Bucks offseason possibilities

[msgkings322]

OK this needs its own thread

@buckalis

You seem pretty on top of things especially your Bucks. But you gotta cool off the hypothetical superteams, because some of the examples you gave are laughable. Also you really overvalue your own guys and assume other teams will make moves that make no sense.

 

[tlance]

I am genuinely curious though...

I heard your insanely 1 sided AD and Jrue trade.

What exactly do you think it would cost the Bucks to deal for the #2 pick?

 

[raptorlife4]

Who the fook is this guy

 

[DJ]

Who the fook is this guy

Yeah, I'm wondering this also.

 

[msgkings322]

Who the fook is this guy

He's a new guy but I like him, need new blood here once in a while

 

[buckalis]

OK this needs its own thread

@buckalis

You seem pretty on top of things especially your Bucks. But you gotta cool off the hypothetical superteams, because some of the examples you gave are laughable. Also you really overvalue your own guys and assume other teams will make moves that make no sense.

The Bucks are determined to upgrade further their roster for each every season that follows...

1. This season the Bucks will surely trade Tony Snell and possibly Erzan Ilyasova too...
2. The Bucks are looking to resign all their expiring contracts, but only if they agree on "team friendly" deals... They will pay none that demands a renewal more than what Giannis annual salary is (on his current contract) ...
3. The Bucks have set the tone of what they mean as "team friendly" contracts, by resigning Bledsoe (their No.3) at a 4/70M deal... No2 gets more, all others less...
4. All players but Middleton seem to agree with that policy and want to stay with the team... If Middleton demands more, the Bucks are not willing to resign him, but are willing to "help" him the best they can as to join the organization he is after...
5. If Middleton was to leave the Bucks, his primary destination would be the Orlando Magic and then (less so) The Hawks, because he likes being "back home" close to his family (he is from the south of S. Carolina), but also because he would prefer to be with a team that (he believes) he can lead.
6. Middleton also has great relations with J. Hammond (the ex-GM of the Bucks and now of the Magic) and knows that the Magic are "keeping an eye on him" (not that they are the only ones)...
7. The Bucks started the season unable to play "3 tower on the floor" tactics, but only "3 guards of the floor"... They now start the game playing "3 towers" (with Miro at 3 and Khris at 2) and destroy their opponents because Mirotic attracts "bigs" to guard him and takes "load off" Giannis... They'll be looking to add another SF/PF this season, so that they can back up Mirotic and play "3 towers" for as long as needed.
8. The Bucks have plenty of combo guards that can play 2/3 on (Middleton, Brown, Connaughton and Snell), they can therefore rotate and turn the system to "3 guards on the floor" at anytime...
9. Most effective player for the Bucks to play at 2 is Brogdon (1/2 combo guard) because he can shoot the ball (slightly) better than Middleton, but he attacks the rim more, but (most important) he is better than Khris in "reading the game", "playmaking" and "pick and roll" the ball with Giannis.
10. The Bucks are looking to have the most effective starting roster but have 13 "active" players in their roster with 2x4=8 to back up the starting five... two 1/2 combo guards, two 2/3 combo guards, two 3/4 combo forwards and two 4/5 combo forwards...
11. Depending on the lottery outcome tonight, the Bucks will be looking to buy "picks" (as long a pick falls within a team that they can negotiate with)...
12. The Bucks know that they will be "1st targeted destination this season for FAs and players that want to be traded.
13. The Bucks most "untouchable" players are the "Bucks generatives" (i.e. The players that have only played with the Bucks for their entire up to now NBA career)... These are (in that order) Giannis, Brogdon, Brown, D.J. Wilson and Divicenzo. One of those players (but Giannis) can only be traded if and only if the trade is crucial for the team to make the next step.
14. For the Bucks locker room relationships under the leadership of Giannis (who works hard and is the one responsible for it). No player can be "a Buck" if there is suspicion that he may cause "disturbance" in the locker room...
15. Players that the Bucks are considering for this season for the starting roster or "important bench" are: AD, Jrue Holiday, Paul George, Kemba Walker, Nikola Vucevic, Aaron Godon, D. Dedmon, Marcus & Markieff Morris and Bojan Bogdanovic.

