Looks like LA is a go...

[LongtimeRamsFan42]

Some how I see this going to court.

Oh this was pretty much ALWAYS on track to end up in a courtroom. Too much going on, too many big personalities/egos and too much money at stake for this all to have gone smoothly...

 

[ozarkram]

Stan can move his team to LA. Jerry Jones is right. What remains to be seen is if he will live by the rules and by-laws and vote of the NFL. But if he is set on moving he can.

 

[Battlelyon]

Chargers-Rams franchise swap could be only way out of L.A. maze



As the NFL’s effort to figure out which of three interested teams will get the golden ticket to L.A. (along with the privilege of paying dearly for it through relocation fees), the process is quickly getting uglier, with members of the league’s Los Angeles committee making promises to St. Louis in an effort to keep the Rams there and publicly trashing San Diego in an effort to get the Chargers out.

It’s careening toward a potential free-for-all on January 12 and 13, when the owners get together with the goal of putting at least one team in Los Angeles, possibly two. From that chaos a variety of potential solutions can emerge. One solution that was mentioned on Thursday as an outside-the-box/beyond-the-boundaries-of-sanity suggestion could, surprisingly, gain traction.

Indeed, it ultimately could be the only way out of this mess.

In 1972, Carroll Rosenbloom and Robert Irsay swapped the Colts and the Rams. Ultimately, a swap of the Chargers and the Rams could be the cleanest way out of the league’s sudden L.A. clusterfudge.

As one source with knowledge of the current league dynamics said in response to the possibility of a franchise swap, “It’s not a bad idea.”

Good or bad, it may be the only way to placate everyone involved.

With folks like Panthers owner Jerry Richardson and Texans owner Bob McNair, two of six members of the L.A. committee, campaigning openly for the Chargers to move to L.A. and for the Rams to stay put in St. Louis, giving the Chargers to Stan Kroenke (who would move them to L.A.) and the Rams to Dean Spanos (who would keep them in Missouri) would allow Kroenke to build his own venue in Inglewood, at a site that many believe is better — and more potentially profitable — than the proposed Chargers/Raiders location in Carson.

Making Inglewood even more attractive is talk of Kroenke building new studio space for NFL Network there, which would be available to the league for the right price: Free. And even though the jury remains out on whether FAA concerns regarding an Inglewood stadium would keep the thing from being built, the Carson site has issues, too.

“Most of that site was a former landfill. It’s contaminated land,” Carson mayor Albert Robles acknowledged earlier this year. “There is a strip, about 11 acres, that was never a landfill.” With the total site at 168 acres, the simple math (which is the only math I understand) is that 157 acres was a landfill.

And while Spanos, who will be reluctant to leave Southern California, the numbers quickly will pile up in his favor if he’d trade the Chargers for the Rams.

First, Spanos would incur no relocation fee.

Second, Spanos would surely secure extra money from Kroenke in a Chargers-Rams trade, given that Kroenke would then take the Chargers to L.A. It becomes, as a practical matter, a private relocation fee paid directly to Spanos. The extra amount paid to Spanos for the Chargers could persuade the league at large to insist on less from Kroenke to take the Chargers on a relatively short trip up the road.

Third, Spanos would cash in with the Rams, getting the new stadium he covets and filling it up with a fan base both relieved and invigorated by the fact that the team is staying put. Consider the bump the Buffalo Bills realized when, after months of uncertainty regarding the future location of the team, Terry and Kim Pegula purchased the franchise and renewed the vows with Western New York. A similar outcome in St. Louis would make Spanos an instant hero there, with corresponding dollars flowing into the team’s coffers. (Kroenke, a Missouri native named for Cardinals legends Stan Musial and Enos Slaughter, also would salvage a bit of his image and legacy there, since he will have found a way to leave while also leaving the team behind.)

