Series Thread: Battle for the bottom.....Houston 8/8-10

[saddles]

This from Evan Grant for 2015:

They could be a contender

Pos. Player Best case scenario

C....Geovany Soto......Successful platoon with Robinson Chirinos
Don’t want to push Chirinos into larger role than he’s capable of handling

1B.....Prince Fielder....Returns to 30+ home run hitter
So much rides on his return to form

2B.......Rougned Odor......Becomes 2B version of Manny Machado
Impressive aptitude to go with big-league tools

3B.......Adrian Beltre.......Does what he’s done last three seasons
Heart and soul of this team

SS.........Jurickson Profar..........270 average, .340 OBP, solid defense
Big risk to have such a young middle infield

LF.......Shin-Soo Choo.........A better ankle helps him return to .380 OBP
Must play with less pressure to live up to contract

CF......Leonys Martin.......Becomes Carl Crawford circa 2008
He just may not be player Rangers envisioned

RF.......Matt Kemp......Makes people forget Josh Hamilton
Is there framework for an Elvis Andrus-led trade package?

DH.......Billy Butler........A buy low guy who pays big dividends
Could platoon with Mike Carp or Mitch Moreland

SP
Yu Darvish.........Wins his Cy Young
He’s one of the five best pitchers in the AL right now

Jon Lester.......Elite 1-2 combination with Darvish
Could be great (albeit expensive) role model for Holland

Derek Holland.......Pitches like a No. 2 in the No. 3 spot
Will he ever fully realize potential?

Colby Lewis........Adds another chapter to great comeback story
He will work pretty cheap

Nick Tepesch.........The third time around he “gets it”
Still inconsistent but showing signs of improvement

That is a pipe dream and personnel decisions shouldn't be based on pipe dreams. I hope that is Evan's way of saying that he doesn't have any real hope for 2015 because if he thinks those things are going to happen he has lost it.

 

[saddles]

The thing with EA is if we truly need to move either EA or Profar and EA gets hot with the bat then that is the time to trade him. We cannot say, hey, he is doing lousy so lets trade him now. We want to trade him when his value is high. I am not saying get rid of EA I am stating that is how we have to look at it if we are planning on moving EA for other pieces.

I think as soon as Elvis gets a better manager and hitting coach that he improves enough to make folks want to keep him here. Just a hunch.

 

[donaldson79]

The thing with EA is if we truly need to move either EA or Profar and EA gets hot with the bat then that is the time to trade him. We cannot say, hey, he is doing lousy so lets trade him now. We want to trade him when his value is high. I am not saying get rid of EA I am stating that is how we have to look at it if we are planning on moving EA for other pieces.

I think your point is rock solid. Can't find flaw one in the logic.

But here's my apprehension, what happens at 3rd base over the next few years? Profar is a natural replacement there when the time comes. And the time clock for Beltre is ticking toward the end sooner than later. This is of course if you're totally convinced Gallo will never suit up at the position.

Look, I love AB as much as any of ya. But he's going into his 18th season and has a history of leg problems. They aren't going to get better or go away. He's had a terrifically healthy season this year, knock on wood. And he's been a bell cow for us for 4 years - hopefully a few more to come.

But some of his AB may have to start coming at DH and maybe learning a new position, 1st base.

 

[donaldson79]

I think as soon as Elvis gets a better manager and hitting coach that he improves enough to make folks want to keep him here. Just a hunch.

Who was the manager when he played so well in his first 4 years the FO decided to invest $118 mil in him?

 

[DT LUNA]

That is a pipe dream and personnel decisions shouldn't be based on pipe dreams. I hope that is Evan's way of saying that he doesn't have any real hope for 2015 because if he thinks those things are going to happen he has lost it.

Just Evan being Evan. Lost like a goose in a barn yard.

 

[DT LUNA]

Who was the manager when he played so well in his first 4 years the FO decided to invest $118 mil in him?

Agree on the manager part not so much on a new hitting instructor.

 

[jta4437]

That is a pipe dream and personnel decisions shouldn't be based on pipe dreams. I hope that is Evan's way of saying that he doesn't have any real hope for 2015 because if he thinks those things are going to happen he has lost it.

All this scenario is predicated on are health, improvement, signing Lester (or facsimile, ex: Shields), trading Kemp for Andrus, and signing Butler, all those are well in the realm of possibility

It's far from a pipe dream

 

[WastinSomeTime]

I think your point is rock solid. Can't find flaw one in the logic.

But here's my apprehension, what happens at 3rd base over the next few years? Profar is a natural replacement there when the time comes. And the time clock for Beltre is ticking toward the end sooner than later. This is of course if you're totally convinced Gallo will never suit up at the position.

Look, I love AB as much as any of ya. But he's going into his 18th season and has a history of leg problems. They aren't going to get better or go away. He's had a terrifically healthy season this year, knock on wood. And he's been a bell cow for us for 4 years - hopefully a few more to come.

But some of his AB may have to start coming at DH and maybe learning a new position, 1st base.

And I agree as I have been a big proponent of Profar moving to 3rd and AB to DH. I was just stating my case based on all those who want to trade EA. I can't help wonder if management is sticking with Gallo at 3rd and if that is the case then we have a situation again with Profar. And again I am not for that with Gallo either. Rather see him become a 1B/OF/DH.

