Is Luka for AD the most shocking trade of all time

[UK Cowboy]

That might be true. On the other hand, Dallas had some very good fortune in the playoffs last year. They were lucky to face a Thunder team that was like the youngest playoff team ever, or something, and looking back, it's hard to even see how they won that series. Doncic was excellent, but Gilgeous-Alexander was unbelievable ( 32 / 8 /7, 55% from 3! ).

Doncic needed Irving to bail him out in the first round against the Clippers where he shot 40% -- overall -- and 24% from the arc. And oh by the way, Leonard only played 59 minutes in that series.




Heh, we'll see. People said exactly the same thing about James Harden ten years ago. High-volume shooters with mediocre accuracy may score a lot of points, but that's not actually a great model for winning championships, especially if they are useless defensively.

Harden ain't Luka my man. Get real

 

[trojanfan12]

All of this is exactly true for the Lakers last year -- except James is way better than Irving -- and the Lakers were not particularly competitive. Why would Dallas be better at all, never mind a lot better?

The answer is in what you quoted. AD fits better with Kyrie and is an elite defender and rim protector. A big part of the reason the Mavs lost in the finals was their defense. As mentioned, Christie is a good defender as well.

The key is going to be Kyrie...the offense is going to run through him now. If he and AD are on the same page...that's going to be tough to stop.

I disagree on James being way better than Kyrie. They average about the same as far as points and are shooting about the same from 3. Lebron averages about 3 more assists, but I expect that Kyries assists number will come up now that Luka is gone...especially with AD to throw it too.

Imo, the biggest problem for the Mavs getting out of the West again is going to be determined by how much OKC's kids learned in the playoffs last year. If they have grown up enough to handle the pressure and more physical play...they're coming out of the West no matter what the Mavs or Lakers do.

 

[tc1]

Harden ain't Luka my man. Get real

I'm honestly not sure what you mean. While Doncic is still young, he has not matched most of Harden's individual accomplishments.

Harden was 3-time scoring champ, and 2-time assist champ, and MVP. ( and second for MVP 3 other times ). Doncic has just the one scoring title.

They are actually incredibly similar in many ways. Their games, their builds, their apparent convictions to their profession. The biggest difference is that Harden came into the league with a lot less hype, and took a few years to earn his opportunities.

Other than their first couple years, I have a difficult time thinking of two more similar players. Harden is a better shooter, Doncic a better rebounder, but they are peas in pod.

( I can't stand James Harden, for the record. )

 

[Wamu]

@trojanfan12 @Black Adam @DJ Fieri @Retroram52 @shopson67

Two questions for LakersNation.

Is it safe to say AD didn't turn out to be the go-to guy the Lakers were hoping? To me even at 40 LeBron's the best player on the roster, excuse me was. Now with Luka in Lakers-land what are your expectations going forward?

My first reaction was- oh shit. That's a helluva combo.

 

[tc1]

The answer is in what you quoted. AD fits better with Kyrie and is an elite defender and rim protector.

Davis was an elite defender and rim protector last year, too. That's an irrelevant point. How/why does Davis fit better with Irving than with James? Recall that the latter duo already won a title, and James is better in every way than Irving.

A big part of the reason the Mavs lost in the finals was their defense. As mentioned, Christie is a good defender as well.

Okay, but Christie was a Laker last year, and didn't help with the defense all that much. In fact, Christie struggled to stay in the rotation even though the Lakers were not deep with wings. In fact, none other than Spencer Dinwiddie largely kept Christie on the bench last year -- and he's in Dallas now. Christie has improved, but it remains to be seen if he's even going to play much for Dallas.

The key is going to be Kyrie...the offense is going to run through him now. If he and AD are on the same page...that's going to be tough to stop.

Irving has never been much of a passer. He's never played a full season and averaged more assists than, say, Austin Reaves is right now ( or than Reaves did last year ). And is current average is well-under his career number, as one would expect for a 32 year-old.

Why do you think Irving will suddenly start becoming a great playmaker?

I disagree on James being way better than Kyrie. They average about the same as far as points and are shooting about the same from 3. Lebron averages about 3 more assists, but I expect that Kyries assists number will come up now that Luka is gone...especially with AD to throw it too.

James averages 4.3 more assists, to be precise -- almost double. Despite playing with Reaves and Russell, who both average more assists than Irving does. Doncic has not played most of the season, so he's not depressing Irving's statistics very much.

Imo, the biggest problem for the Mavs getting out of the West again is going to be determined by how much OKC's kids learned in the playoffs last year. If they have grown up enough to handle the pressure and more physical play...they're coming out of the West no matter what the Mavs or Lakers do.

I think I agree with that, although I think they need Holmgren on the court, and he makes both Doncic and Davis look like AC Green.

 

[Wamu]

I'm honestly not sure what you mean. While Doncic is still young, he has not matched most of Harden's individual accomplishments.

Harden was 3-time scoring champ, and 2-time assist champ, and MVP. ( and second for MVP 3 other times ). Doncic has just the one scoring title.

They are actually incredibly similar in many ways. Their games, their builds, their apparent convictions to their profession. The biggest difference is that Harden came into the league with a lot less hype, and took a few years to earn his opportunities.

Other than their first couple years, I have a difficult time thinking of two more similar players. Harden is a better shooter, Doncic a better rebounder, but they are peas in pod.

( I can't stand James Harden, for the record. )

I'm right there with you about Harden. Not a fan of his either.

But Luka's already accomplished something the bearded one he never done. Be the best player on a Finals team.

I think when Luka's career is over, barring injury, he'll have a better career than JH.

 

[DJ Fieri]

@trojanfan12 @Black Adam @DJ Fieri @Retroram52 @shopson67

Two questions for LakersNation.

