If Bridgewater is there @ 14, do you take him?

[63bears40]

I really like this post.........says a lot but,

No love for Manziel?

I`d include him in on the list.

Only posted this because of Teddy's poor pro day.
Manziel & Bortles are both top 10 picks by the PRO MOCKERS.
Just seen a mock were Teddy goes 24 th
I doubt any of the 3 get past 10.
Just wanted to create some conversation on the board.

 

[JoeyTourettes]

Now THAT'S pure nonsense. Do I really have to list all of the great players who didn't play in their first years? My goodness. Was Aaron Rodgers a "wasted pick"? Tom Brady? Drew Brees? The majority of great NFL QBs didn't play in their first year except a handful of snaps. And that's not just true of quarterbacks, many great players haven't. It's just that QBs make the easiest examples to refute the "didn't play year one = wasted pick" nonsense.

Listen, I'm really not trying to advocate we use 14 on a QB. Of course the Bears defense needs the pick, no shit. But if for some insane reason a likely franchise QB falls to you at 14, you absolutely, definitely, must take it. From where I am sitting, that list includes Bridgewater and Bortles and no one else. Quarterback is the one position in the NFL that overrides everything else, especially the least important position on the defense (safety). The value of a great quarterback is vastly higher than any other position on the field.

The use of the word "nonsense" in an attempt to belittle my example as childish. It's like saying... You are a child and it's cute that you can type and all those letters make words...what you say is adorable nonsense, but good try....

By your logic-

• if you drafted a franchise QB last year... but a "new" franchise QB falls to you this year - you should take him no matter what?
• If you just signed your franchise QB to a multi-year deal. And a "new" FranQB falls to you in the draft- you should take him no matter what? (even though you have high needs elsewhere)

Your example- Aaron Rodgers...

1) he fell really far

2) The Packers didn't have as many needs as the Bears do now

3) The idea and thought process at the time that Favre would be out in 1-2 years...instead of the 4 it took.


I have no problem with the idea of sitting a rookie QB and letting him learn behind a vet for a year. I do have a problem with a just resigned vet to one of the richest contracts in bears history...and signing his replacement in the FIRST ROUND... before that vet even plays one snap on that contract.


AND THIS:
Teddy Bridgewater IS NOT a franchise QB. He looks like he could be serviceable. Good to decent. He's just "a guy"... I don't see anything "special" enough in him that would warrant taking him over a defensive player.
You have to know where the Bears list him on their "big board" I don't see how he is higher on the board then say Haha or Aaron Donald. Just no way.

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

The use of the word "nonsense" in an attempt to belittle my example as childish. It's like saying... You are a child and it's cute that you can type and all those letters make words...what you say is adorable nonsense, but good try....

By your logic-

• if you drafted a franchise QB last year... but a "new" franchise QB falls to you this year - you should take him no matter what?
• If you just signed your franchise QB to a multi-year deal. And a "new" FranQB falls to you in the draft- you should take him no matter what? (even though you have high needs elsewhere)

Your example- Aaron Rodgers...

1) he fell really far

2) The Packers didn't have as many needs as the Bears do now

3) The idea and thought process at the time that Favre would be out in 1-2 years...instead of the 4 it took.


I have no problem with the idea of sitting a rookie QB and letting him learn behind a vet for a year. I do have a problem with a just resigned vet to one of the richest contracts in bears history...and signing his replacement in the FIRST ROUND... before that vet even plays one snap on that contract.


AND THIS:
Teddy Bridgewater IS NOT a franchise QB. He looks like he could be serviceable. Good to decent. He's just "a guy"... I don't see anything "special" enough in him that would warrant taking him over a defensive player.
You have to know where the Bears list him on their "big board" I don't see how he is higher on the board then say Haha or Aaron Donald. Just no way.

What does "nonsense" have to do with "childish." In my experience, plenty of adults engage in nonsense. Stick to what I say. If I want to call you a child, I will do so. Promise.

Aaron Rodgers did fall far. So what? He wasn't a wasted pick at any point. If he had been drafted #1, but then sat his three years, would that have been a "wasted pick?" Good heavens, what nonsense. Yes, nonsense.

Again, many NFL stars have sat their first seasons largely out. There's nothing wrong with that. It's actually desirable.

In theory, the Packers could have kept Favre for another 6 years after they took Rodgers (3 with GB after Rodgers and the three viable years he played with NY/MINN). It was hardly taken as granted that Favre only had 1-2 years left, which is precisely why he got so pissed.