 

[raptorlife4]

Did not read

 

[Hambombs]

I have not even looked at the bucks offseason plans yet. I think they match brogdan and maybe sign a max guy if they don't pay middelton. Snell, george hill money probably will be dropped somehow

 

[Hambombs]

Snell Deff will be traded I think. That frees up 12-13 million

 

[tlance]

The Bucks are determined to upgrade further their roster for each every season that follows...

1. This season the Bucks will surely trade Tony Snell and possibly Erzan Ilyasova too...
2. The Bucks are looking to resign all their expiring contracts, but only if they agree on "team friendly" deals... They will pay none that demands a renewal more than what Giannis annual salary is (on his current contract) ...
3. The Bucks have set the tone of what they mean as "team friendly" contracts, by resigning Bledsoe (their No.3) at a 4/70M deal... No2 gets more, all others less...
4. All players but Middleton seem to agree with that policy and want to stay with the team... If Middleton demands more, the Bucks are not willing to resign him, but are willing to "help" him the best they can as to join the organization he is after...
5. If Middleton was to leave the Bucks, his primary destination would be the Orlando Magic and then (less so) The Hawks, because he likes being "back home" close to his family (he is from the south of S. Carolina), but also because he would prefer to be with a team that (he believes) he can lead.
6. Middleton also has great relations with J. Hammond (the ex-GM of the Bucks and now of the Magic) and knows that the Magic are "keeping an eye on him" (not that they are the only ones)...
7. The Bucks started the season unable to play "3 tower on the floor" tactics, but only "3 guards of the floor"... They now start the game playing "3 towers" (with Miro at 3 and Khris at 2) and destroy their opponents because Mirotic attracts "bigs" to guard him and takes "load off" Giannis... They'll be looking to add another SF/PF this season, so that they can back up Mirotic and play "3 towers" for as long as needed.
8. The Bucks have plenty of combo guards that can play 2/3 on (Middleton, Brown, Connaughton and Snell), they can therefore rotate and turn the system to "3 guards on the floor" at anytime...
9. Most effective player for the Bucks to play at 2 is Brogdon (1/2 combo guard) because he can shoot the ball (slightly) better than Middleton, but he attacks the rim more, but (most important) he is better than Khris in "reading the game", "playmaking" and "pick and roll" the ball with Giannis.
10. The Bucks are looking to have the most effective starting roster but have 13 "active" players in their roster with 2x4=8 to back up the starting five... two 1/2 combo guards, two 2/3 combo guards, two 3/4 combo forwards and two 4/5 combo forwards...
11. Depending on the lottery outcome tonight, the Bucks will be looking to buy "picks" (as long a pick falls within a team that they can negotiate with)...
12. The Bucks know that they will be "1st targeted destination this season for FAs and players that want to be traded.
13. The Bucks most "untouchable" players are the "Bucks generatives" (i.e. The players that have only played with the Bucks for their entire up to now NBA career)... These are (in that order) Giannis, Brogdon, Brown, D.J. Wilson and Divicenzo. One of those players (but Giannis) can only be traded if and only if the trade is crucial for the team to make the next step.
14. For the Bucks locker room relationships under the leadership of Giannis (who works hard and is the one responsible for it). No player can be "a Buck" if there is suspicion that he may cause "disturbance" in the locker room...
15. Players that the Bucks are considering for this season for the starting roster or "important bench" are: AD, Jrue Holiday, Paul George, Kemba Walker, Nikola Vucevic, Aaron Godon, D. Dedmon, Marcus & Markieff Morris and Bojan Bogdanovic.

1: Tony Snell is due $11 million next year and has a player option for $12 million in 2021. That is a bad contract. They will have to attach assets to it just to deal it. My guess would be a first and second round pick. Might be worth it, bur the post seems to assume he is a trade asset. He isn't. Ilyasova you should probably keep. Dude is a solid role player making a team friendly 7 million.
2: garbage. I will bet you anything you want that they offer Middleton more than 25 million a year and that Giannis wants them to do it:
3-4: related to 2. Garbage
5: maybe. Hopefully for your sake you don't find out
7: Nope. They had success in 1 series against an inferior opponent. The problem with the 3 tower approach is that they aren't as good defensively against smaller quicker teams and opposing teams can defend Mirotec with smaller players (like a traditional SF type) because he isn't a huge threat inside.
8: True. Also why they need to keep Middleton. Losing him depletes that depth quickly.
9: Love Brogdon and mostly agree with your assessment. But they can have both. And they need both.
10: positionless basketball. Everyone trying to acquire versatile players today to accodate multiple styles.
11: looking 2 but 2nd rounders? Yeah they should. Buying Ja Morant? You can't afford it. The Grizzlies would not even conisider dealing Morant for say Khris Middleton. Contracts determine trade value.
12: Giannis has put on the map for sure. But they aren't the "#1 FA destination". That is crazy to assume that and based in absolutely nothing factual.
13-14: ok. No argument
15:
AD- no chance in hell you have a trade package for him
Holiday- don't know why you trade for him. Bledsoe and Brogdon are almost as good and cheaper
George- no way in hell you can trade for him
Kemba and Vucevic- these are realistic FA targets of you lose Middleton. But neither is taking a deal for less than $25 million a year. Just not happening.

