Court reinstates Brady's four-game suspension

[BigKen]

As for precedence being set...not really. Goodell has said that a big part of this punishment was because of multiple violations without the team really showing any kind of remorse. So yes if another team continues to ignore the rules then I can see precedence come into play but a team that has been good for quite some time and gets caught doing something they are not going to get this harsh of a punishment.

Think about that the next time you get a speeding ticket. You had one in 1998 and you got another in 2016. You certainly didn't show any remorse......that'll be 5 years in state prison.

 

[cdumler7]

Think about that the next time you get a speeding ticket. You had one in 1998 and you got another in 2016. You certainly didn't show any remorse......that'll be 5 years in state prison.

1) We are not talking that type of time frame here. We are talking under 10 years two big violations that other teams came to the league and complained about what the Patriots were doing. Other little things along the way. Teams and players have both come out saying how they always worried when playing the Patriots what things they were doing to cheat. I don't think teams worry about that like they do unless there is something that has happened that makes them believe the Patriots are doing something much worse than other teams around the league.

2) The punishment is not as harsh as you are speaking to here. 4-game suspension is nothing. I mean it is the same as getting busted for PED's. 4-game suspensions happen every single season around the league so not like Brady is being punished beyond what we have already seen in the league. Heck we have players that have been punished much more harshly. We see guys like Peterson, Hardy, and Rice who lost whole seasons and even more than that in Rice's case with nobody even willing to give him a chance. We have players suspended for an entire season for drugs and steroids right now. So a 4-game suspension is not something unheard of.

Now the taking of the 1st round pick I will agree pretty darn stiff of a penalty. At the same time like I said this is based on a perceived notion that the Patriots don't care that they are breaking the rules so the NFL and the other owners wanted to come down hard to show they are tired of this crap happening and putting a black eye on the entire league not just the Patriots.

 

[BigKen]

Just one simple question.....what exactly did Tom Brady do? Please tell me what Tom Brady did that would have the NFL spend $4M investigating him? He did nothing to warrant being singled out. This is what pisses me and Patriots fans. This is what I'm hoping will make him strangle the NFL and Goodell for a trillion dollars.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Did anyone ever see Brady's destroyed cell phone? Did you ever see a photo of this supposed phone that was destroyed? Did anyone ever testify to picking up the pieces or seeing anyone pick up the pieces of this destroyed cell phone.

The truth? The phone was never destroyed. The phone is in Donald Yee's possession. Why? Because it's evidence that there were never any texts or emails exchanged. The last thing an attorney wants to do is turn over evidence that someone else can destroy "by accident".

This is far from over. Brady has a number of things he can do and the media is not privy to anything that he's even considering. There are way too many smarter legal minds out there who know a hell of a lot more than anyone in this board or the news media about what can be done and how to do it.

Wait, even smarter than Hammer? No way. I'm not buying it.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

1) We are not talking that type of time frame here. We are talking under 10 years two big violations that other teams came to the league and complained about what the Patriots were doing. Other little things along the way. Teams and players have both come out saying how they always worried when playing the Patriots what things they were doing to cheat. I don't think teams worry about that like they do unless there is something that has happened that makes them believe the Patriots are doing something much worse than other teams around the league.

2) The punishment is not as harsh as you are speaking to here. 4-game suspension is nothing. I mean it is the same as getting busted for PED's. 4-game suspensions happen every single season around the league so not like Brady is being punished beyond what we have already seen in the league. Heck we have players that have been punished much more harshly. We see guys like Peterson, Hardy, and Rice who lost whole seasons and even more than that in Rice's case with nobody even willing to give him a chance. We have players suspended for an entire season for drugs and steroids right now. So a 4-game suspension is not something unheard of.

Now the taking of the 1st round pick I will agree pretty darn stiff of a penalty. At the same time like I said this is based on a perceived notion that the Patriots don't care that they are breaking the rules so the NFL and the other owners wanted to come down hard to show they are tired of this crap happening and putting a black eye on the entire league not just the Patriots.

The problem with your logic is Brady didn't do the filming during spygate, Brady didn't have anything to do with head set malfunctions, Brady didn't make the call to enforce a stupid tuck rule penalty...
So if Brady did manipulate or have the balls manipulated the fine was $25k. Not a suspension. Certainley not 4 games. The same works in reverse wht did Kraft lose 2 draft picks and a million $. Because of some other unrelated offenses?
PED use and cap manipulation sounds like 2 draft picks and $500k and since Elway was the QB or GM during these time he gets a lifetime ban.
How's that sound?