As for Bridgewater not being a potential franchise QB, OK, here you may have a point. Or you may not. I doubt that either you or I are the best qualified to answer that question. My point that "you draft Bridgewater if he is there" is that "you" means "Emery" and there's an assumption that Bridgewater is evaluated as a potential franchise QB. Obviously, if Emery's guys think he will suck, or only be mediocre, then sure, don't take him. But if he is evaluated as having significant change at becoming franchise-grade, yes, you absolutely do.

I'm watched some tape on Bridgewater, but I am not an NFL scout. To me he looks very good, his mechanics look great for a college QB, and he's clearly an amazing athlete. But what do I know? About as little as you. Many others who are experts, however, think he's the bomb. We are now in the pre-draft Misinformation Period, where many are leaking rumors about how much Clowney sucks and Bridgewater will go in the second round and so on to throw everyone off the scent. Please. This happens every single year. In all likelihood, both Clowney and Bridgewater will rock. If Bridgewater turns into a franchise QB, and he was there when the Bears pick at 14, then yes, it will have been a major mistake. Particularly if Emery's guys thought he had it in him.

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

maybe let me put this another way. Every single one of the teams that passed on Aaron Rodgers made a major mistake in not drafting him. EVERY ONE. Even the ones with settled QB situations in 2005. Including who picked at #14.

 

[63bears40]

What does "nonsense" have to do with "childish." In my experience, plenty of adults engage in nonsense. Stick to what I say. If I want to call you a child, I will do so. Promise.

Aaron Rodgers did fall far. So what? He wasn't a wasted pick at any point. If he had been drafted #1, but then sat his three years, would that have been a "wasted pick?" Good heavens, what nonsense. Yes, nonsense.

Again, many NFL stars have sat their first seasons largely out. There's nothing wrong with that. It's actually desirable.

In theory, the Packers could have kept Favre for another 6 years after they took Rodgers (3 with GB after Rodgers and the three viable years he played with NY/MINN). It was hardly taken as granted that Favre only had 1-2 years left, which is precisely why he got so pissed.

As for Bridgewater not being a potential franchise QB, OK, here you may have a point. Or you may not. I doubt that either you or I are the best qualified to answer that question. My point that "you draft Bridgewater if he is there" is that "you" means "Emery" and there's an assumption that Bridgewater is evaluated as a potential franchise QB. Obviously, if Emery's guys think he will suck, or only be mediocre, then sure, don't take him. But if he is evaluated as having significant change at becoming franchise-grade, yes, you absolutely do.

I'm watched some tape on Bridgewater, but I am not an NFL scout. To me he looks very good, his mechanics look great for a college QB, and he's clearly an amazing athlete. But what do I know? About as little as you. Many others who are experts, however, think he's the bomb. We are now in the pre-draft Misinformation Period, where many are leaking rumors about how much Clowney sucks and Bridgewater will go in the second round and so on to throw everyone off the scent. Please. This happens every single year. In all likelihood, both Clowney and Bridgewater will rock. If Bridgewater turns into a franchise QB, and he was there when the Bears pick at 14, then yes, it will have been a major mistake. Particularly if Emery's guys thought he had it in him.

Another great post Cali
I think Teddy is the best QB coming out. Johnny football will get killed if he continues to play like does. Bortles I've only seen him play once. So there is some uncertainty there.
Just think if Teddy is there @ 14 , you have to pick him. The trade value would be enormous . But would likely FU our D.

 

[JoeyTourettes]

maybe let me put this another way. Every single one of the teams that passed on Aaron Rodgers made a major mistake in not drafting him. EVERY ONE. Even the ones with settled QB situations in 2005. Including who picked at #14.

Ok, now we are getting into a different discussion. Hide Site is always 20/20... You could say that every team in the entire NFL is stupid for not drafting Tom Brady too, each team had multiple chances though multiple rounds to do so... Or how about how dumb Oakland was for taking JaMarcus Russell #1.

Bears, Cardinals, 49ers- have all been to superbowl since 2005. And Ravens and Saints have both WON superbowls since 2005 without drafting Rodgers- They all had a chance to take him...

All I'm saying is drafting a falling player in a NON need position. IN THE FIRST round...when you have needs in other spots isn't smart business- ESPECIALLY if you feel like you have a shot at doing something the next year- Like I believe the Bears do... a starting Safey/DT/.05CB... who would contribute right away. Is more important.

