Magic Johnson says lebron is the best player he has seen

[handicappers]

 

[True Lakers Fan]

I would love to see that actual quote in which you claim Magic Johnson called Lebron the best player he's ever seen because I have a feeling @lebron23james is a flat out liar. I have seen the quote and what Magic has said

Is Ben Simons is the all around player since Lebron James came out of High School and went straight to college. Then in following up, yes, He says Lebron is the best all around player to come into the NBA in recent times. Pretty sure Magic never said or indicated that Lebron was the best ever all around player to enter the NBA, because Magic is not stupid, and that is far cry from calling Lebron the best player ever in the NBA because again Magic Johnson isn't stupid enough to say something that ignorant.

Not withstanding, it's a bold statement and ignorant to call any player the GOAT because there are so many circumstances that go into a player winning or losing, but If I was going to give that title to any one, it would be Michael Jordan and even players like Dirk Nowitizki is calling Kobe Bryant the Michael Jordan of our generation. Sorry, but without three more titles, Little Lebron just won't ever be considered the Michael Jordan of our generation which might not sound fair, but it is life. It's a fantastic feat to take your team straight to the finals four years or five years straight, but there is that losing record in the finals that stands out like a sore thumb.

It's always interesting to see what these kids like Lebron23James calls players like Lebron, because they did the same thing over a decade ago about Kobe, but it's important to remember that being in the right time and place often makes a player the winner and his talent isn't always necessarily the best of all time.

 

[True Lakers Fan]

I knew i would win the internet eventually

Congratulations, you have just won...What again?

 

[BoiseMike19]

I am actually enjoying you embarrass yourself, it was rather easy

The one question about Lebron you haven't addressed yet....Do you fap to pictures of him in uniform or have you dug up some nude shit on the interwebs?

Get a grip of something aside our peter for God's sake.

 

[ChrisGar15]

I would love to see that actual quote in which you claim Magic Johnson called Lebron the best player he's ever seen because I have a feeling @lebron23james is a flat out liar. I have seen the quote and what Magic has said

...

On youtube someplace, there are videos of Magic playing in high school. I looked it up because Magic played some HS all-star games with a guy that I played with in high school.

It is kind of funny to watch. Magic was great ... but he couldn't dribble with his left hand. Obviously he picked it up in next couple of years at MSU.

 

[True Lakers Fan]

Byron Scott said this about Kobe:

He's probably as close to MJ as they come -- at least as we're probably going to see in our lifetime," Lakers coach Byron Scott said before the game. "If you look at a picture of MJ in his later years and you look at a picture of Kobe, it's kind of eerie how similar it is and how close it is, not only from a basketball standpoint but the way he thinks about the game, the way he approaches the game, and his killer instinct.

"I haven't seen anybody since MJ take on that type of feeling when he's in the game as Kobe has. He's about as close as you can come."

Bryant said words couldn't do justice to the influence Jordan had on him.

"Because as a kid growing up in Italy, all I had was video, so I studied everything," Bryant said. "I studied every player. Then once I came back to the States, [and] I realized I wasn't going to be 6-9, I started studying Michael exclusively.

 

[ChrisGar15]

Byron Scott said this about Kobe:

He's probably as close to MJ as they come -- at least as we're probably going to see in our lifetime," Lakers coach Byron Scott said ...

One interesting stat they showed yesterday is the MJ averaged 20 ppg while shooting 45% when he was 40.

Kobe is 37 ... and his fg% is about 35%.

 

[R.J. MacReady]

Why OP? Why are you so desperate to validate LeBron as the greatest ever?

I really don't get it.

It's very common that when we see someone trying very hard to convince others of an opinion, it's stems
from them not quite believing their own opinion.

It turns out the entire exercise is to convince themselves.

 

[True Lakers Fan]

One interesting stat they showed yesterday is the MJ averaged 20 ppg while shooting 45% when he was 40.

Kobe is 37 ... and his fg% is about 35%.

That was because the players on Kobe's teams deferred to Kobe way to much because unlike the MJ teams, they were not loaded with talent. MJ was fortunate

 

[True Lakers Fan]

It's very common that when we see someone trying very hard to convince others of an opinion, it's stems
from them not quite believing their own opinion.

It turns out the entire exercise is to convince themselves.

It really seems so stupid though because in almost every game this year there is always a few players, coaches and even Kobe's worst enemies calling him one the best players of all time since Michael Jordan. I don't know what Magic Johnson actually said or what context he said it, but I am sure that the op of this thread lied about it and is clueless as usual

 

[ChrisGar15]

That was because the players on Kobe's teams deferred to Kobe way to much because unlike the MJ teams, they were not loaded with talent. MJ was fortunate

Watching Clarkson & Randle yesterday -- I didn't see any indication of "deferring". Almost every time either of them touched the ball in the half court they weren't going to give it up -- they knew they wouldn't be getting it back.

