I think it's a mistake to go into "reload" mode

[NinerSickness]

ravens aren't winning with cam cameron

They're not? If Lee Evans held onto the friggn' ball they'd be in the SB next week. That's not "winning" to you?

 

[Flyingiguana]

They're not? If Lee Evans held onto the friggn' ball they'd be in the SB next week. That's not "winning" to you?

afc is weak this year. a healthy steelers or texans team is in the super bowl.

 

[NinerSickness]

That may be true. Ben shouldn't have even been playing.

 

[imac_21]

They're not? If Lee Evans held onto the friggn' ball they'd be in the SB next week. That's not "winning" to you?

There is some irony here. It's not as exact, but if Kyle Williams gets away from the punt that hit him int he knee. . . .

 

[NinerSickness]

There is some irony here. It's not as exact, but if Kyle Williams gets away from the punt that hit him int he knee. . . .

There's no irony at all. The Niners were "winning" too last year. The Ravens have done more of it over the last few years, but both teams are still winning.

Let's mix two different ideas.

On a COMPLETELY seperate note the Ravens had a better roster than the Niners did in 2011.

 

[tallglassofwater007]

On a COMPLETELY seperate note the Ravens had a better roster than the Niners did in 2011.

I agree with this. And I also think that 25 teams had a better roster than the Patriots. That's why a QB is so important. I don't think that better talent always equals playing better though. Which is kind of like saying they aren't a better team. I think we were a better team than Baltimore this year, but they probably had a higher level of talent. The Eagles are a perfect example of this. Until they stop the run they will never win with that team though.

 

[Texas9erFan]

Well I guess I just look at football as a team game where no position is more important than another. Sure good QBs are harder to find than RBs. And good RBs are harder to find than guards. But in the end, all the pieces have to fit together and play together as a unit... on all sides of the ball.

I see the Niners as having more of the right pieces in the right places than any other team in the league. We do need two pieces that are quite difficult to find however. And expensive.

I would rather see the Niner front office take a conservative approach in the off-season and try to preserve as much of the 2011 team as possible. Bring that team back and give 'em another shot at glory. If they can upgrade at receiver then do so. I wouldn't sacrifice our current team and spend a shitload of money and draft picks trying to upgrade at QB.

I want to see what Alex can do with some coaching & system continuity and see if his game can really improve. I think and hope that it can. He may never be as good as Aaron Rodgers or Drew Brees, but he could be at least as good as Eli Manning if given the chance.

 

[NinerSickness]

He may never be as good as Aaron Rodgers or Drew Brees, but he could be at least as good as Eli Manning if given the chance.

Eli has developed into one of the most dangerous QBs in the league. I think that's either underestimating Eli or overestimating Alex.

 

[Flyingiguana]

i bet the saints think he's dangerous

 

[Kinzu]

Eli has developed into one of the most dangerous QBs in the league. I think that's either underestimating Eli or overestimating Alex.

This past season was the best in Eli's 8 year career. He's always been able to make all throws but usually his decision making has not been so great. It was only a year or two ago he had some ungodly number of turnovers and until he had that stretch of good games to win the Super Bowl the media loved picking out his flaws. It's just now that Peyton is at the end of his career they want to saying he may be the better Manning (which is a joke in itself).

Maybe Eli finally gets it and will be an elite QB from this point on, but if you go based on his 8 year career he will regress next season and turn the ball over more. Then again he has 3 studs to throw the ball to now. I swear those guys are more responsible for Eli's play this year than he is.

 

[tallglassofwater007]

This past season was the best in Eli's 8 year career. He's always been able to make all throws but usually his decision making has not been so great. It was only a year or two ago he had some ungodly number of turnovers and until he had that stretch of good games to win the Super Bowl the media loved picking out his flaws. It's just now that Peyton is at the end of his career they want to saying he may be the better Manning (which is a joke in itself).

Maybe Eli finally gets it and will be an elite QB from this point on, but if you go based on his 8 year career he will regress next season and turn the ball over more. Then again he has 3 studs to throw the ball to now. I swear those guys are more responsible for Eli's play this year than he is.

Last year I think he had 26 picks. But I don't think those guys are the reason he is playing better this year. He has made some pretty great throws this season. I think that those guys help for sure, but the guy is playing at a really high level this year.

I'm not saying this is what you are saying by any means, but I think a lot of 49er fans are quick to say how a receiver makes QBs so much better right now. Kind of taking away from the QBs now, yet Montana had the absolute greatest receiver of all time to throw to and that never takes away from him. Not to mention some other really good pieces to throw the ball to for years.

 

[Texas9erFan]

Last year I think he had 26 picks. But I don't think those guys are the reason he is playing better this year. He has made some pretty great throws this season. I think that those guys help for sure, but the guy is playing at a really high level this year.

I'm not saying this is what you are saying by any means, but I think a lot of 49er fans are quick to say how a receiver makes QBs so much better right now. Kind of taking away from the QBs now, yet Montana had the absolute greatest receiver of all time to throw to and that never takes away from him. Not to mention some other really good pieces to throw the ball to for years.