If the possibility of a swap ever makes its way into the meeting room, the question becomes how much money would Spanos need (in addition to getting the Rams) to pull the trigger on a trade. Surely, there’s a sufficiently large number that would get him to do it. The question is whether that’s a number Kroenke would offer — and whether the rest of the owners would work with Kroenke and Spanos to make it happen by not putting any thumbs on the relocation-fee scale.

Is it a perfect solution? Far from it. But it may be the only thing that works at a time when: (1) plenty of owners think Spanos deserves to get out of San Diego; (2) plenty of owners think the Rams should stay in St. Louis; (3) Kroenke has plenty of money to make everyone happy and still get what he wants — a team in L.A.; and (4) nothing will get approved without 24 votes.

The deeper question is whether owners like Richardson and McNair would be willing to work with Kroenke to let him get to L.A. with a different team, or whether their opposition to a Rams move is less about keeping the team in St. Louis and more about pushing back against Kroenke, who has behaved to date in a way that has rubbed plenty of his partners the wrong way.

 

[27mtrcougar]

If Stan wants to be in LA so bad he should buy the Raiders. Make Davis an offer he can't refuse.

 

[Rambunctious]

Interesting read Snake Eyes. I don't see the owner of the Chargers giving up his west coast team for a team in St Louis. He wants the lime light as much as Stan does. I see the Chargers and Rams sharing the dome in Inglewood. From day one there has always been talk of a two team move to LA. Stan said two weeks ago that he would share his stadium with the Chargers. And honestly I know it sounds crazy but after that I could see the Raiders or Jaguars going for the new digs in St Louis.

 

[27mtrcougar]

Interesting read Snake Eyes. I don't see the owner of the Chargers giving up his west coast team for a team in St Louis. He wants the lime light as much as Stan does. I see the Chargers and Rams sharing the dome in Inglewood. From day one there has always been talk of a two team move to LA. Stan said two weeks ago that he would share his stadium with the Chargers. And honestly I know it sounds crazy but after that I could see the Raiders or Jaguars going for the new digs in

I just don't see the Chargers teaming up with Stan and sharing a building. the owners don't like each other. Besides the charger owner said he won't do that he's partners with Mark Davis the owner of the Raiders. Stan came out a couple weeks ago and said he would share his building in a desperate move to try to split the Chargers and Raiders partnership because he knows the NFL wants two teams in LA but he doesn't have a partner. But it didn't work

 

[27mtrcougar]

Chargers-Rams franchise swap could be only way out of L.A. maze

View attachment 67235

As the NFL’s effort to figure out which of three interested teams will get the golden ticket to L.A. (along with the privilege of paying dearly for it through relocation fees), the process is quickly getting uglier, with members of the league’s Los Angeles committee making promises to St. Louis in an effort to keep the Rams there and publicly trashing San Diego in an effort to get the Chargers out.

It’s careening toward a potential free-for-all on January 12 and 13, when the owners get together with the goal of putting at least one team in Los Angeles, possibly two. From that chaos a variety of potential solutions can emerge. One solution that was mentioned on Thursday as an outside-the-box/beyond-the-boundaries-of-sanity suggestion could, surprisingly, gain traction.

Indeed, it ultimately could be the only way out of this mess.

In 1972, Carroll Rosenbloom and Robert Irsay swapped the Colts and the Rams. Ultimately, a swap of the Chargers and the Rams could be the cleanest way out of the league’s sudden L.A. clusterfudge.

As one source with knowledge of the current league dynamics said in response to the possibility of a franchise swap, “It’s not a bad idea.”

Good or bad, it may be the only way to placate everyone involved.

With folks like Panthers owner Jerry Richardson and Texans owner Bob McNair, two of six members of the L.A. committee, campaigning openly for the Chargers to move to L.A. and for the Rams to stay put in St. Louis, giving the Chargers to Stan Kroenke (who would move them to L.A.) and the Rams to Dean Spanos (who would keep them in Missouri) would allow Kroenke to build his own venue in Inglewood, at a site that many believe is better — and more potentially profitable — than the proposed Chargers/Raiders location in Carson.

