Howard Did Not Want To Play With D'antoni Or Kobe

[True Lakers Fan]

How can "rings are all that matters" be taken out of context?

But what Magic replied to wasn't about _____vs._____. It was about James' top 3 players. Boo fucking Hoo that poor wittle Magic wasn't on it.

Pippen's 6 > Magic

When you make the ignorant statement accusing Magic Johnson of saying that Adam Morrison is better the Carl Malone. Magic was talking about when you compare champions or elite players. For example you will never here Charles Barkely in the same sentence as Magic Johnson, Shaq Oneal, Kobe Bryant, and others who won titles. It's a common extreme that you and the other ignorant asses do in here in trying to prove your point

 

[True Lakers Fan]

Hey dumb ass - Scottie Pippen was a role player - Magic Johnson was leader. Again Magic was talking about comparing leader vs leader and the ring count is the measuring stick. Role player vs role player Scottie was better 100 times over Robert Horry. He actually is an exception to the rule because he was more of a parasite anyway

 

[trojanfan12]

Well, it's a hell of a a lot closer then having the worst record in the league.

Agreed, but not championship contenders either.

And you call THAT an endorsement for Kobe over James

James/Shaq would have brought titles with that supporting cast more then likely in years 1 or 2!

Never said it was endorsement of Kobe over Lebron. In fact, I have no problem saying Lebron is better than Kobe!!

As I've said before, Kobe is higher on the all-time list right now. However, Kobe is at the end of his career and Lebron has just entered his prime. I fully expect that by the time Lebron retires, he will have passed Kobe on the all-time list!!

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

The 1995-96 (the year before Kobe was drafted) Lakers were 53-29, finished 2nd in their division and lost in the 1st round of the playoffs 3-1!! They were hardly championship contenders. They put themselves in the title mix that off-season by signing Shaq and drafting Kobe!! It still took them 4 years to win their 1st title when Phil Jackson was hired as coach in 2000!!

Uh, last I heard, Michael Jordan was never a Laker or Lakers fan and he says it's about rings. So does Larry Bird.

Also, many players who don't have rings (Charles Barkley, Karl Malone, etc.) also agree it's about rings!! No problem if you want to make the claim that LBJ is better than Kobe, but don't make crap up and pretend it's only Lakers fans that say it's about rings!!

Rings are PART of the equation. Championships are won by TEAMS.
James currently has 2 and counting........as the BEST player on his team.

OBVIOUSLY, any player who already has 4 league MVP's and is still getting better is a better player then somebody who has 1 league MVP and has no chance to ever win another.

NOT rocket science, boys!

 

[trojanfan12]

Rings are PART of the equation. Championships are won by TEAMS.
James currently has 2 and counting........as the BEST player on his team.

OBVIOUSLY, any player who already has 4 league MVP's and is still getting better is a better player then somebody who has 1 league MVP and has no chance to ever win another.

NOT rocket science, boys!

True, but it's not exactly how the all-time greats look at it. Every time there's a discussion, they all always boil it down to rings as the deciding factor.

You Heat fans need to slow your roll about Lebron. If he gets his rings, he'll get his respect and move on up the list!!

How about we all just let him finish his career before worrying about where he ranks?

 

[True Lakers Fan]

That is what happens when you win rings, you get away with saying stupid, arrogant asshole things and belittling those coming after you because you are a tired bitter old man who can not GM/coach/commentate their way out of the lottery contention versions of those things.

Then because you are a public figure morons live on their every word and go bombing innocents in bars just following the orders of skip bayless.

Not only that but dumbass Heat fans in here get really pissed everytime someone says something that they think belittles what Miami has done. That is kind of common though for a team like Miami that for so many years had developed a culture being losers and then win a few. They get big for their britches and think they are something special when they just merely chicken shit

 

[True Lakers Fan]

True, but it's not exactly how the all-time greats look at it. Every time there's a discussion, they all always boil it down to rings as the deciding factor.

You Heat fans need to slow your roll about Lebron. If he gets his rings, he'll get his respect and move on up the list!!

How about we all just let him finish his career before worrying about where he ranks?

You have to understand something from what I heard last week. Miami for most of their existence had got used to a culture of losing. So as a group of losers, they are not used to the culture of winning and they don't know how to handle it. They are scared that it won't continue and so they are trying to develop their arguments in case it doesn't last. That what fans used to being in a culture of losers do when they start winning

 

[lakersrule]

While Kobe has been on 5 championship teams, he has only been the best player on
2 of those teams.

Why is it when talking rings, Kobe's are the only ones that get marginalized? Does Wade only get credit for 1? Shaq and Duncan for 3? Pippen 0? Who gets credit for Boston's: Pierce or KG? Should Ray Ray get credit for the last one? Categorize rings all you like, but fact is Kobe has 5 rings and he earned all 5 of them being a major player on those title winning teams.

 

[True Lakers Fan]

Uh, last I heard, Michael Jordan was never a Laker or Lakers fan and he says it's about rings. So does Larry Bird.

Also, many players who don't have rings (Charles Barkley, Karl Malone, etc.) also agree it's about rings!! No problem if you want to make the claim that LBJ is better than Kobe, but don't make crap up and pretend it's only Lakers fans that say it's about rings!!

I have come to expect that kind of crap from these retards

 

[lakersrule]

"NBA Championship rings are all that matter; Jordan 6, Me 5, Bird 3, LeBron 2
and Dr. J 1."

Didn't Lebron name Jordan, Bird, and Dr. J as his top 3? So Magic responded with the ring count of himself, LeBron, and Lebron's top 3. I don't think this has anything to do with comparing all the all-time greats. I'm sure Magic thinks highly of Cap and Russell. The things some people make a big deal about...