 

[CreepCreep2014]

Roger came out and said Brady destroyed his cell phone, just like he leaked that 11 of the balls were deflated. It was the first thing to come out, so the pink hats and haters stick to these points. Brady came out and said his phone was not destroyed, after Roger came out and said it was...unfortunately Roger was first. Anyone who things that he deserves the 4 games is just a complete moron and should prob get another hobby. He should be fined for not cooperating and so on. Wells investigation showed he had no evidence that Brady did anything. He could only assume that he did because of some stupid text messages. It's funny because the league has nothing to say about the other texts messages. Ya know the ones where they stated the "balls were 16 PSI during the Jets game" (in which Brady played like shit) and the "the balls were suppose to set at 13 PSI" I believe it was one of the ball boys text to their GF, but off course the idiots stick to the "deflator" text as 150% admit of guilt...LOL

Kraft fucked this whole thing up by stating they would take the punishment handed down by the league. That gave Roger and the other 31 pussies the ability to hammer NE for BB. People don't like BB, period. This is where it all stems from. They can't get BB, so lets get his picks and QB....to bad it wont work. If BB was not such an ignorant fuck and listened to the memo, this would be a non issue. All teams bend the rules, NE got caught. They only thing the NFL has proved was Spygate and I have said this from the beginning; BB had tapes of other teams doing the same exact thing as the Patriots and Roger cld not let this get out, so he destroyed the tapes. People forget this was Roger's first big issue as Commish and he had to make a point. I mean why not show the tapes, you already got them for it?? Why destroy them??

In the end this is on Kraft, Brady and NFLPA for agreeing to his power. Does the punishment fit the crime, no fucking way....but they could have done things better. Gotta remember, this started out as PSI, then Integrity, then competitive advantage, compared to steroid use, and Roger ended on a cell phone. This man can do and say what ever the fuck he wants and nothing can be done about it. I am willing to bet that if Brady tries to take this any further, he will be suspended for the yr! Roger will come up with something....watch.

 

[ohiopatsfan]

I like the idea of TB suing for defamation. I assume if he sues, he gets to pick the venue (a court in Boston?). The appeals court decision, I believe, only upheld Goodell's right to do what he did under the CBA, which is really not in question. I don't believe it touched on TB's guilt or innocence. A defamation suit hits the NFL where it hurts, in the wallet. I would put a stipulation on the suit, however. It will be dropped if TB is exorerated and a public apology is issued. With all that money on the table, I think the other owners will swallow hard and take their distasteful spoonful of medicine rather than have their pockets drained.

 

[BigKen]

The NFL assumes that the issue is dead because of the extreme difficulty in getting either the entire 2nd Appeals Court (13 Judges, including the three who issued the decision already), or the U.S. Supreme Court which only reviews 1% of the cases submitted.

A defamation lawsuit would have a panel of 12 jurors and a federal court judge. The 12 jurors would be common everyday walk of the mill people. Now you get into the presentation of evidence, where the jury gets to see and hear everything that either side wants to present everything they can think of to sway those people to that side of the table. I mean everything. Just when you think you've got this cat cornered, a jury can surprise the hell out of you.............are you old enough to remember the O.J. Simpson Trial? A person sitting on a jury can also bypass evidence and just vote on his or her feelings and totally ignore the evidence. This is where Tom Brady would make hay. His lawyers could give each juror a small sample or example of how what happened to TB could happen to them and what it would cost them to salvage their lives. The most important thing is even more simple.........
Set up a time line........Start at the AFCCG, the time following and what took place, the Wells Investigation and the Wells Report.............Then ask the NFL to explain to the jury...What exactly did TB do that was illegal or against the rules in the AFCCG? What exactly did he do or not do during the Wells Investigation? Why was Tom Brady singled out as the single culprit in this entire issue?

Making the NFL answer simple questions and attempting to keep the answers simple will be the straw that breaks the camel's back. Being able to challenge everything will force the truth to be revealed.

That's the last thing the NFL will want. Everything from Spygate to Bountygate to Concussions is fair game.

 

[cdumler7]

The problem with your logic is Brady didn't do the filming during spygate, Brady didn't have anything to do with head set malfunctions, Brady didn't make the call to enforce a stupid tuck rule penalty...
So if Brady did manipulate or have the balls manipulated the fine was $25k. Not a suspension. Certainley not 4 games. The same works in reverse wht did Kraft lose 2 draft picks and a million $. Because of some other unrelated offenses?
PED use and cap manipulation sounds like 2 draft picks and $500k and since Elway was the QB or GM during these time he gets a lifetime ban.
How's that sound?

