John Lester's Blatant Cheating in WS Game 1

[broncosmitty]

That's not my belief. It's not about the individual game. That's not what bothers me at all, but I guess I'm in the minority.

I just can't get over that everything was after the fact. MLB provides the umpires. The umpires call balls and strikes. Fair or foul. Out or safe. And balks. (Im generalizing)Almost everything else, aside from safety, is on the managers. The The Red Sox could have had Big Papi come back out after his curtain call tonight and bat again if they wanted to. It's on the opposition to appeal to the crew and draw attention to the fact theyre batting out of turn. Call it gamesmanship, or poor sportsmanship, or cheating, I think it's part of the game to take what you can get.

 

[lainey12]

classy

I'm with you Mariners fan, and I'm not rooting for the Cards either
lol

 

[broncosmitty]

They've already admitted he cheated. I'm not even rooting for the Cards.
He cheated, did it matter in that game? I don't think so, I think they were well on their way to losing anyway.

So the obvious question, if some pitcher is using rosin illegally against your.....whoever's team...it's perfectly fine?
I doubt it.

But somehow this turned into the Cardinals fans fault? Sure, no Red Sox fan would have complained the next day
lol

If my team doesn't do/say anything about it during the course of the game, yes, absolutely it is. (I'd mutter some things under my breath, but that's baseball, to me.). Im not blaming Cardinals fans, not one bit. Haven't actually heard/read much complaining from them. Im blaming the Cardinals staff, roster, front office, minor league system and anyone else affliated who could have told Matheny during the course of the game.

 

[broncosmitty]

well, that's an opinion. The fact is, he did cheat...it is against the rules. There's no argument about that.

What are the consequences? Nothing what so ever, right?

 

[lainey12]

That's not my belief. It's not about the individual game. That's not what bothers me at all, but I guess I'm in the minority.

I don't know that you're in the minority, he cheated, it was wrong. And, no one seems to care....that is a little strange.

it's over, you guys tied it up. Maybe it's something the league will come back to after the Series, give a warning that it is illegal, something like that.
I'm going to take a wild guess that you will NOT be seeing any rosin in any pitcher's glove during the rest of the Series

 

[lainey12]

What are the consequences? Nothing what so ever, right?

that would be up to the league, it is illegal....I assume they know, and nothing will change at this point.

Are you saying you don't care if a pitcher uses 'rosin' in his glove against your team? If you don't, then fine.

oops, you already answered...sorry

 

[lainey12]

I have to say, that is the strangest glob of 'rosin' stuck in a glove I have ever seen

lolololol

 

[lainey12]

I have to say, that is the strangest glob of 'rosin' stuck in a glove I have ever seen

lolololol

let me translate, that ain't rosin folks
meh, doesn't matter now...I really do get a kick out of it

"uh, he needs rosin in his glove because he sweats"
he "sweats"?
Come on, that's funny

 

[broncosmitty]

well, that's an opinion. The fact is, he did cheat...it is against the rules. There's no argument about that.

that would be up to the league, it is illegal....I assume they know, and nothing will change at this point.

Are you saying you don't care if a pitcher uses 'rosin' in his glove against your team? If you don't, then fine.

If I were managing, and I saw it, Id care. And Id walk out to the home plate ump and ask him to take a walk to the mound with me. If I were sitting on my couch, like I am right now, Id want my teams manger to do exactly what Id do. If nobody noticed during the game, I wouldn't care at all. Although I might wonder how 30 some grown men in the dugout didn't notice while my teams offense floundered miserably.

 

[lainey12]

Missed the Farrell quote since I rarely watch post-game shows.

If rosin is against the rules why is there a rosin bag on every pitching mound?

Because it's not sticky and unless you have some glue, you can't get a glob of it to stick your glove

hence, it's on the ground.

 

[lainey12]

If I were managing, and I saw it, Id care. And Id walk out to the home plate ump and ask him to take a walk to the mound with me. If I were sitting on my couch, like I am right now, Id want my teams manger to do exactly what Id do. If nobody noticed during the game, I wouldn't care at all. Although I might wonder how 30 some grown men in the dugout didn't notice while my teams offense floundered miserably.

Did Matheny see it? obviously not
somehow that's the Cardinals fault....okay

 

[broncosmitty]

Did Matheny see it? obviously not
somehow that's the Cardinals fault....okay

It's probably why they don't seem to mind. It's their bad for not seeing it. They know how these things work. It's their responsibility. The own-ness is on them.

