Ben Simmons-Joel Embiid Duo

[Sparhawk]

Cap room is worthless if the good free agents won't even look your way.

That's why it took 3 years to land a true #1 in Simmons.
If they had decided to win this past year, it would have been another disaster.
No free agent would be interested in that kind of team.

But, what if they surprise this year and win close to 30 games, wouldn't the rest of the league take notice?

 

[Sparhawk]

That explanation doesn't work with the claims that there weren't better options and that Hinkie has set up a great foundation.

You would have to define "better options".
Better options for winning in 2016? Or better options for long term success?
Big difference between those two.

As I've noted with the two possible lottery picks in 2017, they have a great foundation to work with and we have not even mentioned free agents or trade possibilities. Now, having confidence in Colangelo is an entirely different argument.

 

[shopson67]

Yes the backcourt is atrocious, but Hinkie did what he needed to do in accumulating future assets and young players. If the Lakers had drafted Okafor last year as expected, they would have a much better core group. I think Hinkie exucuted his plan very well, and we are about to find out if it works. The 6ers are 1-2 players away from having everything they need to build a future contender.

No thanks on Okafor. Lakers got the better player for their system in Russell, and a solid center in Zubac this summer. Russell/Clarkson/Ingram/Randle/Zubac is a great core, with vets sprinkled around at each position for leadership and depth.

I don't get the love affair for Okafor. He's a decent offensive player in the post, but that's it. Terrible defender, no range, cement-footed. If Embiid can get on the floor, Okafor is a backup. There are clear reasons that teams seem to want Noel more than Okafor. Rim protection and athleticism.

 

[mannyz]

Better than that lot of castoffs (and one ok prospect in Stauskas)? There had to be better options than Pressey, Canaan, Ish, Marshall, McConnell, etc.

I meant draft wise. They wanted the point guard, right now his name escapes me, but the Lakers took him, and we got Oak. I think people sell him short. He was 17/7 as a rookie, on the worst team in the league. For the most part he was the only option. Wait til we have some guys that can bang shots down from outside, and Simmons is feeding him the ball, he will blossom more.

 

[Sparhawk]

No thanks on Okafor. Lakers got the better player for their system in Russell, and a solid center in Zubac this summer. Russell/Clarkson/Ingram/Randle/Zubac is a great core, with vets sprinkled around at each position for leadership and depth.

I don't get the love affair for Okafor. He's a decent offensive player in the post, but that's it. Terrible defender, no range, cement-footed. If Embiid can get on the floor, Okafor is a backup. There are clear reasons that teams seem to want Noel more than Okafor. Rim protection and athleticism.

What bothers me is that Okafor shows offensive fluidity and nifty post moves when scoring, but none of that on defense. I'm beginning to think it's a mental thing and he just doesn't care to play defense, because he never had to at Duke. Have to hope he gets a chip on his shoulder, some motivational coaching, and shows improvement on defense.

 

[Sparhawk]

I meant draft wise. They wanted the point guard, right now his name escapes me, but the Lakers took him, and we got Oak. I think people sell him short. He was 17/7 as a rookie, on the worst team in the league. For the most part he was the only option. Wait til we have some guys that can bang shots down from outside, and Simmons is feeding him the ball, he will blossom more.

I think you have to be careful with 17/7 as a rookie because of MCWitis.

 

[shopson67]

And they have two potential 2017 lottery picks and FA to find them.

Good luck with FA. Anthony Davis hasn't had any luck drawing players to New Orleans.

 

[shopson67]

I meant draft wise. They wanted the point guard, right now his name escapes me, but the Lakers took him, and we got Oak. I think people sell him short. He was 17/7 as a rookie, on the worst team in the league. For the most part he was the only option. Wait til we have some guys that can bang shots down from outside, and Simmons is feeding him the ball, he will blossom more.

17/7 doesn't mean a lot when the team is worse with you on the floor (which the stats indicated last season).

 

[knowyourenemy]

I think you have to be careful with 17/7 as a rookie because of MCWitis.