In other words, most of your ideas are fantasy.

 

[Heatles84]

@WiggyRuss you and I have had our battles, and you've often been referred to as a homer. But sorry to say, this guy out homers you, my friend.

 

[buckalis]

-with the cost of 3&D wings rising all the time, Snell's salary at 11.7M next season and his efficiency at both ends of the floor, make him a desirable player for many teams that are in need to add a 3&d wing.

- I guess AD won't want to leave the Pelicans anymore after the lottery results, nor Jrue Holiday is an option anymore.

- Bojan Bogdanovic will be what the Bucks will be primarily after, if they are forced to let Middleton go due to disagreement on his contract renewal.

- Other players that the Bucks are considering (and I forgot to mention before) are Kelly Oumbre and having back ...Jabari Parker (!!!)

- The final this season will be GSW against the Bucks, both teams with "3 towers" tactics on the floor... "3 towers" is better than "3 guards" but only if the "big" SF is an excellent shooter and has "fast legs" so that he can guard fast small guards... "3 towers" is ideal especially in a team that has Giannis in it's roster, because he attracts a "big" to guard him and takes "load off" Giannis on offense, but also, collects more rebounds and increases the defense efficiency due to guarding both the periphery better due to his size and length (and again the fast legs).

-Clearly some people misjudge the importance that Khris Middleton has for the Bucks, although a Bledsoe, Brogdon, Mirotic, Giannis, Lopez line-up would be the most efficient the Bucks can play having Giannis on the court. It's all a matter of "team chemistry"...

- Mirotic was no where near to his "full power" performace ability up to now playing with the Bucks... This is explainable, because he is adapting himself to a completely new role than he ever has played before in the NBA, but also to a team that is playing different tactics than any other in the NBA... His injury that kept him out for a month after he joined the Bucks, hasn't helped either.

More... Mirotic has played at SF in all his basketball career before he joined the Bulls in the NBA (at both Real Madrid and his National team), he also started his NBA career with the Bulls playing SF (but at a team with completely different floor tactics than todays Bucks) for a few months, before Thibs moved him to PF... He hasn't played SF at all for four years now... His basketball IQ, ballhandling, ability to run the floor in transaction, playmaking and defending are all hidden when he plays PF...

 

[Shanemansj13]

-with the cost of 3&D wings rising all the time, Snell's salary at 11.7M next season and his efficiency at both ends of the floor, make him a desirable player for many teams that are in need to add a 3&d wing.

- I guess AD won't want to leave the Pelicans anymore after the lottery results, nor Jrue Holiday is an option anymore.

- Bojan Bogdanovic will be what the Bucks will be primarily after, if they are forced to let Middleton go due to disagreement on his contract renewal.

- Other players that the Bucks are considering (and I forgot to mention before) are Kelly Oumbre and having back ...Jabari Parker (!!!)

- The final this season will be GSW against the Bucks, both teams with "3 towers" tactics on the floor... "3 towers" is better than "3 guards" but only if the "big" SF is an excellent shooter and has "fast legs" so that he can guard fast small guards... "3 towers" is ideal especially in a team that has Giannis in it's roster, because he attracts a "big" to guard him and takes "load off" Giannis on offense, but also, collects more rebounds and increases the defense efficiency due to guarding both the periphery better due to his size and length (and again the fast legs).

-Clearly some people misjudge the importance that Khris Middleton has for the Bucks, although a Bledsoe, Brogdon, Mirotic, Giannis, Lopez line-up would be the most efficient the Bucks can play having Giannis on the court. It's all a matter of "team chemistry"...

