Court reinstates Brady's four-game suspension

[ohiopatsfan]

With the NFLPA hiring Olson as a part of their legal team, this is definitely not over. However, if the full appeals court rules strictly on Goodell's right to do what he did, I'm afraid the result will be the same.

 

[Yankee Traveler]

Those TYPE of Pats fans are morons!

And my hero's.

 

[Yankee Traveler]

We just going to ignore this statement??


So wtf was he suspended for??

It's true.
Court even said it's decision was not about guilt or innocence but about Goodells power to be judge, jury and executioner, with or without just cause.
Because that is what NFLPA chose to argue, that Goodell overstepped his authority.
Court ruled he had the authority as given by NFLPA in the CBA.

 

[Southieinnc]

this thread needs more traffic

pure gold so far

 

[BigKen]

Brady has hired Thomas Owen who has argued and won several cases before the U.S. Supreme Court.

Brady will get a stay on the suspension and put the decision before the USSC. Best guess is that it will not be submitted until August getting the stay by late August and the case submitted by the first of September. The SC Clerks will revue it along with a couple of hundred others and place it in order for the court to accept or reject. Based on the amount cases already before the court and cases that will be heard, it could be 2-3 years before the court actually even considers looking at it. If it takes that long, and they accept it, Brady will be retired before it is argued. if they reject it, he may retire. OR The Supreme Court could ask for a hearing by the NFL and Brady/NFLPA to consider the case for a full court hearing and judgement. Most likely nothing will be done for at least two years.

 

[Southieinnc]

Brady has hired Thomas Owen who has argued and won several cases before the U.S. Supreme Court.

Brady will get a stay on the suspension and put the decision before the USSC. Best guess is that it will not be submitted until August getting the stay by late August and the case submitted by the first of September. The SC Clerks will revue it along with a couple of hundred others and place it in order for the court to accept or reject. Based on the amount cases already before the court and cases that will be heard, it could be 2-3 years before the court actually even considers looking at it. If it takes that long, and they accept it, Brady will be retired before it is argued. if they reject it, he may retire. OR The Supreme Court could ask for a hearing by the NFL and Brady/NFLPA to consider the case for a full court hearing and judgement. Most likely nothing will be done for at least two years.

except for maybe a Superbowl or two.....

 

[BigKen]

NFLPA actually hired Ted Owens. This guys has argued 82 cases before the Supreme Court. The most historic was the Bush v Gore Presidential Election. He, of course, argued for the Republicans and won. I heard yesterday that he's won more than 75% of the cases he's argued.

Reports today stated that he's already petitioned the court of appeals for a stay. I'm not sure if he's actually submitted it to the 2nd Appeals Court or if he will submit it this week. Once he does, the court will be looking for a response from the NFL.

NFLPA has fired the first shot across the bow regarding the next CBA. 80% of all NFL revenues will go to the players or there will be no more NFL football. We'll see how all of the Kraft, Patriot and Brady hater owners feel about "Deflategate" when they have to deal with a well organized and pissed off NFLPA.

 

[cdumler7]

NFLPA actually hired Ted Owens. This guys has argued 82 cases before the Supreme Court. The most historic was the Bush v Gore Presidential Election. He, of course, argued for the Republicans and won. I heard yesterday that he's won more than 75% of the cases he's argued.

Reports today stated that he's already petitioned the court of appeals for a stay. I'm not sure if he's actually submitted it to the 2nd Appeals Court or if he will submit it this week. Once he does, the court will be looking for a response from the NFL.

NFLPA has fired the first shot across the bow regarding the next CBA. 80% of all NFL revenues will go to the players or there will be no more NFL football. We'll see how all of the Kraft, Patriot and Brady hater owners feel about "Deflategate" when they have to deal with a well organized and pissed off NFLPA.

You realize if the players were to get that the NFL would completely fall apart right? Right now the way things are NFL owners after all the operating costs, salaries, and everything else take home around $25-30 million. So if you jump 80% of all revenues towards the players NFL owners would actually be losing a ridiculous level of money per year. I mean even if that is them just aiming high to have some room to negotiate they are going to get laughed out of the room. Heck even Kraft would be with the other owners on this because he would be losing ridiculous money if this ever passed.