Making Inglewood even more attractive is talk of Kroenke building new studio space for NFL Network there, which would be available to the league for the right price: Free. And even though the jury remains out on whether FAA concerns regarding an Inglewood stadium would keep the thing from being built, the Carson site has issues, too.

“Most of that site was a former landfill. It’s contaminated land,” Carson mayor Albert Robles acknowledged earlier this year. “There is a strip, about 11 acres, that was never a landfill.” With the total site at 168 acres, the simple math (which is the only math I understand) is that 157 acres was a landfill.

And while Spanos, who will be reluctant to leave Southern California, the numbers quickly will pile up in his favor if he’d trade the Chargers for the Rams.

First, Spanos would incur no relocation fee.

Second, Spanos would surely secure extra money from Kroenke in a Chargers-Rams trade, given that Kroenke would then take the Chargers to L.A. It becomes, as a practical matter, a private relocation fee paid directly to Spanos. The extra amount paid to Spanos for the Chargers could persuade the league at large to insist on less from Kroenke to take the Chargers on a relatively short trip up the road.

Third, Spanos would cash in with the Rams, getting the new stadium he covets and filling it up with a fan base both relieved and invigorated by the fact that the team is staying put. Consider the bump the Buffalo Bills realized when, after months of uncertainty regarding the future location of the team, Terry and Kim Pegula purchased the franchise and renewed the vows with Western New York. A similar outcome in St. Louis would make Spanos an instant hero there, with corresponding dollars flowing into the team’s coffers. (Kroenke, a Missouri native named for Cardinals legends Stan Musial and Enos Slaughter, also would salvage a bit of his image and legacy there, since he will have found a way to leave while also leaving the team behind.)

If the possibility of a swap ever makes its way into the meeting room, the question becomes how much money would Spanos need (in addition to getting the Rams) to pull the trigger on a trade. Surely, there’s a sufficiently large number that would get him to do it. The question is whether that’s a number Kroenke would offer — and whether the rest of the owners would work with Kroenke and Spanos to make it happen by not putting any thumbs on the relocation-fee scale.

Is it a perfect solution? Far from it. But it may be the only thing that works at a time when: (1) plenty of owners think Spanos deserves to get out of San Diego; (2) plenty of owners think the Rams should stay in St. Louis; (3) Kroenke has plenty of money to make everyone happy and still get what he wants — a team in L.A.; and (4) nothing will get approved without 24 votes.

The deeper question is whether owners like Richardson and McNair would be willing to work with Kroenke to let him get to L.A. with a different team, or whether their opposition to a Rams move is less about keeping the team in St. Louis and more about pushing back against Kroenke, who has behaved to date in a way that has rubbed plenty of his partners the wrong way.

This is complete fantasy. Not going to happen. Swap teams

 

[Rambunctious]

But it didn't work

Is that your opinion or fact? Who knows what the owner of the Chargers wants...I sure don't but I'd bet he does not want a team in St Louis...he wants a team in LA and if he has to saddle up with Stan he will. The Carson project is close to being dumped because of environmental concerns. Besides wouldn't it create scheduling difficulties with two AFC teams playing in the same home venue?

 

[27mtrcougar]

Is that your opinion or fact? Who knows what the owner of the Chargers wants...I sure don't but I'd bet he does not want a team in St Louis...he wants a team in LA and if he has to saddle up with Stan he will. The Carson project is close to being dumped because of environmental concerns. Besides wouldn't it create scheduling difficulties with two AFC teams playing in the same home venue?

It is fact. he wrote a letter to the NFL after Stan said he wanted to partner. the letter said i am partners with Davis and he didn't want to partner with stan. that was to show the other owners that Stan was on his own.

 

[Rambunctious]

It is fact. he wrote a letter to the NFL after Stan said he wanted to partner. the letter said i am partners with Davis and he didn't want to partner with stan. that was to show the other owners that Stan was on his own.

