Game of Thrones: House of the Dragon

[calsnowskier]

My big problem right now is with Rheanyra. The choice of actress is almost as bad as they did with the recast Darrio. The two actresses look nothing alike. And it doesn’t help Emma D’Arcy that not only is Milly Alcott 1000x better looking than her, but she absolutely NAILED the character. D’Arcy has a huge uphill battle in front of her with this character.

 

[flyerhawk]

Doesn't matter. From a story telling standpoint, its garbage. I don't care if its prologue. This show isn't tracking 100% with the book anyway. Make something up. The way they approach this was sloppy. Either make up some details to fill in the story or skip all the prologue, go right into the civil war and fill in the necessary details with flashbacks.

I'm not sure there was much the show runners could really do.

They could have started here and down some expository backstory but that isn't great story telling and it would have been very difficult to do that with Daemon and Rhaenyra's relationship in an effective manner. I think it was important for the show to make it clear why Alicent really doesn't like Rhaenyra both because of her actions and because of the threat she poses to her children.

I thought this was easily the best episode of the season on its own and I'm far more invested in the show now than I was beforehand.

 

[flyerhawk]

My big problem right now is with Rheanyra. The choice of actress is almost as bad as they did with the recast Darrio. The two actresses look nothing alike. And it doesn’t help Emma D’Arcy that not only is Milly Alcott 1000x better looking than her, but she absolutely NAILED the character. D’Arcy has a huge uphill battle in front of her with this character.

I think the show is trying to make a very clear distinction between young Rhaenyra and older Rhaenyra. Young Rhaenyra was a free spirit fighting against the patriarchal rules of her society who ultimately acceded to the demands of that society. Older Rhaenyra is now trying to survive in that society, living with a husband that obviously cannot sire children with her and now forced to defend her life and the lives of her children.

 

[flyerhawk]

The one aspect I don't really like is that they are making Alicent the "bad" of this story, including the actor saying that she's like a "woman for Trump". Sorry, but leaving the politics aside, in that world she's absolutely right with her concerns, particularly considering that Rhaynera's kids are obviously not Valeryans.

I don't know that they are making her the bad per se. I think it is more accurate to say that she is starting to break bad. She made a deal with a pretty horrible person who wound up murdering his father and brother. She was clearly aghast by that but she also does have blood on her hands.

Her concerns are, first and foremost, about her own kids.

 

[DarthVedder]

I don't know that they are making her the bad per se. I think it is more accurate to say that she is starting to break bad. She made a deal with a pretty horrible person who wound up murdering his father and brother. She was clearly aghast by that but she also does have blood on her hands.

Her concerns are, first and foremost, about her own kids.

I don't know... From Alicent demanding to see Rhanyera's kid the moment he was born, to her snarky comments to Laenor, she's being portrayed as kind-of a villain. Rhanyera was portrayed as the victim of Alicent's over-jealousy, and she even offered a solution by marrying her heir to Alicent's daughter, but that was rejected.

As I said, in that world, Alicent's concerns are warranted, but she could have expressed them in a different manner.

 

[flyerhawk]

I don't know... From Alicent demanding to see Rhanyera's kid the moment he was born, to her snarky comments to Laenor, she's being portrayed as kind-of a villain. Rhanyera was portrayed as the victim of Alicent's over-jealousy, and she even offered a solution by marrying her heir to Alicent's daughter, but that was rejected.

As I said, in that world, Alicent's concerns are warranted, but she could have expressed them in a different manner.

Well clearly they are building the upcoming war as Rhaenyra vs Alicent.

I guess I don't really see Alicent as being any better or worse than Rhaenyra. The show has given more screen time and perspective to Rhaenyra so there is a tendency to have more sympathy for her. But she is the same person who nearly slept with her uncle in a brothel and has bastard children. Granted the bastard children wouldn't be necessary if her husband could actually do his job.

Which is why I think it was important to show the 10 years before stuff. It helps to show why Alicent is not a fan of Rhaenyra but also explains why Rhaenyra is in the spot she is in.

 

[DarthVedder]

Well clearly they are building the upcoming war as Rhaenyra vs Alicent.

I guess I don't really see Alicent as being any better or worse than Rhaenyra. The show has given more screen time and perspective to Rhaenyra so there is a tendency to have more sympathy for her. But she is the same person who nearly slept with her uncle in a brothel and has bastard children. Granted the bastard children wouldn't be necessary if her husband could actually do his job.

Which is why I think it was important to show the 10 years before stuff. It helps to show why Alicent is not a fan of Rhaenyra but also explains why Rhaenyra is in the spot she is in.