Also when players get actual control during a CBA other major sports leagues have seen a huge tumble in revenue. Sports have remained at their most popular when owners still had the majority of power. When the players run things they just don't have the intelligence to handle such a responsibility. Look at the NBA. I mean when guys like Lebron have complete control over who is on his team it has made the game almost unwatchable these days.

 

[BigKen]

CD......I realize many things every day and not all of them are good. Lawrence Smith and the NFLPA are so pissed off at Goodell, I don't think they would be reasonable on anything. When the Berman ruling was handed down, the NFLPA stepped forward and asked Goodell to put the matter to bed. RG basically told to go f*ck himself, that he was going to appeal to the 2nd Court of Appeals. Roger won Round 3 but now the guys who actually make all of this revenue that the owners enjoy want to shove it down the leagues throat. Smith has pretty much told the players that Goodell has been given the freedom to screw them any way he desires. If he likes you, he can let you off Scott free, if your Tom Brady, he can take away your contract and even ban you for life from the NFL. If your a union guy, you have to be squeaky clean or you could be giving up 25% of your contract.

80% of revenues is totally ridiculous, but that was the shot fired over the bow of the NFL cruise ship. It's Smith's way of sending the owners a wake up call that negotiations that Johnathan Kraft got the union to accept a couple of years ago are already a thing of the past. He doesn't believe that the league has the best interest of their bread winners at heart. I tend to agree with him on this and I'm sure that the players believe it too. The next couple of years could get to be very contencious especially when Goodell rules on PEDs or drug use or domestic violence or beating a kid. He's going to have to come down hard as nail or the NFLPA will be right back in court because of Brady getting four games without evidence. On the back side, they'll be pushing for leniency.

If Brady did nothing, and he believes that Goodell screwed him, he's going to continue to push the as hard as he can to clear his name, regardless of what 95% of football fans believe or think they know. His attorneys are as tight lipped as urethane on dry wood. Everything now has an "If" in front of it. Everyone keeps saying that if Brady sues for defamation, he has to prove he was defamed. That's not 100% true. The defense has to prove they did not defame him and that's where the matter of evidence is required.

I have to get back to reading the Wells Report again.

 

[cdumler7]

Here's the problem with your thought process here though BigKen. Players are just as upset with Smith for being a terrible President of their Union. I remember when the new CBA was signed how many players spoke out about how the Union didn't act in the best interest of the players. So wouldn't surprise me if he is fired before the next CBA. Throw in the next CBA is a ways away so while yes some might be heated about this whole Deflategate thing now my guess is by the time the negotiations actually happen it will have been forgotten. Doesn't mean some other controversy won't have happened by then that will have players upset but we will just have to see what happens when the next CBA rolls around.

The other part of this that makes things very difficult for players is that the Owners have the fans on their side. And honestly we should be on their side. Like I said before that when players end up getting the majority of the money many times that sport goes on a very quick downhill slide because well the players are just not smart enough to actually know how to handle some of the business side of things. If we as fans want the NFL to continue to be a great product then we need to be cheering for the owners to continue to control how things are done.

Also on that same note players are kind of screwed when it comes to demanding money. They look like selfish jerks to us fans when they demand top money for what they do. We as fans will always side with the team over that of the individual player so if players come to the negotiating table demanding more money than what they already make fans very easily get ticked off by such a thing. Now whether that is right or not I don't know but it just is the way things are right now.

Also again I know people think owners are making big time money on a per year basis but that just isn't the case. Honestly most of their investment is in the fact that many of these guys bought the team 20 or so years ago when the value wasn't as good as it is today. So whenever they do sell the team that is when they make their profit not really now on the per year basis. So you have the players take a bigger chunk of that pie and just like any business the owner will start skimping elsewhere. Maybe they don't carry as many coaches. Maybe they all band together and stop paying as much signing bonus. Maybe they all start just going to the Cap Floor instead of spending all the cap money. Maybe they stop providing top of the line training facilities for these players. This is where NFL players have to understand there is no other sport that has as big of a roster as that of the NFL so of course they are not going to make as much as the other sports. Then throw in injury concerns and no team could ever be able to have fully guaranteed contracts like the players want. All of their money would be going to dead money every single season.