Okay...good point. I did not know that but come on...a letter? If Stan makes him a deal where he can have his team in LA in Super Bowl quality digs in Inglewood I think he jumps at it. Especially if the Raiders are getting cold feet which is looking like a possibility.

 

[Battlelyon]

Carson project won't see the light of day, it is former landfill land.

 

[Battlelyon]

Now there is a report about the Raiders possibly going to San Diego, lol, just another day in as the NFL in LA turns.

 

[27mtrcougar]

Now there is a report about the Raiders possibly going to San Diego, lol, just another day in as the NFL in LA turns.

And do what? There is no stadium there.

 

[Battlelyon]

Could the Raiders eventually land in San Diego?
Posted by Mike Florio on December 21, 2015, 7:41 PM EST
AP
On Sunday, Chargers players like Philip Rivers said farewell to San Diego — even though the relocation of the team is hardly official. It nevertheless felt final, because it’s becoming more and more clear that the Chargers are likely to leave town.

Some think that the sense it’s ending could be exactly what it takes to kick start a long-suffering effort to finally build a new stadium in San Diego. But it’s likely too late to make it happen. Even if San Diego were to become fully committed at this moment to get a new stadium built, the Chargers aren’t willing to wait and see what happens because, if they do and if the effort fails, the Chargers will be SOL in L.A.

The departure of the Chargers won’t necessarily prompt San Diego to stop trying to build a new stadium. Like St. Louis and Baltimore after they lost the Cardinals and Colts, respectively, in the 1980s, San Diego could try to build a stadium in an effort to land a new team.

So how about the Raiders? Although owner Mark Davis has no interest in replacing the Rams in St. Louis, moving to San Diego isn’t all that different from moving to L.A. Ultimately, Davis wants a new stadium; if he can get one in San Diego, thanks to the sense of urgency that will come from the loss of the Chargers and the allure of bringing one of their top rivals to town.

Crazier things have happened, and it really wouldn’t be all that crazy if, at some point down the line, the Raiders move south, beyond L.A. and to the city that is about to be vacated for it.

 

[Retroram52]

Personally, I have this suspicion that Mark Davis is staying right where his team is in Oakland.

 

[Battlelyon]

Maybe Kroenke can give him some money to get a decent haircut.

 

[27mtrcougar]

Could the Raiders eventually land in San Diego?
Posted by Mike Florio on December 21, 2015, 7:41 PM EST
View attachment 68016AP
On Sunday, Chargers players like Philip Rivers said farewell to San Diego — even though the relocation of the team is hardly official. It nevertheless felt final, because it’s becoming more and more clear that the Chargers are likely to leave town.

Some think that the sense it’s ending could be exactly what it takes to kick start a long-suffering effort to finally build a new stadium in San Diego. But it’s likely too late to make it happen. Even if San Diego were to become fully committed at this moment to get a new stadium built, the Chargers aren’t willing to wait and see what happens because, if they do and if the effort fails, the Chargers will be SOL in L.A.

The departure of the Chargers won’t necessarily prompt San Diego to stop trying to build a new stadium. Like St. Louis and Baltimore after they lost the Cardinals and Colts, respectively, in the 1980s, San Diego could try to build a stadium in an effort to land a new team.

So how about the Raiders? Although owner Mark Davis has no interest in replacing the Rams in St. Louis, moving to San Diego isn’t all that different from moving to L.A. Ultimately, Davis wants a new stadium; if he can get one in San Diego, thanks to the sense of urgency that will come from the loss of the Chargers and the allure of bringing one of their top rivals to town.

Crazier things have happened, and it really wouldn’t be all that crazy if, at some point down the line, the Raiders move south, beyond L.A. and to the city that is about to be vacated for it.

We're going to see a lot of crazy stories like this up until The January vote. Seriously if they couldn't get a stadium deal done in the last decade with a team there like the Chargers how are they going to get the financing and approval for a stadium when They don't even have a team. Good luck.