I'm saying Brady was the unfortunate fall guy in the situation. He has caught the wrath of the league (this goes beyond just Goodell). I'm not saying Brady has a pattern of cheating that has lead to this. I'm saying because the team has a perceived attitude of cheating the rules and this one happened during one of the biggest games of the year the league went above and beyond to punish Brady to really send a signal to all in the league not just the Patriots that they won't stand for this.

I do think he has been unfairly punished and at worst should have received a slap on the wrist and told don't do it again.

 

[BigKen]

Two things I know.......

Roger Goodell will never show his face at Gillette Stadium again.

Roger Goodell can't get to his mansion at the mouth of the Saco River in Saco, Maine because he fears for his life from Patriots fans.

 

[SDGuy73]

The NFL assumes that the issue is dead because of the extreme difficulty in getting either the entire 2nd Appeals Court (13 Judges, including the three who issued the decision already), or the U.S. Supreme Court which only reviews 1% of the cases submitted.

A defamation lawsuit would have a panel of 12 jurors and a federal court judge. The 12 jurors would be common everyday walk of the mill people. Now you get into the presentation of evidence, where the jury gets to see and hear everything that either side wants to present everything they can think of to sway those people to that side of the table. I mean everything. Just when you think you've got this cat cornered, a jury can surprise the hell out of you.............are you old enough to remember the O.J. Simpson Trial? A person sitting on a jury can also bypass evidence and just vote on his or her feelings and totally ignore the evidence. This is where Tom Brady would make hay. His lawyers could give each juror a small sample or example of how what happened to TB could happen to them and what it would cost them to salvage their lives. The most important thing is even more simple.........
Set up a time line........Start at the AFCCG, the time following and what took place, the Wells Investigation and the Wells Report.............Then ask the NFL to explain to the jury...What exactly did TB do that was illegal or against the rules in the AFCCG? What exactly did he do or not do during the Wells Investigation? Why was Tom Brady singled out as the single culprit in this entire issue?

Making the NFL answer simple questions and attempting to keep the answers simple will be the straw that breaks the camel's back. Being able to challenge everything will force the truth to be revealed.

That's the last thing the NFL will want. Everything from Spygate to Bountygate to Concussions is fair game.

I'm saying Brady was the unfortunate fall guy in the situation. He has caught the wrath of the league (this goes beyond just Goodell). I'm not saying Brady has a pattern of cheating that has lead to this. I'm saying because the team has a perceived attitude of cheating the rules and this one happened during one of the biggest games of the year the league went above and beyond to punish Brady to really send a signal to all in the league not just the Patriots that they won't stand for this.

I do think he has been unfairly punished and at worst should have received a slap on the wrist and told don't do it again.

Both of you are missing the biggest and most damaging question. Even journalist aren't asking Goodell and should be pushing for answer's.

Playing with footballs below 12.5PSI is against the rules. Three of the four Colts balls (that were measured.
No time for the other 8. but a guy can deflate 12 balls in 90 seconds) were under 12.5PSI. Why weren't they investigated. There is so many unanswered questions about the Colts. It's ridiculous. Integrity my ass!

cdumler7, what perceived cheating?

 

[SDGuy73]

Two things I know.......

Roger Goodell will never show his face at Gillette Stadium again.

Roger Goodell can't get to his mansion at the mouth of the Saco River in Saco, Maine because he fears for his life from Patriots fans.

Those TYPE of Pats fans are morons!

 

[NWPATSFAN]

I'm saying Brady was the unfortunate fall guy in the situation. He has caught the wrath of the league (this goes beyond just Goodell). I'm not saying Brady has a pattern of cheating that has lead to this. I'm saying because the team has a perceived attitude of cheating the rules and this one happened during one of the biggest games of the year the league went above and beyond to punish Brady to really send a signal to all in the league not just the Patriots that they won't stand for this.

I do think he has been unfairly punished and at worst should have received a slap on the wrist and told don't do it again.

You're doing exactly what I'm saying. You're lumping perceived cheating by the organization into a case against TB. TB has nothing to do with those allegations.
Again if Goodell decides TB was involved in manipulating the footballs he should've fined TB the $25k under then current rules. Not 4 games is my point.
As for the perceived continued cheating by the Pats, he took the picks and the $1 mil from Kraft. That's harsh enough in my mind. But if it wasn't for the other owners he shoul've went harder after Kraft and BB not TB is all I'm saying.
TB wins a defamation case hands down IMHO.