 

[BigKen]

CD, I don't disagree with anything you've said. I've been writing what I've read and heard.

I think a lot of people's feelings will change if Goodell goes after some one other than the Patriots. As long as the Patriots or Brady are the target, the majority of fans will be happy. Once he turns his attention elsewhere, it won't be as much fun.

 

[cdumler7]

CD, I don't disagree with anything you've said. I've been writing what I've read and heard.

I think a lot of people's feelings will change if Goodell goes after some one other than the Patriots. As long as the Patriots or Brady are the target, the majority of fans will be happy. Once he turns his attention elsewhere, it won't be as much fun.

I honestly doubt Goodell is Commissioner by the time the next CBA comes up. The NFL Owners will view that as a way of showing the players that they hear what they are saying by letting him retire and bringing in a new guy.

And I'm sure lots of things are being floated out there. What I am saying is all the things you have posted on the next CBA I just can't see the players even thinking that to be logically possible. I mean they would understand that the entire league would come crashing down in a matter of a few years if they got what they wanted. I do think we are heading to a possible hold out for the next CBA. And part of that really is both sides being way too stubborn. I'm hoping cooler heads can prevail but I doubt that happens.

 

[BigKen]

Looks like Brady got the 14 day extension.

 

[Rex Racer]

The NFLPA would do well to punt DeMaurice Smith. He is a meathead and has already been taken to the cleaners by Goodell once. If the players consider letting him negotiate the next CBA they deserve the ass raping they get.

 

[Southieinnc]

Here's the problem with your thought process here though BigKen. Players are just as upset with Smith for being a terrible President of their Union. I remember when the new CBA was signed how many players spoke out about how the Union didn't act in the best interest of the players. So wouldn't surprise me if he is fired before the next CBA. Throw in the next CBA is a ways away so while yes some might be heated about this whole Deflategate thing now my guess is by the time the negotiations actually happen it will have been forgotten. Doesn't mean some other controversy won't have happened by then that will have players upset but we will just have to see what happens when the next CBA rolls around.

The other part of this that makes things very difficult for players is that the Owners have the fans on their side. And honestly we should be on their side. Like I said before that when players end up getting the majority of the money many times that sport goes on a very quick downhill slide because well the players are just not smart enough to actually know how to handle some of the business side of things. If we as fans want the NFL to continue to be a great product then we need to be cheering for the owners to continue to control how things are done.

Also on that same note players are kind of screwed when it comes to demanding money. They look like selfish jerks to us fans when they demand top money for what they do. We as fans will always side with the team over that of the individual player so if players come to the negotiating table demanding more money than what they already make fans very easily get ticked off by such a thing. Now whether that is right or not I don't know but it just is the way things are right now.

Also again I know people think owners are making big time money on a per year basis but that just isn't the case. Honestly most of their investment is in the fact that many of these guys bought the team 20 or so years ago when the value wasn't as good as it is today. So whenever they do sell the team that is when they make their profit not really now on the per year basis. So you have the players take a bigger chunk of that pie and just like any business the owner will start skimping elsewhere. Maybe they don't carry as many coaches. Maybe they all band together and stop paying as much signing bonus. Maybe they all start just going to the Cap Floor instead of spending all the cap money. Maybe they stop providing top of the line training facilities for these players. This is where NFL players have to understand there is no other sport that has as big of a roster as that of the NFL so of course they are not going to make as much as the other sports. Then throw in injury concerns and no team could ever be able to have fully guaranteed contracts like the players want. All of their money would be going to dead money every single season.

You want me to "cheer for the owners?
I could cheer for Robert Kraft, Pat Bowlen, Dan Rooney - they are good for football.
You want me to cheer for Jim Irsay, Jerry Jones, Steve Bisciotti, Dan Snyder or the rest?????
You are delusional.
I'll say it for the record right now:
I'd rather the NFL fail right now than to see Roger Goodel and his cronies win what is all about power!