 

[bluepigpen]

Just like everyone else, I have no idea what will happen but let us look at what makes sense. #1. Kroenke has money, #2 San Diego has not come to the party with a new stadium idea, #3 St Louis wants a team and has a building plan in place, #4 Oakland's stadium is at best a baseball stadium at it's state, #5 and most important the NFL wants a or 2 teams in the LA market.

#1. Kroenke has the money to make things happen even though most of the other owners probably hate him. He has the site paid for, the team that will move and even if the other owners hate him the NFL wants a LA site which trumps anything else. The real question is if the NFL wants two teams, what is the other? The fact that St Louis has not upgraded the Edward Jones Dome over the years also throws Kroenke a ace to move the team.

#2. Qual Com or Jack Murphy stadium as I know it is 50+ years old. The location is OK bordering the Interstate 8, 163 and not far from the 5 but Spanos has longed for a stadium downtown. For anyone that knows San Diego and I used to live there and spent many good times in Jack Murphy, there is no room downtown for a stadium in reference to the bay like Petco has for the Padres. With the International Airport there and space limited downtown and then the Navel Base on the island, there isn't room in San Diego. Now up the coast a bit maybe but that is not San Diego. That leaves the site it sits on now as the possible location but what a nightmare, tearing down and building at the same time and Spanos doesn't want that anyway. San Diego State plays there also and probably will for the future.

#3. St Louis is late for the party but they did show up. The city could have fixed this years ago if they would have come up with a new site plan or fixed the Edward Jones Dome. The fact they have a plan is good and just might save the city from losing a team, which team is yet to be determined though. The trade idea is interesting and I never really thought about that but that does fix a couple of ills. For the LA Rams fans they would be disappointed but the Chargers in LA would maybe fix the football ill from the Rams not moving back. I for one don't care where the Rams play, I am a Rams fan first and foremost. As a Rams fan, trading Kroenke for Spanos is like picking between Ford or Chevy, the same and still cost a lot, drives but hasn't got anyone to 200 in 6 seconds.

#4. Oakland, really does anyone want to play there? The stadium is a joke for football and baseball for all that matter with cracks, leaks and old plumbing it is well past time for it to go. After the enclosure, it does fit baseball better and I can see the A's being there long term but the Raiders are going to leave to one place or another. Davis with less capital is not in a position to call shots completely and will traverse to his best option left.

#5. The NFL wants to move back to LA. They want two teams to share the market. What the NFL wants usually they get. My problem is will the fans really show up, I doubt it. LA is a happening place with so many things to do, unless it is a smaller venue, one or both of the teams better be a winner or that stadium will look very empty and that is not what the NFL wants. Oh it would move into a very nice circle for the Super Bowl but without one of the teams in the continual playoff mode, it will be a poor move on the NFL's part. TV money is the structure, not attendance but TV shows seats empty or filled and if empty, that is what is unappealing and will make the move a joke for years to come because that is what's been said about Southern Calif for ever.

I don't care either way how it goes only that there is a team called the Rams and I can see the horns on Sundays win or lose.

 

[27mtrcougar]

Just like everyone else, I have no idea what will happen but let us look at what makes sense. #1. Kroenke has money, #2 San Diego has not come to the party with a new stadium idea, #3 St Louis wants a team and has a building plan in place, #4 Oakland's stadium is at best a baseball stadium at it's state, #5 and most important the NFL wants a or 2 teams in the LA market.

#1. Kroenke has the money to make things happen even though most of the other owners probably hate him. He has the site paid for, the team that will move and even if the other owners hate him the NFL wants a LA site which trumps anything else. The real question is if the NFL wants two teams, what is the other? The fact that St Louis has not upgraded the Edward Jones Dome over the years also throws Kroenke a ace to move the team.