In particular, Clarkson on one play waved his arms then showed frustration when we didn't get it.

Remember the stats last year about Nick Young never getting an assist to Kobe -- even though they had been on the court together for 287 minutes ? FYI -- he did get an assist to Kobe in December -- first one in 450 minutes of being on the court together. It isn't just Swaggy P -- I don't know if any records it -- it would be interesting to see the number of passes from other players to Kobe in the half court game. (rebound outlet shouldn't count)

If the players were really deferring to Kobe -- they would be getting more assists when they pass it to Kobe and he makes it. (they are last in the NBA on assists ... for a reason)

 

[True Lakers Fan]

Watching Clarkson & Randle yesterday -- I didn't see any indication of "deferring". Almost every time either of them touched the ball in the half court they weren't going to give it up -- they knew they wouldn't be getting it back.

In particular, Clarkson on one play waved his arms then showed frustration when we didn't get it.

Remember the stats last year about Nick Young never getting an assist to Kobe -- even though they had been on the court together for 287 minutes ? FYI -- he did get an assist to Kobe in December -- first one in 450 minutes of being on the court together. It isn't just Swaggy P -- I don't know if any records it -- it would be interesting to see the number of passes from other players to Kobe in the half court game. (rebound outlet shouldn't count)

If the players were really deferring to Kobe -- they would be getting more assists when they pass it to Kobe and he makes it. (they are last in the NBA on assists ... for a reason)

No - Kobe this year has taken a back seat to the new kids learning very nicely and has been a good senior in trying to teach them. In the past, however when wins matter and counted, the others deferred to Kobe way to much. Here is the thing though:

You can to defend your precious Little Lebron and spin it as him being the goat, but only the losers in here agree with you. You cannot find a direct quote by Magic calling Lebron better then Kobe. Kobe has clearly been called the goat by every one this year since MJ. Now if you want to wait til Lebron's career is finished, perhaps your argument holds up. I am going to bet, however that doesn't happen because I don't see Lebron getting three more championships and 5 championships is better than two

 

[ChrisGar15]

No - Kobe this year has taken a back seat to the new kids learning very nicely and has been a good senior in trying to teach them. In the past, however when wins matter and counted, the others deferred to Kobe way to much. Here is the thing though:

You can to defend your precious Little Lebron and spin it as him being the goat, but only the losers in here agree with you. You cannot find a direct quote by Magic calling Lebron better then Kobe. Kobe has clearly been called the goat by every one this year since MJ. Now if you want to wait til Lebron's career is finished, perhaps your argument holds up. I am going to bet, however that doesn't happen because I don't see Lebron getting three more championships and 5 championships is better than two

This is an odd comment ... I have said nothing about Kobe vs. Lebron.

 

[True Lakers Fan]

This is an odd comment ... I have said nothing about Kobe vs. Lebron.

This is true, but you have come to the defense of Lebron by attacking Kobe's record in an indirect way to support what's his name Lebron23 or whatever. Just saying - that's how you come across.

 

[trojanfan12]

If the players were really deferring to Kobe -- they would be getting more assists when they pass it to Kobe and he makes it. (they are last in the NBA on assists ... for a reason)

2 things:

1.) They are deferring to Kobe by passing to him. When they pass him the ball, it's an iso situation and Kobe dribbles around to find a shot or backs a guy down so he can shoot the fade away, that's not an assist. So, the player could pass him the ball, he could score and it still may not be an assist.

2.) Teams with a core group as young as the Lakers, often struggle with assists. They have all been "the man" on every team they've played on until they get to the NBA. When things aren't going well, they have a tendency to revert to what has always worked in the past...them with the ball and looking to score.

 

[ChrisGar15]

2 things:

1.) They are deferring to Kobe by passing to him. When they pass him the ball, it's an iso situation and Kobe dribbles around to find a shot or backs a guy down so he can shoot the fade away, that's not an assist. So, the player could pass him the ball, he could score and it still may not be an assist.

2.) Teams with a core group as young as the Lakers, often struggle with assists. They have all been "the man" on every team they've played on until they get to the NBA. When things aren't going well, they have a tendency to revert to what has always worked in the past...them with the ball and looking to score.