 

[Southieinnc]

Here's the problem with your thought process here though BigKen. Players are just as upset with Smith for being a terrible President of their Union. I remember when the new CBA was signed how many players spoke out about how the Union didn't act in the best interest of the players. So wouldn't surprise me if he is fired before the next CBA. Throw in the next CBA is a ways away so while yes some might be heated about this whole Deflategate thing now my guess is by the time the negotiations actually happen it will have been forgotten. Doesn't mean some other controversy won't have happened by then that will have players upset but we will just have to see what happens when the next CBA rolls around.

The other part of this that makes things very difficult for players is that the Owners have the fans on their side. And honestly we should be on their side. Like I said before that when players end up getting the majority of the money many times that sport goes on a very quick downhill slide because well the players are just not smart enough to actually know how to handle some of the business side of things. If we as fans want the NFL to continue to be a great product then we need to be cheering for the owners to continue to control how things are done.

Also on that same note players are kind of screwed when it comes to demanding money. They look like selfish jerks to us fans when they demand top money for what they do. We as fans will always side with the team over that of the individual player so if players come to the negotiating table demanding more money than what they already make fans very easily get ticked off by such a thing. Now whether that is right or not I don't know but it just is the way things are right now.

Also again I know people think owners are making big time money on a per year basis but that just isn't the case. Honestly most of their investment is in the fact that many of these guys bought the team 20 or so years ago when the value wasn't as good as it is today. So whenever they do sell the team that is when they make their profit not really now on the per year basis. So you have the players take a bigger chunk of that pie and just like any business the owner will start skimping elsewhere. Maybe they don't carry as many coaches. Maybe they all band together and stop paying as much signing bonus. Maybe they all start just going to the Cap Floor instead of spending all the cap money. Maybe they stop providing top of the line training facilities for these players. This is where NFL players have to understand there is no other sport that has as big of a roster as that of the NFL so of course they are not going to make as much as the other sports. Then throw in injury concerns and no team could ever be able to have fully guaranteed contracts like the players want. All of their money would be going to dead money every single season.

You want me to "side with the owners?
I could side with Robert Kraft, Pat Bowlen, Paul Allen because they are good for football.
You want me to side with Steve Bisciotti, Jim Irsay, Jerry Jones or Dan Snyder?
I'll say it for the record:
I'd rather see the NFL fail than to see Goodell and the New York Gang win this power struggle......

 

[cdumler7]

You want me to "side with the owners?
I could side with Robert Kraft, Pat Bowlen, Paul Allen because they are good for football.
You want me to side with Steve Bisciotti, Jim Irsay, Jerry Jones or Dan Snyder?
I'll say it for the record:
I'd rather see the NFL fail than to see Goodell and the New York Gang win this power struggle......

I'm not saying all the owners are good to sign with. What I am saying is that if we want the game we love to continue to be a great product then it is in the best interest of the fan for the Owners to keep control of the CBA compared to the players actually controlling a majority of the money. As I have said before the owners don't make as much as people think off the NFL. Each of them because of splitting the profits make around $25 million after they take out all the expenses per year. Some of them then take that money and reinvest it such as building top notch facilities for the players to practice in. So most of their money and how they see this being a great investment is more so in how much the NFL team is worth if say they were to sell it compared to what they bought the team for. Cash wise they are not adding a ton which is why some owners struggle contract wise because they can't hand out huge guaranteed money knowing that money has to actually go into a savings account even if it won't be paid to the player until 4 years later.

 

[BigKen]

If you spend $1B on an NFL team and Make $25M a year profit, it's a piss poor investment because your ROI is 40 years. My guess is that there's a hell of lot more money than we even realize. There's a ton of profit in $8 hot dogs and $17 beers.

 

[cdumler7]

If you spend $1B on an NFL team and Make $25M a year profit, it's a piss poor investment because your ROI is 40 years. My guess is that there's a hell of lot more money than we even realize. There's a ton of profit in $8 hot dogs and $17 beers.

No you are missing the point here. These owners are buying the team with the thought that the growth of the NFL will continue to increase the value of the franchise. Such as Pat Bowlen back in 1984 bought the Broncos for $78 million. The team is now worth $1.94 billion. So while that $25 million is an ok return per year it is more about when he would actually sell the team at some point that matters. That is over $1 billion in profits over a 30 year period. That is why the investment is worth it for these guys.