point) and I want it to stay that way. Last thing, just think about how far we have come and how many new owners we have let in over the last (4) years? How many of us still here were part of the original 12? Oh, and I see @wilwhite is checking in on this thread right now! Let's hear yer opinion Will