That's the way I've seen it through the series... two sides that, on that world, both are right and wrong, and both have their heroes and villains.

But this last episode made sure to put Alicent on a bad light, and even made Criston into an asshole, while portraying Rhaenyra and her family (even Laenor) as good, when Rhaenyra's "indiscretions" are the root of the upcoming troubles.

 

[flyerhawk]

That's the way I've seen it through the series... two sides that, on that world, both are right and wrong, and both have their heroes and villains.

But this last episode made sure to put Alicent on a bad light, and even made Criston into an asshole, while portraying Rhaenyra and her family (even Laenor) as good, when Rhaenyra's "indiscretions" are the root of the upcoming troubles.

Criston IS an asshole. He bangs Rhaenyra and then decides that she needs to give up her life and run away with her or he needs to kill himself? And he's so unhinged about it decides to murder someone for even mentioning it. And now he's calling her a cvnt?

I felt this episode was set up to show that Rhaenyra was in a defensive position, fighting off accusations that he children were bastards and that Alicent was using that to help her children. IMO, they have made it very clear that Alicent sees Rhaenyra ascending to the throne as very bad for the health of her children. Which is why she aligns with Larys and now she's clearly going down a dark path.

 

[mr.hockey4242]

I'm liking the pacing of the show. It did enough to build up the conflict and let us get to know the main players.

While also not wasting too much time getting to the time period of the conflict. Everything is going to move much slower now and I think things moved properly even if it wasn't flawless.

Also the two main adult actresses are both fantastic and will more than carry the load from here.

 

[Duffman]

My big problem right now is with Rheanyra. The choice of actress is almost as bad as they did with the recast Darrio. The two actresses look nothing alike. And it doesn’t help Emma D’Arcy that not only is Milly Alcott 1000x better looking than her, but she absolutely NAILED the character. D’Arcy has a huge uphill battle in front of her with this character.

Is it because this new Rheanyra doesn’t have a distractingly obvious overbite with her gigantic horse teeth compared to the young Rheanyra? Be honest it’s that isn’t it.

 

[calsnowskier]

Is it because this new Rheanyra doesn’t have a distractingly obvious overbite with her gigantic horse teeth compared to the young Rheanyra? Be honest it’s that isn’t it.

Or thatthe new actress talks out of the side of her mouth?

 

[DarthVedder]

At least I'm not the only one struggling with Rhaenyra's name... I'm sure I've misspelled in several different ways many times.

 

[wildturkey]

I'm not sure there was much the show runners could really do.

They could have started here and down some expository backstory but that isn't great story telling and it would have been very difficult to do that with Daemon and Rhaenyra's relationship in an effective manner. I think it was important for the show to make it clear why Alicent really doesn't like Rhaenyra both because of her actions and because of the threat she poses to her children.

I thought this was easily the best episode of the season on its own and I'm far more invested in the show now than I was beforehand.

Get creative. There's stuff they can do, they just didn't try. They're adhering too close to the book, which is sparse on details itself. Fuck the book. You're telling a TV story. It is NOT good story structure doing it the way they did it no matter how much the GOT/HotD book fanboys cling to the excuses.You're essentially making filler episodes, but filler episodes in this case are necessary to give the characters actual character and meaning. Setting up chess pieces and knocking them off the table in one episode is not good story telling structure for television (or anything really). And if you can't do it, then pick a different entry point. If you really want to be blunt about it, there's not much you need from this time period other than Rhaenyra/Alicent got beef and that can easily be established with dialogue and flashbacks with skilled show runners.

There's two ways to handle this time period; either spend little time and just hit the necessary beats or spend more time by fleshing out more details even if you have to make some up that aren't in the book. Instead, they choose a third option that tries to split it down the middle and it comes out sloppy.

And I'm probably just angsty because I've had to explain to a few TV only people just what the fuck is going on. Which in itself, is a sign the show didn't handle things the best they could have

 

[mr.hockey4242]

Get creative. There's stuff they can do, they just didn't try. They're adhering too close to the book, which is sparse on details itself. Fuck the book. You're telling a TV story. It is NOT good story structure doing it the way they did it no matter how much the GOT/HotD book fanboys cling to the excuses.You're essentially making filler episodes, but filler episodes in this case are necessary to give the characters actual character and meaning. Setting up chess pieces and knocking them off the table in one episode is not good story telling structure for television (or anything really). And if you can't do it, then pick a different entry point. If you really want to be blunt about it, there's not much you need from this time period other than Rhaenyra/Alicent got beef and that can easily be established with dialogue and flashbacks with skilled show runners.