- Mirotic was no where near to his "full power" performace ability up to now playing with the Bucks... This is explainable, because he is adapting himself to a completely new role than he ever has played before in the NBA, but also to a team that is playing different tactics than any other in the NBA... His injury that kept him out for a month after he joined the Bucks, hasn't helped either.

More... Mirotic has played at SF in all his basketball career before he joined the Bulls in the NBA (at both Real Madrid and his National team), he also started his NBA career with the Bulls playing SF (but at a team with completely different floor tactics than todays Bucks) for a few months, before Thibs moved him to PF... He hasn't played SF at all for four years now... His basketball IQ, ballhandling, ability to run the floor in transaction, playmaking and defending are all hidden when he plays PF...

Snell is not desirable lol.

J.R. Smith is more desirable and it's bc of his contract. J.R. SMITH.

Snell is a decent bench player but he saw less and less time for a reason. $12M for a bench player not even getting 12 mins a night isn't that desirable unless his contract brings perks and it doesn't.

You clearly don't value Middleton's role on this team. He is a key to their success this year. If you really think Mirotic is as good of a player as Middleton I really can't help you...he isn't and it isn't close. Middleton has also become a 3-and-D player. Mirotic isn't a very good defender. While Middleton probably isn't work that $30M/year, he is to the Bucks especially if they succeed this year and I guarantee they pay him.

Like I said before, do you want to bet Middleton gets paid by the Bucks? Bc you seem so sure he is going to agree to a sign-and-trade after getting a max contract for AD lolzz that sounds crazy just typing it.

 

[buckalis]

Snell is not desirable lol.

J.R. Smith is more desirable and it's bc of his contract. J.R. SMITH.

Snell is a decent bench player but he saw less and less time for a reason. $12M for a bench player not even getting 12 mins a night isn't that desirable unless his contract brings perks and it doesn't.

You clearly don't value Middleton's role on this team. He is a key to their success this year. If you really think Mirotic is as good of a player as Middleton I really can't help you...he isn't and it isn't close. Middleton has also become a 3-and-D player. Mirotic isn't a very good defender. While Middleton probably isn't work that $30M/year, he is to the Bucks especially if they succeed this year and I guarantee they pay him.

Like I said before, do you want to bet Middleton gets paid by the Bucks? Bc you seem so sure he is going to agree to a sign-and-trade after getting a max contract for AD lolzz that sounds crazy just typing it.

Snell had 3 starts this season and he missed a lot of time due to multiple (but all minor) injuries... still as effective a shooter as ever and driving to the rim more than ever...

I never said that Middleton is worst player than Mirotic, nor I think one can compare the two... I said that Mirotic "fits" the Bucks roster better than Khris (better chemistry) if both are used at SF due to Giannis presence...

The comments that "Mirotic isn't a good defender" or that "J.R. Smith is more desirable than Snell" can only be made by one that knows "little" (i'm always polite at people) about the game of basketball...

 

[shopson67]

What's Brogdon going to get in free agency? Way more than his $3M cap hold. Bucks are almost $5M over the cap if you include their cap holds. If Middleton leaves, he only creates about $8M in cap space. If Hill is waived before 7/2, that saves another $17M, now up to $25M in cap space. Not enough for Kemba or Vucevic though. If Brogdon gets a new deal before other signings, he will eat up a LOT of that cap space. The REAL value for Hill would be via trade to a team desperate to shed salary, but the timing would almost have to be pre-FA to get done before 7/2 and give the other team time to waive him.

 

[dtgold88]

Snell had 3 starts this season and he missed a lot of time due to multiple (but all minor) injuries... still as effective a shooter as ever and driving to the rim more than ever...

I never said that Middleton is worst player than Mirotic, nor I think one can compare the two... I said that Mirotic "fits" the Bucks roster better than Khris (better chemistry) if both are used at SF due to Giannis presence...

The comments that "Mirotic isn't a good defender" or that "J.R. Smith is more desirable than Snell" can only be made by one that knows "little" (i'm always polite at people) about the game of basketball...

You do know little as this is about contract. Not skill. Snell has 2 years left and JR has one and can be bought out, I believe, for a few mil.

 

[Shanemansj13]

Snell had 3 starts this season and he missed a lot of time due to multiple (but all minor) injuries... still as effective a shooter as ever and driving to the rim more than ever...

I never said that Middleton is worst player than Mirotic, nor I think one can compare the two... I said that Mirotic "fits" the Bucks roster better than Khris (better chemistry) if both are used at SF due to Giannis presence...

