Austin Davis experiment should be over now

[ANGELAKERAMS]

I never said that. You said I was crazy if "I didn't think Davis would have done as well as Hill" but winning is a different thing.

Davis very well could have won that game.

He is a gunslinger and has the ability to win games as easily as he can lose them at this point in his career.

That unknown is a scary thing for the conservative approach Fisher wants to establish and is probably the reason we see a more stable QB in the starting role.

I think Davis can be both.

The stable QB that Fisher needs and the gunslinger with wheels to make a play when needed.

I just don't think that Davis has enough experience to be that guy that Fisher can live and work with.

Jeff had a guy like this in the past who had both attributes in the name of 'Air McNair'. I use his nickname because as much as he was a threat with his wheels he still earned a nickname of Air McNair. Steve McNair was a pass first guy who had great escapeability that he used at precise times.

This is an important aspect that Davis needs to learn IMO. Extending plays can work against you by making your offensive line work much harder when they don't need to. Especially when you fail to convert a positive play.

So it's not like JF is against a guy like this as his starter, Fisher just needs to feel that he can count on his stater to make decisions that are going to put his offense in situations that will keep down and distances productive.

Those decisions that Davis has made at critical times in games, wins or losses, that has not only put JF at odds but the entire coaching staff.

Maybe that coaching staff and I are all crazy and guys with your opinion are right but it's not either your ass nor mine that's on the line, is it?

Vita

I agree with what you are saying.

But Smed's and my issue is that they aren't letting Davis finish out the season to see if he can figure it out and be that guy.

Therefore, because they aren't looking at Davis for the whole season, they will go into the draft looking for a QB when they may have one already but refused to see it through.

Therefore, they will be wasting a high pick that may not need to be wasted.

Smed and I are not saying Hill is the wrong choice because of his play. We are saying he's the wrong choice due to the future implications it puts on the team by not riding Davis out and getting an accurate assessment.

Like you said. Davis is basically a rookie due to never playing a regular season game until week 1. To think he's going to come in and not make rookie mistakes is ridiculous. He's still young and he still has potential. What kind of potential? We will never find out with him riding the pine.

Can he be the Rams starter? I don't know.

Would they still need to draft a franchise QB in the draft even though they have Davis? I don't know.

These are the things I would like the answers to and won't get the answers to with Hill starting.

That's my problem.

The wins are great. But I would rather suffer through a couple of extra loses this year than to go into the offseason not knowing if Bradford or Davis can be our QB and wasting a high draft pick to take one because the FO wasn't patient enough to find out if they already had one.

Because we all know Hill isn't that guy.

 

[Smed55]

Vita

I agree with what you are saying.

But Smed's and my issue is that they aren't letting Davis finish out the season to see if he can figure it out and be that guy.

Therefore, because they aren't looking at Davis for the whole season, they will go into the draft looking for a QB when they may have one already but refused to see it through.

Therefore, they will be wasting a high pick that may not need to be wasted.

Smed and I are not saying Hill is the wrong choice because of his play. We are saying he's the wrong choice due to the future implications it puts on the team by not riding Davis out and getting an accurate assessment.


Like you said. Davis is basically a rookie due to never playing a regular season game until week 1. To think he's going to come in and not make rookie mistakes is ridiculous. He's still young and he still has potential. What kind of potential? We will never find out with him riding the pine.

Can he be the Rams starter? I don't know.

Would they still need to draft a franchise QB in the draft even though they have Davis? I don't know.

These are the things I would like the answers to and won't get the answers to with Hill starting.

That's my problem.

The wins are great. But I would rather suffer through a couple of extra loses this year than to go into the offseason not knowing if Bradford or Davis can be our QB and wasting a high draft pick to take one because the FO wasn't patient enough to find out if they already had one.

Because we all know Hill isn't that guy.

^^^^^^
what he said

Again, in this game Davis wouldn't have had to be a gunslinger, we were up and the defense didn't give up the lead where Davis would have had to try to make something happen!

If the defense hadn't blown the Dallas game, and the SF game, or Philly, out of those three, we win two of those we are sitting at 6-4 with Davis as our QB, how can anyone complain about that? There will be games where he sucks, but with him at QB we could easily be 6-4, but the defense failed him!

Even last week against KC, Davis played well until the defense gave up the lead, then he had a couple of bounces of the football that didn't go his way, and there you go!

I mentioned earlier, last week Drew Brees more or less lost the game to Sf because of his turnovers, Manning yesterday made two awful throws, which were very poor decisions on his part, should he be benched? Obviously young QBs are going to make their share of mistakes, for crying out loud, so called veteran, experienced, QB's are also still going to make their share of mistakes.