 

[trojanfan12]

You have to understand something from what I heard last week. Miami for most of their existence had got used to a culture of losing. So as a group of losers, they are not used to the culture of winning and they don't know how to handle it. They are scared that it won't continue and so they are trying to develop their arguments in case it doesn't last. That what fans used to being in a culture of losers do when they start winning

Sorry, as much as I want your "culture of losing" theory to be true, I don't think it is!!

The Heat were established in 1988. In that time, they have won:

10 Division titles
4 Conference titles
3 NBA titles

Haven't looked it up, but off the top of my head, I believe that is only surpassed by the Bulls, Lakers and Spurs over the same time frame!!

 

[True Lakers Fan]

Why is it when talking rings, Kobe's are the only ones that get marginalized? Does Wade only get credit for 1? Shaq and Duncan for 3? Pippen 0? Who gets credit for Boston's: Pierce or KG? Should Ray Ray get credit for the last one? Categorize rings all you like, but fact is Kobe has 5 rings and he earned all 5 of them being a major player on those title winning teams.

The person that said Kobe was only the best on two of those teams is really talking stupid as usual because That team was called the dynamic duo for a very good reason. That reason is because Kobe and Shaq collectively the best players in the NBA period. That was an understood and stated fact throughout the league at the time

 

[trojanfan12]

Why is it when talking rings, Kobe's are the only ones that get marginalized? Does Wade only get credit for 1? Shaq and Duncan for 3? Pippen 0? Who gets credit for Boston's: Pierce or KG? Should Ray Ray get credit for the last one? Categorize rings all you like, but fact is Kobe has 5 rings and he earned all 5 of them being a major player on those title winning teams.

If we're marginalizing rings, maybe Wade should have 0!! After all, he had to have Shaq to get his 1st (same guy everyone says is responsible for Kobe's first 3) and he didn't get his next 2 until Lebron became the Heat's acknowledged leader!!

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Categorize rings all you like, but fact is Kobe has 5 rings and he earned all 5 of them being a major player on those title winning teams.[/

QUOTE]

I totally agree.
However, rings are won by great teams.

Kobe has had far more chances then James to accumulate them.

It's not that hard. Kobe was on a championship roster 4 years ago, but hasn't won a 2nd round playoff game since.

The reason is because his TEAMS were on the decline.

In those same 3 years, James has played for 3 championships because his TEAM was on the rise.


As far as the better player, the stats, the MVP's clearly tell the story.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

[

QUOTE=trojanfan12;3496070]If we're marginalizing rings, maybe Wade should have 0!! After all, he had to have Shaq to get his 1st (same guy everyone says is responsible for Kobe's first 3) and he didn't get his next 2 until Lebron became the Heat's acknowledged leader!!

[/QUOTE]



Wade had probably the greatest 4 game run that I have ever seen.
Shaq was a big part of getting them there.

Wade was the deciding factor in that series, EASILY.

 

[trojanfan12]

Wade had probably the greatest 4 game run that I have ever seen.
Shaq was a big part of getting them there.

Wade was the deciding factor in that series, EASILY.

Maybe, but without Shaq, Wade isn't even in the finals and it was Shaq that came in knowing how to win championships and who guaranteed that the Heat would get one!!

Wade had a great 4 game run, but Kobe had some great runs with Shaq on the team as well!! Problem is, no one wants to credit Kobe!!

 

[OutlawImmortal]

C'mon now, Bosh/Wade have to equal to almost a Shaq. Especially when other teams are held back by the League from trying to put together a similar roster.

 

[lakersrule]

QUOTE]

I totally agree.
However, rings are won by great teams.

Kobe has had far more chances then James to accumulate them.

It's not that hard. Kobe was on a championship roster 4 years ago, but hasn't won a 2nd round playoff game since.

The reason is because his TEAMS were on the decline.

In those same 3 years, James has played for 3 championships because his TEAM was on the rise.


As far as the better player, the stats, the MVP's clearly tell the story.

No kidding. Not sure what your points of the bolded parts are. I wasn't comparing who is the better player. I just don't understand why people have to marginalize Kobe's rings in order to make them feel better about Lebron's.

 

[BOTSLAYER]

No kidding. Not sure what your points of the bolded parts are. I wasn't comparing who is the better player. I just don't understand why people have to marginalize Kobe's rings in order to make them feel better about Lebron's.

If that is the case it is wrong imo but the comparison between the 2s career and place among GOAT was brought up.

I think a lot feel that if LBJ was teamed with Shaq-prime in LA he would have at least 3 rings...and they might possibly still be playing together.

It really is too bad the LBJ went to cleveland, and that Kobe was not a little more like LBJ.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Maybe, but without Shaq, Wade isn't even in the finals and it was Shaq that came in knowing how to win championships and who guaranteed that the Heat would get one!!

Wade had a great 4 game run, but Kobe had some great runs with Shaq on the team as well!! Problem is, no one wants to credit Kobe!!

You will never here me say Kobe didn't earn all 5 of his rings.
To say different is asinine.

However:
Kobe was only the best player on only 2 of those 5 teams.

Shaq earned the Laker MVPs that he won.
Wade earned the Heat MVP that he won.

Kobe has more rings because Kobe had been on better teams.

Kobe isn't winning any more rings as a Laker unless he has himself cryogenized and waits until the Lakers are contenders again to finish his career there.

James, BY FAR, is the better over all around player as is proven by all the stats and 4 and still growing league MVPs.

If the 2 switched career paths, James would already have more then 5 rings and Kobe MIGHT have 2, because I think if Kobe was on the Heat team that lost to the Mavs instead of James, I feel they would have won.