I wish I had time to do the research but is 7 rebounds per game anything special out of a center playing 30 minutes per game? Granted, he's a rookie, but I know some of the really good centers, in their rookie years, averaged more rebounds than that.

 

[ericd7633]

Better than that lot of castoffs (and one ok prospect in Stauskas)? There had to be better options than Pressey, Canaan, Ish, Marshall, McConnell, etc.

Why would Hinkie over pay for marginal free agents? That makes zero sense. Let's over pay for guys like JR Smith, Imam Shumpert, Lou Williams etc...that's dumb.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

The Sixers will be a great team in a few years time. Unfortunately it'll take a few years of bad basketball before that happens. Same with the Lakers.

 

[shopson67]

The Sixers will be a great team in a few years time. Unfortunately it'll take a few years of bad basketball before that happens. Same with the Lakers.

To my eye, the Lakers are at least a year ahead of the Sixers' schedule.

 

[shopson67]

Why would Hinkie over pay for marginal free agents? That makes zero sense. Let's over pay for guys like JR Smith, Imam Shumpert, Lou Williams etc...that's dumb.

Again, if you're going to claim Hinkie left the team in great shape with nobody of worth in the backcourt, this argument doesn't fit.

Why the love and admiration for Hinkie anyway? The guy was basically forced out.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

To my eye, the Lakers are at least a year ahead of the Sixers' schedule.

I hope so. They're a little more well rounded in positions. I hope to hell Luke gives Zubac a fair chance this year though.

 

[shopson67]

I hope so. They're a little more well rounded in positions. I hope to hell Luke gives Zubac a fair chance this year though.

He will, but he won't rush him either. That's what Mozgov was (over)paid to do; bridge the gap and bring along the youngster.

 

[knowyourenemy]

Again, if you're going to claim Hinkie left the team in great shape with nobody of worth in the backcourt, this argument doesn't fit.

Why the love and admiration for Hinkie anyway? The guy was basically forced out.

What does being "forced out" have to do with whether Hinkie actually did a good job or not?

Hinkie left the team in great shape for the future. It doesn't matter that the team doesn't currently have a backcourt. It's all about the future. It's always been about ignoring the present circumstances and focusing on the future of the team.

 

[ericd7633]

Again, if you're going to claim Hinkie left the team in great shape with nobody of worth in the backcourt, this argument doesn't fit.

Why the love and admiration for Hinkie anyway? The guy was basically forced out.

He did leave them in great shape. He left them in way better shape now then when he took over this dumpster fire. I love how Hinkie acquired all those assets. The 5 guys he drafted/traded for in the first round only 2 of them have seen the court(with MCW traded away). The rebuild is still in it's infancy in that regard. This year we'll get to finally see all those assets(and not even all of them) on the court. I don't expect to make the playoffs because the roster is still so young, but the one good thing about young guys is that they can improve. Couple the current assets with the future assets and the Sixers are in a great position.

 

[shopson67]

What does being "forced out" have to do with whether Hinkie actually did a good job or not?

Fired - job performance not linked? The front office no longer had confidence that he could finish this rebuild.

 

[knowyourenemy]

Fired - job performance not linked? The front office no longer had confidence that he could finish this rebuild.

Hinkie was not fired. He resigned.

The front office was losing patience with the rebuild, but I don't know that they every fully lost confidence in Hinkie. They were also being pressured by the league to change their strategy.

Aside from that, and we've seen it in sports all too often, the mere perception that a GM hasn't done a good job doesn't mean that he actually did not do a good job. Unfortunately, the fruits of a GM's labors sometimes pay off after he is gone.

 

[shopson67]

Hinkie was not fired. He resigned.

The front office was losing patience with the rebuild, but I don't know that they every fully lost confidence in Hinkie. They were also being pressured by the league to change their strategy.

Aside from that, and we've seen it in sports all too often, the mere perception that a GM hasn't done a good job doesn't mean that he actually did not do a good job. Unfortunately, the fruits of a GM's labors sometimes pay off after he is gone.

He resigned because they were basically demoting him by taking away responsibilities. That's why I was saying "pushed out" in previous posts. Just semantics really.