 

[PatsFan2003]

I'm saying Brady was the unfortunate fall guy in the situation. He has caught the wrath of the league (this goes beyond just Goodell). I'm not saying Brady has a pattern of cheating that has lead to this. I'm saying because the team has a perceived attitude of cheating the rules and this one happened during one of the biggest games of the year the league went above and beyond to punish Brady to really send a signal to all in the league not just the Patriots that they won't stand for this.

I do think he has been unfairly punished and at worst should have received a slap on the wrist and told don't do it again.

I agree with this but why does that make it somehow justified? Because of a "perceived" attitude of cheating? ("Those smug bastards") So a violation that typically involves a fine between 25 and 100k becomes a multi-million dollar boondoggle involving losses of multiple draft picks, 1 miiilion dollars, a suspension by the "fall" guy for a quarter of the season.

And Patriots fans get criticized for thinking that's a witch-hunt??

 

[cdumler7]

You're doing exactly what I'm saying. You're lumping perceived cheating by the organization into a case against TB. TB has nothing to do with those allegations.
Again if Goodell decides TB was involved in manipulating the footballs he should've fined TB the $25k under then current rules. Not 4 games is my point.
As for the perceived continued cheating by the Pats, he took the picks and the $1 mil from Kraft. That's harsh enough in my mind. But if it wasn't for the other owners he shoul've went harder after Kraft and BB not TB is all I'm saying.
TB wins a defamation case hands down IMHO.

I understand that Brady had nothing to do with those. What I am saying is because of the perceived cheating the other owners essentially told Goodell to come down as hard as he possibly could not only on the Patriots but on Brady as well. Sometimes a super star just seems to be the one they decide to make an example of. Like I said I don't think this is even remotely deserved. It should have been just a fine and move on.

@SDGuy73 what I am talking about is Deflategate, Spygate, cameras in the locker room or sending in personnel after people leave the locker room to see if they can find something, putting spies on the sideline of the opposing team, going into the hotels of the away teams to see if they happen to have left things, tampering with the headsets/communication. Now obviously none of these things have irrefutable evidence that they have happened but these are all things coaches and players have brought up about the Patriots. Again not proven but it does sound like the other Owners told Goodell they are tired of what all the Patriots are doing. So whether it is public or not obviously something the Patriots have done has ticked off a bunch of owners/teams. I have no clue what is true and what isn't and won't even pretend to know those things. I'm just pointing out that all of these things have been mentioned in the past as things the Patriots have done.

 

[Yankee Traveler]

Also it was nice to see Brees say what he said. Might open some ears...

I missed it, been traveling (I'm in Denver, Yikes!!).
What did Brady say?

 

[patspa]

About 2-3 months ago on Pro Football Talk with Mike Florio, he was doing a piece on all this and he was asked why Kraft took the punishment in the first place. He said in his research on it, was that Kraft was worried that it would somehow tie BB into it and then with all of his stuff from spygate, and other accusations against him would basically ban BB for life, and Kraft in turn took the punishment and put all the rest on Brady. Going to try later to find that episode on line, but that was the basic of it, that he was afraid of a lifelong suspension for BB.

 

[BigKen]

So whether it is public or not obviously something the Patriots have done has ticked off a bunch of owners/teams. I have no clue what is true and what isn't and won't even pretend to know those things. I'm just pointing out that all of these things have been mentioned in the past as things the Patriots have done.

Most likely the teams that supposedly have worried that the Patriots have done all these things have done them, themselves. More than likely most of them have. Once somebody dreams up something, in today's environment, it becomes fact. Even when found to be untrue, it's still fact. People in this board still believe that 11 of 12 balls were underinflated. People believe what they want to believe and whatever makes them feel good is their choice. Seeing the Patriots take a wrongful hit is justice to them, and it makes them feel better.

What most don't get is that shit like this makes the Patriots work even harder to improve. Belichick has more scouts scouring the land to find more Tom Bradys and Malcolm Butlers. He's signing good free agent football players.....the end result? Most likely Lombardi 5 and 95% of football fans agonizing over their team's inability to play to a Patriot level and their team's ownership and management unable to keep up.

Basically, it's other owners admitting that they don't know how to build a winning team by trying to tear down the one that does.

 

[CreepCreep2014]

We just going to ignore this statement??


So wtf was he suspended for??

 

[Carnzo]

We just going to ignore this statement??


So wtf was he suspended for??

Sush you, that is not HammerDown and the rest of the country want to consider.
You know, reality