Is it safe to say AD didn't turn out to be the go-to guy the Lakers were hoping? To me even at 40 LeBron's the best player on the roster, excuse me was. Now with Luka in Lakers-land what are your expectations going forward?

My first reaction was- oh shit. That's a helluva combo.

We shall see how it works out.

He is clearly the face of the franchise moving forward once Bron retires.

 

[Wamu]

Okay might be biased but I voted no.

To me the 1980 trade between Boston & Golden State was better. Two 1st round picks for Robert Parish and drafting Kevin McHale.

 

[tc1]

But Luka's already accomplished something the bearded one he never done. Be the best player on a Finals team.

There's only a very slight difference between losing the Finals and losing to the champs one round earlier. It's mostly a question of geography. One could even argue that Harden came closer to winning a ring than Doncic has yet.

I think when Luka's career is over, barring injury, he'll have a better career than JH.

Perhaps, but he has a lot of hard work yet to do.

 

[Wamu]

Okay might be biased but I voted no.

To me the 1980 trade between Boston & Golden State was better. Two 1st round picks for Robert Parish and drafting Kevin McHale.

 

[UK Cowboy]

I'm honestly not sure what you mean. While Doncic is still young, he has not matched most of Harden's individual accomplishments.

Harden was 3-time scoring champ, and 2-time assist champ, and MVP. ( and second for MVP 3 other times ). Doncic has just the one scoring title.

They are actually incredibly similar in many ways. Their games, their builds, their apparent convictions to their profession. The biggest difference is that Harden came into the league with a lot less hype, and took a few years to earn his opportunities.

Other than their first couple years, I have a difficult time thinking of two more similar players. Harden is a better shooter, Doncic a better rebounder, but they are peas in pod.

( I can't stand James Harden, for the record. )

Harden has one Finals appearance in his career despite being on the most talented team 5-6 times. He is not what Luka is

 

[Wamu]

There's only a very slight difference between losing the Finals and losing to the champs one round earlier. It's mostly a question of geography. One could even argue that Harden came closer to winning a ring than Doncic has yet.


Perhaps, but he has a lot of hard work yet to do.

Okay I'll put it another way. Luka got his team to the Finals. How far has Harden ever gotten a team in the playoffs? He's been know to disappear in big moments.

Example from the L.A. Time- james harden delivers a trademark disappearing act at the worst time for the Clippers

 

[DJ Fieri]

Harden has one Finals appearance in his career despite being on the most talented team 5-6 times. He is not what Luka is

Not even close.

 

[Hangman]

Gasol for Kwame Brown was bigger.

I might watch the NBA again if LeBron is traded next

 

[Black Adam]

Okay might be biased but I voted no.

To me the 1980 trade between Boston & Golden State was better. Two 1st round picks for Robert Parish and drafting Kevin McHale.

Considering you posted this twice you seem rather emphatic about it...

 

[Wamu]

We shall see how it works out.

He is clearly the face of the franchise moving forward once Bron retires.

I've always liked watching LeBron & Luka.

Now with both in L.A. gotta say it's a bit of a conundrum.

 

[Wamu]

Considering you posted this twice you seem rather emphatic about it...

Oh shit I did?

Ooppss, my bad.

 

[tlance]

Okay, you are inhabiting a different universe from the one the rest of us are in. Just note, for one of many pieces of evidence, how Randle started from Day 1 and has continued to start every game, while playing 33 minutes. And Divincenzo didn't manage to work his way into the lineup until January.



It's not a typo when you do it over and over again.



We have no data on which to evaluate this, because we do not know what Ingram's value is. We might, if he gets traded, but he has not.

No, I am really not.

Randle was not the centerpiece of the trade.

You will understand this when Minnesota lets him walk after the season, or signs him for substantially less money. Or a 1 year deal.

It isn’t about the role they are playing, it is about the role relative to the $ they are owed.

DDV is in a very team friendly contract. Randle is making $30 million which isn’t terrible, but it is a lot to pay for a volume shooting 4 who doesn’t defend very well.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

First of all, that's a different question. Does it make a difference if a team drafts a player, or drafts the players necessary to trade for that player? No, it does not.

Second, the Lakers drafted a ton of their stars:

Mikan
Mikkelson
Martin
Lovellette
Garmaker
Baylor (twice)
West
Goodrich
McMillian
LaRusso
Clark
Nixon
Cooper
Magic
Worthy
Green
Divac
van Exel
Jones
Fisher
Bynum


They also drafted some of the best players in other team's histories, like:
Sam Jones
KC Jones
Billy Knight
Brian Winters
Junior Bridgeman
James Edwards
Marc Gasol
Julius Randle

I was talking about their stars not player like Fisher, and in my lifetime. Off the top of my head my list is:

Wilt
Kareem
Shaq
Kobe
AD
LeBron
Luka

When was the last time they drafted one of their actual stars? Worthy 58 years ago?

 

[UK Cowboy]

I'm honestly not sure what you mean. While Doncic is still young, he has not matched most of Harden's individual accomplishments.

Harden was 3-time scoring champ, and 2-time assist champ, and MVP. ( and second for MVP 3 other times ). Doncic has just the one scoring title.

They are actually incredibly similar in many ways. Their games, their builds, their apparent convictions to their profession. The biggest difference is that Harden came into the league with a lot less hype, and took a few years to earn his opportunities.

Other than their first couple years, I have a difficult time thinking of two more similar players. Harden is a better shooter, Doncic a better rebounder, but they are peas in pod.

( I can't stand James Harden, for the record. )

Put it this way....Harden was traded once for Jarrett Allen and once for PJ Washington...and no one broke the net because they thought it was fake news. No one on earth could believe Luka was traded for Anthony Freaking Davis...and you want to tell me Luka is James Harden? OK fella lol