I agree that Kobe has been mentoring & teaching the young guys on the Lakers. Next year, they need a coach that will teach them that team ball is more important than personal stats. This year, watch how Randle & Clarkson's eye light up when they touch the ball ... they are going to get their stats! (that's how leaders play!)

Yesterday, the Lakers had 13 total assists. MJ's last year (when he was 40 and shot 45% FG%, 20 ppg) -- his team averaged 26 assists / game. (and had some chuckers like Stackhouse)

Phil Jackson's book "Sacred Hoops" is an interesting read. He talks about how he had to teach MJ to trust his teammates. (Grant, Cartwright, ..) MJ learned that the only way he would win NBA championships is if he really trusted his teammates ... passing them the ball even when there was a good chance they would fail (initially) -- but they would have to be successful for MJ to win (and they would have to believe that Michael actually trusted them). MJ's first 7 years in the league people said stuff like "he gets his points, but he isn't like Bird or Magic -- doesn't make the players around him better". (hard to believe now)

Do you really think Kobe is teaching Russell, Clarkson, Randall, Nance ... how to "play the right way" ? (or is it all about Kobe still ?)

 

[trojanfan12]

I agree that Kobe has been mentoring & teaching the young guys on the Lakers. Next year, they need a coach that will teach them that team ball is more important than personal stats. This year, watch how Randle & Clarkson's eye light up when they touch the ball ... they are going to get their stats! (that's how leaders play!)

I agree they need to be taught about team ball. But it's because they are young and don't know how to play in the NBA. It takes time. Their core players are 2 rookies, a 2nd year player who played all of 12 minutes in his first season and a 2nd year player. They are still at a point where they revert back to the hero ball that has served them well at lower levels. It's largely why they are playing teams a lot closer than they were earlier in the season, but still losing. They are learning how to stay in the game or come back from deficits, but they don't know how to close games out.

Yesterday, the Lakers had 13 total assists. MJ's last year (when he was 40 and shot 45% FG%, 20 ppg) -- his team averaged 26 assists / game. (and had some chuckers like Stackhouse)

That teams core wasn't as young as the Lakers. It's not even a comparison. Again, young teams struggle with assists.

Do you really think Kobe is teaching Russell, Clarkson, Randall, Nance ... how to "play the right way" ? (or is it all about Kobe still ?)

Yes, I do. Kobe has done more facilitating at times, has told Byron to let the kids go when they were playing well and Byron wanted to put him back in as part of the regular rotation. He takes time to work with the young guys during practice and games. Late in the game, if the Lakers have a chance to win and Kobe is in the game, he's going to do what he's always done and try to close it out. That's exactly what MJ did, even after he learned to trust his teammates.

It's funny that you think Kobe has always been "all about Kobe." In NBA history, only one player has amassed over 30,000 points and over 6,000 assists. Care to venture a guess as to who that is?

 

[ChrisGar15]

I agree they need to be taught about team ball. But it's because they are young and don't know how to play in the NBA. It takes time. Their core players are 2 rookies, a 2nd year player who played all of 12 minutes in his first season and a 2nd year player. They are still at a point where they revert back to the hero ball that has served them well at lower levels. It's largely why they are playing teams a lot closer than they were earlier in the season, but still losing. They are learning how to stay in the game or come back from deficits, but they don't know how to close games out.

That teams core wasn't as young as the Lakers. It's not even a comparison. Again, young teams struggle with assists.

Yes, I do. Kobe has done more facilitating at times, has told Byron to let the kids go when they were playing well and Byron wanted to put him back in as part of the regular rotation. He takes time to work with the young guys during practice and games. Late in the game, if the Lakers have a chance to win and Kobe is in the game, he's going to do what he's always done and try to close it out. That's exactly what MJ did, even after he learned to trust his teammates.

It's funny that you think Kobe has always been "all about Kobe." In NBA history, only one player has amassed over 30,000 points and over 6,000 assists. Care to venture a guess as to who that is?

Nice discussion. I like the back & forth and checking shit ... I learn stuff.

I'm not sure about "young teams have less assists". (but I don't have great stats in hand to prove / disprove it) The Lakers are at the bottom of the NBA this year in assists ... the next 6 NBA teams at the bottom are the Raptors, Jazz, Pistons, Heat, Knicks and Pacers. From that list, it doesn't looks like a young team list. (I do really think the Lakers are disfunctional with how they share the ball.)

Nice cheery picking about point & assists. Lebron already leads Kobe in assists (by more than 400 in 7 less years) ... and Lebron will pass Kobe in rebounds in 2 years ... and in points in about 4 years. At that point, will you use these same stats and say Lebron is better ?