I still think Davis will be back in as the started before the year is over, unfortunately it will be because our oline is terrible and Hill will get hurt again. Yes the oline played a good game this past weekend, but I don't see that being the norm"

 

[Smed55]

I never said that. You said I was crazy if "I didn't think Davis would have done as well as Hill" but winning is a different thing.

Davis very well could have won that game.

He is a gunslinger and has the ability to win games as easily as he can lose them at this point in his career.

That unknown is a scary thing for the conservative approach Fisher wants to establish and is probably the reason we see a more stable QB in the starting role.

I think Davis can be both.

The stable QB that Fisher needs and the gunslinger with wheels to make a play when needed.

I just don't think that Davis has enough experience to be that guy that Fisher can live and work with.


Jeff had a guy like this in the past who had both attributes in the name of 'Air McNair'. I use his nickname because as much as he was a threat with his wheels he still earned a nickname of Air McNair. Steve McNair was a pass first guy who had great escapeability that he used at precise times.

This is an important aspect that Davis needs to learn IMO. Extending plays can work against you by making your offensive line work much harder when they don't need to. Especially when you fail to convert a positive play.

So it's not like JF is against a guy like this as his starter, Fisher just needs to feel that he can count on his stater to make decisions that are going to put his offense in situations that will keep down and distances productive.

Those decisions that Davis has made at critical times in games, wins or losses, that has not only put JF at
odds but the entire coaching staff.

Maybe that coaching staff and I are all crazy and guys with your opinion are right but it's not either your ass nor mine that's on the line, is it?

I guess our opinions will just have to differ, I "DO" believe Davis would have played just as well as Hill, if not punched in at least one or two of those red zone opportunities. I'm sorry, but if Davis had the blocking, wide open receivers, running game, lack of penalties, that Hill had, I absolutely believe he would have done as well if not better than Hill!!! Davis has not had those things go his way this year, it may nit go that way for Hill either going forward, we are talking about the Rams, and we NEVER Know what we are going to get from them!

 

[RamsFan]

I am not sure why the continued debate about Austin Davis, he is just not that good as an NFL QB.

Kansas City, SF and Arizona defenses completely confused him at critical times in the game and he made mistakes. If it was not for a fake punt against the Seahawks and a fumble by SF on the goal line, he would have only one 1 game in 8 starts.

I would rather not watch the Rams lose just to start Austin Davis for the rest of the year to find out whether he is the QB of the future for the Rams.

I am very happy the Rams coaching staff made the right choice and started Hill because for at least one week in the NFL season, the Rams have gotten some respect around the league for the way they played against the Broncos. Winning beats losing every time.

 

[Vitamike]

Well said RamsFan!

Except I am willing to take my lumps with Davis to see if he can be that guy.

And Smed, you are right!

We will just have to disagree on whether Davis would have done just as well or not.

But so far my prediction prior to the Denver game stating Hill would get sacked less is holding up. That prediction was predicated on this philosophy of sustaining drives by good QB decision making.

This too helped our defense stay fresh by controlling the clock.

Amazing how we change QB's and all of a sudden our piss poor oline and our piss poor time of possession change at the same time.

It's could just be a coincidence but we will just have to sit back and see how things play out and even then we would probably still disagree.

Either way Smed, one thing we can agree upon ...

Whichever direction we must take (Because neither of us has a say), let's hope it will be a very positive one!

 

[Vitamike]

Vita

I agree with what you are saying.

But Smed's and my issue is that they aren't letting Davis finish out the season to see if he can figure it out and be that guy.

Therefore, because they aren't looking at Davis for the whole season, they will go into the draft looking for a QB when they may have one already but refused to see it through.

Therefore, they will be wasting a high pick that may not need to be wasted.

Smed and I are not saying Hill is the wrong choice because of his play. We are saying he's the wrong choice due to the future implications it puts on the team by not riding Davis out and getting an accurate assessment.

Like you said. Davis is basically a rookie due to never playing a regular season game until week 1. To think he's going to come in and not make rookie mistakes is ridiculous. He's still young and he still has potential. What kind of potential? We will never find out with him riding the pine.

Can he be the Rams starter? I don't know.

Would they still need to draft a franchise QB in the draft even though they have Davis? I don't know.

These are the things I would like the answers to and won't get the answers to with Hill starting.

That's my problem.

The wins are great. But I would rather suffer through a couple of extra loses this year than to go into the offseason not knowing if Bradford or Davis can be our QB and wasting a high draft pick to take one because the FO wasn't patient enough to find out if they already had one.

Because we all know Hill isn't that guy.

You know ALR you and I actually agree.