If the 26 picks part is true, perhaps Alex can become an even better QB than Eli.
One thing Alex did very well this year is protect the ball and not turn it over. THAT'S HUGE! If he can continue to do that and become a better passer it could redefine what is required from a good QB in the NFL. Teams will go to school on him and learn that a QB doesn't have to have a strong arm, doesn't have to carry the team on his shoulders.

I've always thought having an "elite" QB is more of a fantasy football thing anyway. The real game of football is different. Stats are meaningless. Winning is the only thing that matters. And if you're not turning the ball over(NFCCG), you're usually going to win.

Our team is solid. We need very little change to be competitive again next year. We really only need 1 or two good picks. So trade the bulk of our picks to move up in the draft and get one or two receivers and call it a done deal. Then ignore FA unless there is a steal of a deal that we can't ignore.

 

[maniax]

This past season was the best in Eli's 8 year career. He's always been able to make all throws but usually his decision making has not been so great. It was only a year or two ago he had some ungodly number of turnovers and until he had that stretch of good games to win the Super Bowl the media loved picking out his flaws. It's just now that Peyton is at the end of his career they want to saying he may be the better Manning (which is a joke in itself).

Maybe Eli finally gets it and will be an elite QB from this point on, but if you go based on his 8 year career he will regress next season and turn the ball over more. Then again he has 3 studs to throw the ball to now. I swear those guys are more responsible for Eli's play this year than he is.

Cruz is a great slot receiver, and Nicks is good, Manningham is just ok.
I would consider Cruz a stud slot receiver, but the other two are not studs in the same category as other Pro Bowl WRs.

I think Cruz is the only one out of the 3 that has a chance to make the Pro Bowl someday in the NFC.

 

[dredinis21]

Sick, you are off of your rocker if you think the solution is to blow up the best defense in football because of "realistic" expectations to win a SB. We were a couple solid receivers away from being in the SB and you want to gut the roster based on the false premise that we don't have that "franchise QB"? Really? It would seem so much simpler if you would focus on signing solid WR via FA or drafting WR along with roster depth then it would to trade our most durable, most productive player simply because of the man-crush you have developed for Mario Williams. Then give the offense an entire offseason and mini-camps to further develop a rapport and rhythm that would carry over into the season. We are closer to repeating 13-3 then we are 7-9, barring injuries, so why take us BACK to 7-9 with needless trade talk and this idea of taking from our obvious team strength in order to waste seasons rebuilding. This team has an identity. It has a cohesiveness to it. You want to blow that up? Justin Smith is like BY to me...you don't trade him, you don't let him walk, you don't do anything but ask him to show up everyday and set the example that spreads to the rest of the team.

 

[NinerSickness]

We were a couple solid receivers away from being in the SB

No the 2011 49ers were a couple of WRs away from being in the SB. 2012 is an entirely different story.

and you want to gut the roster based on the false premise that we don't have that "franchise QB"?

That's not a false premise. The 49ers have an average QB.

It would seem so much simpler if you would focus on signing solid WR via FA or drafting WR along with roster depth then it would to trade our most durable, most productive player simply because of the man-crush you have developed for Mario Williams.

Simpler? Yes. Better idea? Hell no. You, like more 49er fans, have been suckered in by the fact that the 2011 49ers made it to the top 4 that they have one of the 4 best rosters in the NFL (INCLUDING QB PEOPLE! A QB is part of the roster). They don't. Long term planning is still necessary. And if they're smart they need to go with Kaepernick not Alex.

Then give the offense an entire offseason and mini-camps to further develop a rapport and rhythm that would carry over into the season.

That's a non sequitor. Every team is going to have a full offseason & minicamps.

Who was pretty much the ONLY person here who said the 49ers would not make it to the SB even when they got the #2 seed? It's funny you use the word man-crush because you're acting like a fan with a crush, and I'm acting like a completely impartial observer. The 49ers are not as talented as you think they are.

 

[deep9er]

No the 2011 49ers were a couple of WRs away from being in the SB. 2012 is an entirely different story.



That's not a false premise. The 49ers have an average QB.



Simpler? Yes. Better idea? Hell no. You, like more 49er fans, have been suckered in by the fact that the 2011 49ers made it to the top 4 that they have one of the 4 best rosters in the NFL (INCLUDING QB PEOPLE! A QB is part of the roster). They don't. Long term planning is still necessary. And if they're smart they need to go with Kaepernick not Alex.



That's a non sequitor. Every team is going to have a full offseason & minicamps.

Who was pretty much the ONLY person here who said the 49ers would not make it to the SB even when they got the #2 seed? It's funny you use the word man-crush because you're acting like a fan with a crush, and I'm acting like a completely impartial observer. The 49ers are not as talented as you think they are.

yes, they're a little short of being a SERIOUS contender. they could still win it as evidenced by this season, but they won't be favorites in 2012.

the 49ers are however, good enough to be a play-off team. teams reaching this level now turn to free agency to fill the final key pieces. free agents include our own and granted we happen to have more than few. we won't force any nor all, and Baalke should use 'prudence' like last year.

the draft may still help but we're now drafting #30, it'll take some luck to get immediate help.