FYI -- I have no dog in the Lebron vs. Kobe thing -- I hate debating stuff where there is no way you can prove one or the other. (same as Kobe vs. Tim) I understand why some folks will think Kobe is better.

Can you imagine Lebron if he is 37 and playing with a young team ... do you really think Lebon would be near the bottom of the NBA in passing stats ? (like Kobe is right now ... near bottom of NBA in number of passes / minute played) Lebron is great at getting teammates involved in the offense early in the game like MJ did. Do you really see Kobe doing this ? (I've only seen about 3 Laker games in the last month ... but no way have I ever seen Kobe make an effort to get others involved early in the game. Watch how Lebron "overpasses" often in games. I have NBA League Pass ... feel free to point to a game (or games) and I'll watch it and correct myself if he actually does it like MJ used to do or like Lebron does now. He doesn't have to do it the whole game -- just for at least 2 quarters.)

If your point is Kobe is leading by example and teaching guys by being the alpha dog player -- I understand that. (but also remember there has never been a more alpha dog than MJ ...including at Wizards)

Again I like debates when I learn stuff. (vs. stupid debates like Whiteside/TT & Kobe/TD) I know I could actually be wrong about some of this stuff.

 

[True Lakers Fan]

I agree they need to be taught about team ball. But it's because they are young and don't know how to play in the NBA. It takes time. Their core players are 2 rookies, a 2nd year player who played all of 12 minutes in his first season and a 2nd year player. They are still at a point where they revert back to the hero ball that has served them well at lower levels. It's largely why they are playing teams a lot closer than they were earlier in the season, but still losing. They are learning how to stay in the game or come back from deficits, but they don't know how to close games out.



That teams core wasn't as young as the Lakers. It's not even a comparison. Again, young teams struggle with assists.



Yes, I do. Kobe has done more facilitating at times, has told Byron to let the kids go when they were playing well and Byron wanted to put him back in as part of the regular rotation. He takes time to work with the young guys during practice and games. Late in the game, if the Lakers have a chance to win and Kobe is in the game, he's going to do what he's always done and try to close it out. That's exactly what MJ did, even after he learned to trust his teammates.

It's funny that you think Kobe has always been "all about Kobe." In NBA history, only one player has amassed over 30,000 points and over 6,000 assists. Care to venture a guess as to who that is?

This is where I think Shaq Oneal went wrong in the final years of his career. Instead of trying to be a mentor and leave some one his knowledge, it seems like to me was more interested in finding a team that he could get lucky enough to get one more shot at a championship. I was really disappointed with his attitude and how he finished that last year.

 

[trojanfan12]

er: 10391"]the next 6 NBA teams at the bottom are the Raptors, Jazz, Pistons, Heat, Knicks and Pacers. From that list, it doesn't looks like a young team list. (I do really think the Lakers are disfunctional with how they share the ball.)

The Jazz, Knicks, Raptors and Pistons are pretty young, they aren't as young as the Lakers, but they are young. The Heat have had a ton of injuries, so they are playing with players who aren't used to being on the floor together quite a bit.

Nice cheery picking about point & assists.

How is it cherry picking? You basically said that Kobe doesn't give up the ball and that's what he's teaching the kids. Being the only player in league history to have over 30,000 points and over 6,000 assists is a real stat and was directly related to the discussion.

(I've only seen about 3 Laker games in the last month ... but no way have I ever seen Kobe make an effort to get others involved early in the game.

So, you've watched about 3 Lakers games this year, but know more about what has been going on than someone who has watched every single game. Seems legit.

Also, it doesn't matter what Lebron does or doesn't do at 37. Lebron and Kobe are 2 completely different players. Kobe is more like MJ, Lebron is more like Magic. Kobe is a shooting guard, his job has been to shoot the ball. It's actually in the name of the position he plays.

Don't get me wrong. As a Lakers fan, I know Kobe has shot too much at times. There have been plenty of times I've yelled "Stop shooting Kobe" at my tv. But I've also got to see them win 5 championships with him shooting the ball, so I have no complaints.

If your point is Kobe is leading by example and teaching guys by being the alpha dog player -- I understand that. (but also remember there has never been a more alpha dog than MJ ...including at Wizards)

It's not just about teaching them about being alphas. It's also about teaching them what it takes to get to the level he's been at and also pulling them aside (especially Russell) to teach and talk about what to do in certain situations, what they should have done differently in certain situations, etc. He's been doing so much teaching/coaching that some of the sportstalk guys out here are starting to speculate that he may look to get into coaching. Personally, I don't see him doing that, I doubt he has the patience.

Agree about having an actual basketball discussion.