 

[uncfan103]

It's probably why they don't seem to mind. It's their bad for not seeing it. They know how these things work. It's their responsibility. The own-ness is on them.

The Cardinals don't mind because it doesn't affect them, the game is over.

 

[steveringo]

A few things..

Cheating is doing something to get an unfair advantage over your opponent. Rosin does not give you an unfair advantage. It simply allows you to grip the ball. Most batters endorse the use so they are not hit in the head with a 92 MPH slider gone awry...

The Cardinals not putting up a fuss has nothing to do with the outcome of the game. They did not put up a fuss, because there is no fuss to put up as this entire story was a non-issue... Adam Wainright was asked last year about his rosin usage:

Wainwright acknowledges at times using a mix of resin and sunscreen to enhance his grip. Just as significant, the combo applied to his pitching arm helps prevent sweat rolling onto his hand.

"There's a difference in pine tar from oil and grease, things that make the ball sink, cut or do different stuff," he said. "That's different than doctoring a ball. If one of our pitchers gets a scuff on the side of a ball he can do all kinds of things with it. An emery board or something like that is totally different.''

Manager Mike Matheny declined comment on the matter but the team is among those believing the use of substance mixed with resin to better grip the ball is widespread if not universal.

Everyone understands the rule about the application of rosin. Most understand there are some rules that do not affect the game if they're broken. (Who knew if was against the rules to leave warm-up bats, bat weights and pine tar in the on-deck circle while your team is batting?)

This is why I like sports message boards. It is a great way to learn more about the games we love.

 

[uncfan103]

A few things..

Cheating is doing something to get an unfair advantage over your opponent. Rosin does not give you an unfair advantage. It simply allows you to grip the ball. Most batters endorse the use so they are not hit in the head with a 92 MPH slider gone awry...

The Cardinals not putting up a fuss has nothing to do with the outcome of the game. They did not put up a fuss, because there is no fuss to put up as this entire story was a non-issue... Adam Wainright was asked last year about his rosin usage:


Everyone understands the rule about the application of rosin. Most understand there are some rules that do not affect the game if they're broken. (Who knew if was against the rules to leave warm-up bats, bat weights and pine tar in the on-deck circle while your team is batting?)

This is why I like sports message boards. It is a great way to learn more about the games we love.

So...let's change the rule. I believe having the ability to grip the ball is an advantage. Let's just get of rules that are accepted so that these things aren't an issue. At least then it wouldn't look like the MLB was turning a blind eye

 

[steveringo]

So...let's change the rule. I believe having the ability to grip the ball is an advantage. Let's just get of rules that are accepted so that these things aren't an issue. At least then it wouldn't look like the MLB was turning a blind eye

Yeah... In a game so old, it might be wise to revamp the rules book....

Ever try to read the whole thing?
http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/downloads/y2013/official_baseball_rules.pdf


You can find a ton of rules to modify:

"No part of the uniform shall include a pattern that imitates or suggests the shape of​

a baseball."

 

[uncfan103]

Yeah... In a game so old, it might be wise to revamp the rules book....

Ever try to read the whole thing?
http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/downloads/y2013/official_baseball_rules.pdf


You can find a ton of rules to modify:

"No part of the uniform shall include a pattern that imitates or suggests the shape of​

a baseball."

I see what you're saying. But I still think we should adjust the ones that, when broken, give someone an advantage over someone playing by the rules. It doesn't that ridiculous to me. Breaking rules that helps someone gain an advantage, regardless of how common and accepted, doesn't seem like something the MLB should let continue. That's just my opinion, but whatever.

 

[cezero]

Yeah, so every pitcher should be able to dip their fingers in rosin for every pitch.

That's what anybody defending Lester in any way is arguing.

They are incredibly stupid.

 

[navamind]

Mariners fans are adorable.

 

[steveringo]

Mariners fans are adorable.

Be nice. Don't genralize and entire fan base based on one person.... Sometimes people feel very stongly about a tiny issue, even though everyone else in the world seems to be able to understand the big picture. He has every right to post his opinions....

Just because he bad mouths everyone else doesn't mean we have to lower ourselves to that level. The best we can do is either explain the situation, or post links to real articles that help explain it. If he chooses to ignore it, so be it.