The comments that "Mirotic isn't a good defender" or that "J.R. Smith is more desirable than Snell" can only be made by one that knows "little" (i'm always polite at people) about the game of basketball...

Snell has contributed absolutely nothing during the playoffs. He is the 13th man on the Bucks playoff roster. JR has playoff experience even if it is at the end of the bench. You do know Smith's contract is only $3.87M guaranteed, you can even stretch it over 3 years for a measly $1M per year. He adds just as much as Snell to end of the bench or more but at $10M cheaper. You are propping Snell up just like you are propping Mirotic up.

You keep proving you have no idea how contracts or value works. Nobody agrees with you. So do you want to make that Middleton bet? If you don't want to just go back to where you came from, you aren't adding any knowledge to this NBA forum with your stupidity and unrealistic FA scenarios.

 

[buckalis]

Snell had 3 starts this season and he missed a lot of time due to multiple (but all minor) injuries... still as effective a shooter as ever and driving to the rim more than ever...

I never said that Middleton is worst player than Mirotic, nor I think one can compare the two... I said that Mirotic "fits" the Bucks roster better than Khris (better chemistry) if both are used at SF due to Giannis presence...

The comment that "Mirotic isn't a good defender" can only be made by one that knows "little" (i'm always polite at people) about the game of basketball...

You do know little as this is about contract. Not skill. Snell has 2 years left and JR has one and can be bought out, I believe, for a few mil.

It seems to me that my "little" is much more than your "little" J.R. Smith is eligible for only 3M guaranteed on his contract, but only if he is waived before July the 1st... Unless I'm mistaken there are no trades that can be done until after July the 1st... Sooo... unless it's a "sign and trade" were he is used as a "salary filler" (most probably on a 3 team deal) forget it...

Snell has contributed absolutely nothing during the playoffs. He is the 13th man on the Bucks playoff roster. JR has playoff experience even if it is at the end of the bench. You do know Smith's contract is only $3.87M guaranteed, you can even stretch it over 3 years for a measly $1M per year. He adds just as much as Snell to end of the bench or more but at $10M cheaper. You are propping Snell up just like you are propping Mirotic up.

You keep proving you have no idea how contracts or value works. Nobody agrees with you. So do you want to make that Middleton bet? If you don't want to just go back to where you came from, you aren't adding any knowledge to this NBA forum with your stupidity and unrealistic FA scenarios.

You obviously are talking about things you know "very little" (I'm always polite at people) about... Snell was injured in the first round of the playoffs and was cleared only after the 3rd game against the Celtics were was "unready" and in "restricted minutes"... All other has being answered before...

 

[dtgold88]

It seems to me that my "little" is much more than your "little" J.R. Smith is eligible for only 3M guaranteed on his contract, but only if he is waived before July the 1st... Unless I'm mistaken there are no trades that can be done until after July the 1st... Sooo... unless it's a "sign and trade" were he is used as a "salary filler" (most probably on a 3 team deal) forget it...



You obviously are talking about things you know "very little" (I'm always polite at people) about... Snell was injured in the first round of the playoffs and was cleared only after the 3rd game against the Celtics were was "unready" and in "restricted minutes"... All other has being answered before...

Pretty sure this is incorrect, but even if true 1 year of JR better than 2 of snell.

 

[buckalis]

What's Brogdon going to get in free agency? Way more than his $3M cap hold. Bucks are almost $5M over the cap if you include their cap holds. If Middleton leaves, he only creates about $8M in cap space. If Hill is waived before 7/2, that saves another $17M, now up to $25M in cap space. Not enough for Kemba or Vucevic though. If Brogdon gets a new deal before other signings, he will eat up a LOT of that cap space. The REAL value for Hill would be via trade to a team desperate to shed salary, but the timing would almost have to be pre-FA to get done before 7/2 and give the other team time to waive him.

I have answered this in multiple cases... You obviously know "little" about Bucks cap space... The Bucks are full with contracts that have exeptions (bird rights, MLE etc...) they also have only 72M of guaranteed salaries for next season before they resign all their expirings (and Hill for much less), they additionally will be trading Snell (bird) and most probably Ilyasova (MLE) which combine 19M... Therefore the Bucks space to work with, starts at 53M before they "hit" the 132M lux tax for next season... More or less 80M to work with...