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

All I'm saying is drafting a falling player in a NON need position. IN THE FIRST round...when you have needs in other spots isn't smart business- ESPECIALLY if you feel like you have a shot at doing something the next year- Like I believe the Bears do... a starting Safey/DT/.05CB... who would contribute right away. Is more important.

Clearly, we are going to have to agree to disagree on this. You think drafting defensive BPA is the priority, and I think drafting potential franchise QB takes precedent over that. This is one horse we can now consider beaten to death (and in fewer posts than the long snapper argument).

 

[JoeyTourettes]

Clearly, we are going to have to agree to disagree on this. You think drafting defensive BPA is the priority, and I think drafting potential franchise QB takes precedent over that. This is one horse we can now consider beaten to death (and in fewer posts than the long snapper argument).

Agreed... and I understand it's off season and people are just coming up with stuff to talk about. No harm in that...just don't say stupid things.

 

[63bears40]

Agreed... and I understand it's off season and people are just coming up with stuff to talk about. No harm in that...just don't say stupid things.

Ah, c'mon we can't kill this post that easily.
Was begging my Bears to take Brady in rd 2, and every rd there after. I'm a big ten fan, so Rodgers was unfamiliar to me.
Just think Teddy will be a franchise guy. I've seen enough of his games to deem that.
If he's there @ 14 you have to take him. Hell he might even beat GB when his chance comes.

 

[55briggs]

no way.

 

[JoeyTourettes]

Ah, c'mon we can't kill this post that easily.
Was begging my Bears to take Brady in rd 2, and every rd there after. I'm a big ten fan, so Rodgers was unfamiliar to me.
Just think Teddy will be a franchise guy. I've seen enough of his games to deem that.
If he's there @ 14 you have to take him. Hell he might even beat GB when his chance comes.

I know I don't know some personalities on this board yet...but could it be that you are one of those...
"Cutler isn't going to do anything, we should just dump him"
"We should not resign Jay, and sign 35 year old Josh McCown instead...just look at how much better he is"
Are you one of those guys?

And this is just a veiled shot at him? Just one possibility I'm exploring. And trying to get to know the board. Cheers!

 

[Peter Gozintite]

I dont think we need a Bridgewater in this draft. I think Trestman knows best what type of QB fits in his system, and he made Josh McCown look like a stud. They should trade the pick, if he is there, to a desperate team that is willing to give us multiple picks in return.
Or we should just let the GM and HC figure out what to do.

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

"They should trade the pick, if he is there, to a desperate team that is willing to give us multiple picks in return"

Yes yes yes yes yes yes yes!!!!

this is my great fear with Emery in the draft. I have loved his free agency moves, his draft picks mixed, but how he has managed the draft itself, I completely detest. Most of why I have been livid with him was over how he did the draft, not who he picked. (although in a couple of cases that too)

Now we are coming into a draft that is supposedly very deep. Classic trade down draft, and supposedly most teams do want to trade down. Emery was so tight assed last year he passed on an extra third round pick from Atlanta just to prove a point (when drafting Long). In a trade-down heavy draft, being stubborn is harmful. I hope Emery shows some flex in the unlikely event some huge asset drops to us and some team calls to trade.

 

[63bears40]

I know I don't know some personalities on this board yet...but could it be that you are one of those...
"Cutler isn't going to do anything, we should just dump him"
"We should not resign Jay, and sign 35 year old Josh McCown instead...just look at how much better he is"
Are you one of those guys?

And this is just a veiled shot at him? Just one possibility I'm exploring. And trying to get to know the board. Cheers!

I'm a Bear fan pure and simple. Just want to see them make the best decisions going forward.
I love Jay (in a football sense) , and I loved what Josh did in his BU role.
If a franchise QB is available to you @ 14. You have to take him, no matter who is on your squad at the present time.
It would be an investment, if not in the immediate draft . Somewhere down the road. Teams pay a high price for franchise QBs. Whether it be Jay or Teddy, someone will pay dearly for their services.
I know we have immediate needs right now. But the big picture is what I'm looking at.
Hell we gave up 2 1rsts, a 3rd, and our starting QB for Jay & a 5th.
I doubt Teddy gets past Minny @ 10.
Just thought the topic might bring some discussion to a slow board.