#2. Qual Com or Jack Murphy stadium as I know it is 50+ years old. The location is OK bordering the Interstate 8, 163 and not far from the 5 but Spanos has longed for a stadium downtown. For anyone that knows San Diego and I used to live there and spent many good times in Jack Murphy, there is no room downtown for a stadium in reference to the bay like Petco has for the Padres. With the International Airport there and space limited downtown and then the Navel Base on the island, there isn't room in San Diego. Now up the coast a bit maybe but that is not San Diego. That leaves the site it sits on now as the possible location but what a nightmare, tearing down and building at the same time and Spanos doesn't want that anyway. San Diego State plays there also and probably will for the future.

#3. St Louis is late for the party but they did show up. The city could have fixed this years ago if they would have come up with a new site plan or fixed the Edward Jones Dome. The fact they have a plan is good and just might save the city from losing a team, which team is yet to be determined though. The trade idea is interesting and I never really thought about that but that does fix a couple of ills. For the LA Rams fans they would be disappointed but the Chargers in LA would maybe fix the football ill from the Rams not moving back. I for one don't care where the Rams play, I am a Rams fan first and foremost. As a Rams fan, trading Kroenke for Spanos is like picking between Ford or Chevy, the same and still cost a lot, drives but hasn't got anyone to 200 in 6 seconds.

#4. Oakland, really does anyone want to play there? The stadium is a joke for football and baseball for all that matter with cracks, leaks and old plumbing it is well past time for it to go. After the enclosure, it does fit baseball better and I can see the A's being there long term but the Raiders are going to leave to one place or another. Davis with less capital is not in a position to call shots completely and will traverse to his best option left.

#5. The NFL wants to move back to LA. They want two teams to share the market. What the NFL wants usually they get. My problem is will the fans really show up, I doubt it. LA is a happening place with so many things to do, unless it is a smaller venue, one or both of the teams better be a winner or that stadium will look very empty and that is not what the NFL wants. Oh it would move into a very nice circle for the Super Bowl but without one of the teams in the continual playoff mode, it will be a poor move on the NFL's part. TV money is the structure, not attendance but TV shows seats empty or filled and if empty, that is what is unappealing and will make the move a joke for years to come because that is what's been said about Southern Calif for ever.

I don't care either way how it goes only that there is a team called the Rams and I can see the horns on Sundays win or lose.

I agree with a lot of what you said but I don't really think St. Louis was late to the party. In regards to updating the Edward Jones Dome. if you think about it from the city's point of view they were still under a lease with the Rams so why would you want to give Stan the upper hand and give him whatever he wants untill you have too? it's just not good business. Also the Rams wanted 700 million to redo it which is a joke when you can build a new stadium for 1 billion. But all the Edward Jones Dome talk is really mute now because St. Louis has a brand-new stadium plan in place. And that's the big problem for the NFL! See Roger Godell and the NFL never thought in 1 million years St. Louis could get a new stadium plan together so fast and it caught them offguard. Thank about it. if St. Louis didn't have a stadium plan in place just like Oakland and San Diego it would be easy for them to say OK Stan move to LA. But it's very tricky now because we have a plan in place. With 400 million approved public funding. So if the NFL moves the Rams out of St. Louis other teams are going to have big problems when they want go to remodel their stadiums or need public funding money. Politicians will use St. Louis as an example of how the NFL played them even though they did everything they asked for. The other owners know this.

The solution to this is really so easy you don't have to know anything about the situation to solve the problem. There are three teams that want to move to LA. Two of them are already in California. (San Diego and Oakland) Those two are partners. The NFL wants two teams in LA. The other city (st louis)has a new stadium plan in place where the other two have nothing, and are playing in 50-year-old stadiums. Moving San Diego and Oakland to LA solves the problem for those two getting new stadium and solves the problem of two teams in LA. St. Louis gets a brand-new stadium and gets to keep their team. The bottom line is Stan has really no reason to be leaving St. Louis and it will look very bad on the NFL if they do.

 

[27mtrcougar]

Maybe Kroenke can give him some money to get a decent haircut.

View attachment 68034

That's some crazy shit.