 

[jta4437]

I think your point is rock solid. Can't find flaw one in the logic.

But here's my apprehension, what happens at 3rd base over the next few years? Profar is a natural replacement there when the time comes. And the time clock for Beltre is ticking toward the end sooner than later. This is of course if you're totally convinced Gallo will never suit up at the position.

Look, I love AB as much as any of ya. But he's going into his 18th season and has a history of leg problems. They aren't going to get better or go away. He's had a terrifically healthy season this year, knock on wood. And he's been a bell cow for us for 4 years - hopefully a few more to come.

But some of his AB may have to start coming at DH and maybe learning a new position, 1st base.

Healthy or not, his range has evaporated, I'd prefer to keep Andrus and play Profar at 3B in the future

 

[WastinSomeTime]

All this scenario is predicated on are health, improvement, signing Lester (or facsimile, ex: Shields), trading Kemp for Andrus, and signing Butler, all those are well in the realm of possibility

It's far from a pipe dream

I would love to have Lester but I just have this hunch that he will go back to Boston. But like your idea you have had for some time in going after Shields.

 

[donaldson79]

Agree on the manager part not so much on a new hitting instructor.

And I agree with this.

 

[jta4437]

I would love to have Lester but I just have this hunch that he will go back to Boston. But like your idea you have had for some time in going after Shields.

Yeah I just saw Lester as the placeholder for whatever FA pitcher we got, which I think we get at least one, but probably not the 2 that most people want or think we need

Grant obviously likes Lester but I think its more like an <insert #2/3 starter here> wish

I also think Lester returns to Boston, I like the idea of signing Shields, just never was a big fan of trading for him

 

[donaldson79]

All this scenario is predicated on are health, improvement, signing Lester (or facsimile, ex: Shields), trading Kemp for Andrus, and signing Butler, all those are well in the realm of possibility

It's far from a pipe dream

.....The only one that's out there is Lester. All the rest of the moves are very attainable and achievable IMO.

 

[DT LUNA]

.....The only one that's out there is Lester. All the rest of the moves are very attainable and achievable IMO.

As much as I agree, are they probable? Kemp for Andrus? Not if Profar is headed for 3rd but when does that occur? Butler? Knee deep in DH. Possible yes, probable no.

 

[jta4437]

As much as I agree, are they probable? Kemp for Andrus? Not if Profar is headed for 3rd but when does that occur? Butler? Knee deep in DH. Possible yes, probable no.

I don't think its much of a pipe dream thats all,

Only thing on that list I would do would be sign a FA starting pitcher of the 2/3 variety, preferably Shields IMO

No interest in Butler, like you said, plenty of DH types going forward as is

I'd rather keep Andrus, and eventually move Profar to 3B, possibly starting next year for stretches, like I said Beltre's range is shot, there's your DH

 

[DT LUNA]

I don't think its much of a pipe dream thats all,

Only thing on that list I would do would be sign a FA starting pitcher of the 2/3 variety, preferably Shields IMO

No interest in Butler, like you said, plenty of DH types going forward as is

I'd rather keep Andrus, and eventually move Profar to 3B, possibly starting next year for stretches, like I said Beltre's range is shot, there's your DH

That's pretty much the way I look at it. MM JPA likely gone at that time. Side note: Would really like to pick up a better UIF

 

[Wamu]

The Rockies are playing some excellent baseball this year.

 

[donaldson79]

As much as I agree, are they probable? Kemp for Andrus? Not if Profar is headed for 3rd but when does that occur? Butler? Knee deep in DH. Possible yes, probable no.

Kemp would be the big bat we want in the OF. But Lord he's got injury concerns, beyond injury concerns to me. For me, no thanks. But he would, on paper, address some of my RBI concerns.

I'm all for at least semi platooning Profar with AB at 3rd for next season. Then if all goes well, Profar can spell EA at SS, and Odor at 2nd too.

Beltre is going to fight it all the way. I get it and understand it. But tough shit. His range is limited now and next year will be his last on contract. We've got to plan toward the future IMO.

I'm with jta at the DH position. I'd much rather see resting players there, and utilizing the position with Prince/Beltre than just paying for a guy who can only DH. No interest in having an Adam Dunn type guy.

 

[DT LUNA]

Kemp would be the big bat we want in the OF. But Lord he's got injury concerns, beyond injury concerns to me. For me, no thanks. But he would, on paper, address some of my RBI concerns.

I'm all for at least semi platooning Profar with AB at 3rd for next season. Then if all goes well, Profar can spell EA at SS, and Odor at 2nd too.

Beltre is going to fight it all the way. I get it and understand it. But tough shit. His range is limited now and next year will be his last on contract. We've got to plan toward the future IMO.

I'm with jta at the DH position. I'd much rather see resting players there, and utilizing the position with Prince/Beltre than just paying for a guy who can only DH. No interest in having an Adam Dunn type guy.

A likely scenario for next year.

 

[jta4437]

That's pretty much the way I look at it. MM JPA likely gone at that time. Side note: Would really like to pick up a better UIF

I think Sardinas is the guy, I'm not as high on him as others are, I just don't see him as a full time starter

That's not to say I don't like him, I just think his bat limits him to a part time role, he makes Andrus look like a slugger