 

[63bears40]

"They should trade the pick, if he is there, to a desperate team that is willing to give us multiple picks in return"

Yes yes yes yes yes yes yes!!!!

this is my great fear with Emery in the draft. I have loved his free agency moves, his draft picks mixed, but how he has managed the draft itself, I completely detest. Most of why I have been livid with him was over how he did the draft, not who he picked. (although in a couple of cases that too)

Now we are coming into a draft that is supposedly very deep. Classic trade down draft, and supposedly most teams do want to trade down. Emery was so tight assed last year he passed on an extra third round pick from Atlanta just to prove a point (when drafting Long). In a trade-down heavy draft, being stubborn is harmful. I hope Emery shows some flex in the unlikely event some huge asset drops to us and some team calls to trade.

In the draft nothing is a guarantee. Just seems Phil isn't a betting man. His guy was there he grabbed him. I have no complaints. Hell the kid made the pro bowl , when others were doubting he'd start. Sorry
Cali just couldn't pass that up. Again Love most of your posts.

 

[Peter Gozintite]

"They should trade the pick, if he is there, to a desperate team that is willing to give us multiple picks in return"

Yes yes yes yes yes yes yes!!!!

this is my great fear with Emery in the draft. I have loved his free agency moves, his draft picks mixed, but how he has managed the draft itself, I completely detest. Most of why I have been livid with him was over how he did the draft, not who he picked. (although in a couple of cases that too)

Now we are coming into a draft that is supposedly very deep. Classic trade down draft, and supposedly most teams do want to trade down. Emery was so tight assed last year he passed on an extra third round pick from Atlanta just to prove a point (when drafting Long). In a trade-down heavy draft, being stubborn is harmful. I hope Emery shows some flex in the unlikely event some huge asset drops to us and some team calls to trade.

I have to say that i loved that pick. He grabbed guys in FA, and took a high pick in the draft on our longest standing need, Oline. I didnt realize at the time how bad our defense was going to be, and didnt care. We had not addressed our biggest problem FOREVER, at least it seemed to me. I am still glad he took Long, the dude is a stud. Now addressing defense, and of course our hemoraging need for kicker is all draft now this year.

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

In the draft nothing is a guarantee. Just seems Phil isn't a betting man. His guy was there he grabbed him. I have no complaints. Hell the kid made the pro bowl , when others were doubting he'd start. Sorry
Cali just couldn't pass that up. Again Love most of your posts.

No, I get it, and who knows maybe someone else would in fact have drafted him in the intervening few spots. Again, I didn't have a problem with Long himself as the pick, my problem was with the fact that he passed on the "free" third. Obviously if he had gotten taken by someone else that would have been bad. He's played well, better than I expected, and was very surprised they threw him out there immediately.

 

[wood20ks]

No, I get it, and who knows maybe someone else would in fact have drafted him in the intervening few spots. Again, I didn't have a problem with Long himself as the pick, my problem was with the fact that he passed on the "free" third. Obviously if he had gotten taken by someone else that would have been bad. He's played well, better than I expected, and was very surprised they threw him out there immediately.

My last years pick that I wanted was a lb`er named Ogletree..........So I was a bit surprised we took Long as well after we signed Bushrod and Slausson.He`s panned out very well. I`m happy with the pick.

and getting back to the qb?.......

I still say,for whatever reason ,Bridgewater or one of the other 3 qbs are left,we draft one.

They say it takes a couple seasons for a qb to become an actuall NFL ready qb,we take one now,
Like someone else said earlier,if the Bears best ever qb in Cutler gets us anywhere,we will not have these high draft choices anymore.


So take the good(right now) with the bad.......The bad being in low draft choices from being in the playoffs.

So did that make any sense?

 

[leomaz]

I'm starting to like this Pryor kid and Roberson from Florida in the second round. I'm sure Emily will surprise all of us. Hopefully the picks will be ones used to strengthen our defense and not to try to get extra picks later on by drafting a QB. You hardly ever get value back for a failed first pick

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

the problem with Long at # 20 is that interior linemen simply aren't worth that high of a value by and large. I mean, the Lions got a very solid interior lineman last year as well in Larry Warford, looks like a good long term solution....in the third round! Even Logan Mankins, arguably the best interior lineman drafted in the last decade. He was drafted at # 32, and even with the clear hindsight of how that draft worked out he'd still probably be a high teens pick in a re-draft. And that's Logan Mankins.

I like Long so far, no kidding. But to the people who really think Emery would have been taking that much of a gamble in trading down a few spots with ATL (who traded up with whoever was right behind up and gave us a third) in the fear he would have been taken before we came up again, I've just never been convinced.