 

[dredinis21]

The problem with your assessing an offseason as a non sequitor is silly. This team went 13-3 with an ENTIRELY DIFFERENT TEAM PHILOSOPHY AT EVERY PHASE OF THE GAME BEING INTRODUCED TO THEM. What other team with new HC did as well? For you to say that "every other team has an offseason as well" is half-assed. The teams that WE need to worry about aren't really doing much but getting used to new personnel to fit their respective systems. GB? NO? BAL? NYG? PIT? NE? None of those teams are implementing new systems....NONE!

The Niners are not as talented as I think they are? You are full of shit. Simple as that. This IS a talented team. This is a SB contender. They proved that this season. We are a couple pieces away from being one of, if not the most complete football team in the NFL. Going into the NFC Championship game, Mark Schlereth and other pundits considered our team the most complete team left in the playoffs. They all mentioned the weaknesses on offense but held on to SUPERIOR ST and D to make their respective points. You being the ONLY one that stated the Niners would not make it to the SB then gloated as if you are nostradamus is laughable considering how close the Niners actually came being in the Super Bowl. Your crush for Mario Williams is blinding your ability to look at rosters, cap space, and reality. Mario Williams is currently hitting the Texans at a 18.9 mil clip per season. You think signing a FA non-QB to that kind of cap hit is the long term solution to sustainability for this franchise? Someone who is frankly better suited for a 4-3, which we don't play? Yes, let us blow up our top notch 3-4 D and sign a 4-3 end with a bloated cap number and pray that he is somewhat durable. While we are at it, why don't we trade the guy who has PROVEN to be not just durable but also supremely productive. Yup, solid logic.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

If the 26 picks part is true, perhaps Alex can become an even better QB than Eli.
One thing Alex did very well this year is protect the ball and not turn it over. THAT'S HUGE! If he can continue to do that and become a better passer it could redefine what is required from a good QB in the NFL. Teams will go to school on him and learn that a QB doesn't have to have a strong arm, doesn't have to carry the team on his shoulders.

I've always thought having an "elite" QB is more of a fantasy football thing anyway. The real game of football is different. Stats are meaningless. Winning is the only thing that matters. And if you're not turning the ball over(NFCCG), you're usually going to win.

Our team is solid. We need very little change to be competitive again next year. We really only need 1 or two good picks. So trade the bulk of our picks to move up in the draft and get one or two receivers and call it a done deal. Then ignore FA unless there is a steal of a deal that we can't ignore.

Seriously? Alex Smith is going to redefine the QB position by protecting the ball and throwing for 200 yards and one TD a game? I've got news for you: that sort of QB play has had its heyday already. Given the rule changes, that sort of performance will never define anything but average or slightly above-average QB play.

I don't mean to belittle what Smith did this season. He showed tremendous improvement and his ability to protect the ball was huge. Because we had phenomenal defense and STs. On a team that could not lean so heavily on those other units, Smith could just as easily have gone 3-13. Your argument about "meaningless stats" aside, there is a pretty strong correlation between elite QB play and the top teams in the league. Too strong to simply disregard as coincidence.

I'm certainly not in favor of blowing up the team, as Sick proposes. We have a great foundation, do not rely heavily on older players (at 32, Justin Smith can play at a very high level for three or four more years, especially given his health history, his work ethic, and his reliance on power and technique more than speed), and the offense should only get better with another year in the system and some hopefully key additions this offseason. But like the Ravens or Jets, we will find it difficult to compete year-in and year-out with an average QB. I'd take Smith before Flacco or Sanchez for this team right now, but he is limited. That said, Harbaugh has found a way to make things work with every QB he has touched, and he has a phenomenally talented one to work with in Kaepernick. I am very interested to see how he develops over the next year or two. If he can assume the starting spot in two years, we could be in very good shape for a long time.

 

[h0ckeysk83r]

So I disagree with some of you (imac) who believe the Niners are "close" to a SB despite the fact that they got close this year. More specifically I don't think the Niners are close from a personnel standpoint.

Teams like the Packers, Saints, Pats, Ravens, Steelers, etc all went into the season knowing they were contenders from a personnel standpoint. Their offseasons were designed to fill any holes that are missing. The Niners, on the other hand, are still waiting for the foundation to dry.

Let's be honest: The Niners got pretty lucky against the Saints. But just because the Niners were a combination of lucky and playing to the maximum of their capabilities doesn't mean they will be next year. Next year they're gonna have a 1st place schedule; the Rams, Cardinals & Seahawks are all probably going to be better.

The Niners need to still be making long term personnel moves rather than doing touch up work. I'm not saying the Niners CAN'T win a SB next year; a lucky bounce or two and the Niners would be playing the Pats next week (I think they would've lost on a neutral turf though). I just think they should be as concerned with 2013 & 2014 as they are with 2012.

That deserves a...... come on man!

 

[Ray_Dogg]

We can make a run at Williams if we let Carlos and Brooks walk. Check my last post in the off-season thread to see how.