There's two ways to handle this time period; either spend little time and just hit the necessary beats or spend more time by fleshing out more details even if you have to make some up that aren't in the book. Instead, they choose a third option that tries to split it down the middle and it comes out sloppy.

And I'm probably just angsty because I've had to explain to a few TV only people just what the fuck is going on. Which in itself, is a sign the show didn't handle things the best they could have

I am just personally not going to agree with your overall view. I think what we got was good and built in the backstrories/tension well.

I will say though, I do think one hinderance to it was the requirement of different female actresses.

Because the younger versions got people attached to them, that it makes the change worse for a lot of them. Even though the older actresses we have now are objectively better more experienced actress at this point in time and fit the characters far better for the up coming conflict. Neither the Queen or Princess should look like teenagers for the coming war. So the change was needed but also in hind sight kind of a hinderance.

 

[flyerhawk]

I am just personally not going to agree with your overall view. I think what we got was good and built in the backstrories/tension well.

I will say though, I do think one hinderance to it was the requirement of different female actresses.

Because the younger versions got people attached to them, that it makes the change worse for a lot of them. Even though the older actresses we have now are objectively better more experienced actress at this point in time and fit the characters far better for the up coming conflict. Neither the Queen or Princess should look like teenagers for the coming war. So the change was needed but also in hind sight kind of a hinderance.

Agreed. I think it was important to show the younger versions especially Rhaenyra because you see her as youthful and full of vitality and independence.

Now we see Rhaenyra, mother of 3 and clearly far more more weary.

My only real gripe is that the older Rhaenyra looks nothing like the younger one. I have no idea why they chose the younger actress given her pronounced overbite which makes her look very distinctive and difficult to find in an older person.

 

[mr.hockey4242]

Agreed. I think it was important to show the younger versions especially Rhaenyra because you see her as youthful and full of vitality and independence.

Now we see Rhaenyra, mother of 3 and clearly far more more weary.

My only real gripe is that the older Rhaenyra looks nothing like the younger one. I have no idea why they chose the younger actress given her pronounced overbite which makes her look very distinctive and difficult to find in an older person.

Yeah the Alicent actresses look much more alike. Youre right that with Rhaenyra we have to suspend belieft that some really good dentists are in Kings Landing.

She was a good actress so maybe that and her having a solid Targaryn look(minus the overbite) trumped everything else.

Other part I find funny is some of the people complaining about the change also blame the older actress for not looking like the younger. You really think they cast the girl who is in 5 episodes before the girl who is going to headline the show for seasons?? Haha. Just cause you saw one act first, doesnt mean she was cast on the show first.

 

[flyerhawk]

Yeah the Alicent actresses look much more alike. Youre right that with Rhaenyra we have to suspend belieft that some really good dentists are in Kings Landing.

She was a good actress so maybe that and her having a solid Targaryn look(minus the overbite) trumped everything else.

Other part I find funny is some of the people complaining about the change also blame the older actress for not looking like the younger. You really think they cast the girl who is in 5 episodes before the girl who is going to headline the show for seasons?? Haha. Just cause you saw one act first, doesnt mean she was cast on the show first.

Yeah. That's kinda silly. I'm not all that bothered that she doesn't look similar. It's a TV show after all. I was more surprised that they couldn't fine a single 20 year old actress that would be a better fit. But no big either way.

 

[justanidiot]

Finally got to watch it, seemed more like 15 year jump, surprised the king was still alive and people actually touched him. Apparently all bastards.
I guess the best take I had was now we are 185 years away from what we knew.

 

[Nasty_Magician]

I'll say this, if this wasn't linked to GOT I'm not sure how invested I'd be. With the exception of Daemon who at this point is more potential than execution, they could literally kill any character and I wouldn't care. I don't like or dislike anyone, I'm not rooting for one side or outcome over another. It's all very meh. And I get it's not Thrones and I'm giving it time to grow into itself but even after episode 1 of Thrones you had opinions on characters and were intrigued by multiple plot points. It's all a little too heavy/serious with very few characters cutting through with a different energy (Tyrion, Bronn, Littlefinger etc).

 

[justanidiot]

Just think we all go along thinking we missed an episode. King collapses at the "wedding", Her Guard Sir Christon about to gut himself, apparently just promoted to the queens guard.

Did I miss an episode?

Maybe part of me is waiting for the Jon Snow series, or the current rumor of Emilia Clark returning in her own series with the thought of the dragon taking her to the red cloaks like Jon was resurrected. It seems they may use her in the Snow series, but only if it is not going well, otherwise possibly getting her own.