I hope when (And I do mean when) Davis comes back to close out the season. He continues to learn from tape, Hill's demonstrated decision making and masters some skills like stepping up in the pocket, releasing the ball quicker, identifies defensive disguises, blitz packages and finds open receivers he was missing in earlier games.

These backups in the league are truly one play away and continued growth may still happen for Davis as he waits in the wings.

 

[zeke2829]

Well said RamsFan!

Except I am willing to take my lumps with Davis to see if he can be that guy.

And Smed, you are right!

We will just have to disagree on whether Davis would have done just as well or not.

But so far my prediction prior to the Denver game stating Hill would get sacked less is holding up. That prediction was predicated on this philosophy of sustaining drives by good QB decision making.

This too helped our defense stay fresh by controlling the clock.

Amazing how we change QB's and all of a sudden our piss poor oline and our piss poor time of possession change at the same time.

It's could just be a coincidence but we will just have to sit back and see how things play out and even then we would probably still disagree.

Either way Smed, one thing we can agree upon ...

Whichever direction we must take (Because neither of us has a say), let's hope it will be a very positive one!

I am not ready to give up on Austin Davis just yet. He is getting a bad rap because of all of the pick 6's he's thrown. At the time he threw those picks it was late in the game and he was basically in desperation mode! Sure he's young and inexperienced. But I believe if he is given time/weapons he has the intangibles to be a great qb,

Hill on the on hand, played a great game yesterday! But I didn't like the fact that we were 0-3 in the red zone. Why is that? We go down the field pretty easily then stall at the crucial point where we need to put points up. You have to be able to put points up against a team like Denver. Actually we would have slaughtered them had we scored 5 TDs instead of 5 FGs. I'm not so sure Austin Davis would have scored in the red zone at these points in the game either. Overall I think it comes down to lack of playmakers.

I still think its a little early to judge Shawn Hill, he has had bad games where he looked terrible as well, anyone remember week 1 the Minnesota game?? In the Viking game he was benched because of a so-called injury. It looked as though Jeff Fisher was pissed off due to his poor play and an interception thrown and no points scored in the 1st half of our opening game. After the game Jeff Fisher was ask on why he pulled Shawn Hill and this is when he stated that he had an so called injury. If you ask me I think he was pissed off at his poor play. At the end of the game Hill made this comment.

The 34-year-old Hill made his first start since 2010 and was 8 for 13 for 81 yards. After the game, he was guarded about his status and also declined to discuss how he was hurt.
"I'm going to leave all comments about the injury up to coach Fisher," Hill said.
Davis, who was 16 for 23 for 192 yards and an interception, has been with the Rams at least parts of the last three seasons

 

[Smed55]

I am not sure why the continued debate about Austin Davis, he is just not that good as an NFL QB.

Kansas City, SF and Arizona defenses completely confused him at critical times in the game and he made mistakes. If it was not for a fake punt against the Seahawks and a fumble by SF on the goal line, he would have only one 1 game in 8 starts.

I would rather not watch the Rams lose just to start Austin Davis for the rest of the year to find out whether he is the QB of the future for the Rams.

I am very happy the Rams coaching staff made the right choice and started Hill because for at least one week in the NFL season, the Rams have gotten some respect around the league for the way they played against the Broncos. Winning beats losing every time.[/QUOTE


How confinient for your argument that you don't mention the fact that Davis played a great game against Dallas and had them up 21-0 until the DEFENSE lost that game, also Cook dropped a TD pass in that game!

What about the Philly game, another great game that the DEFENSE Lost,

How about the first SF game where Davis played an efficient game, until the DEFENSE blew it

As far as the Seattle game, yes we won because of a fake punt, but if we would have lost it wouldn't have been because of Davis 17-20 with 2 TD passes!

As far as his turnovers, they have come after the Defense has given up the lead and Davis has tried to make something happen!

You also fail to mention that the veteran, experienced, great decision making Hill made a horrible decision and pass in that Minnesota game that may have cost us the game. Score wise we got smoked, but it should have been 6-0, instead of 13-0 because he threw that interception right before the half, and he got us how many points in that first half, oh that's right ZERO!

Again, Hill had all day against Denver, and it wasn't because of his so called great leadership and decision making, it's because our oline played out of their minds and did what they are paid to do for once, our WR got open all day, and we played without penalties, all these things are a luxury that Davis has not had!

This was one game, we will see if this oline can play like that again, if they don't Hill will not be the right guy to have back there because he will get buried

 

[Smed55]

Well said RamsFan!

Except I am willing to take my lumps with Davis to see if he can be that guy.

And Smed, you are right!

We will just have to disagree on whether Davis would have done just as well or not.

But so far my prediction prior to the Denver game stating Hill would get sacked less is holding up. That prediction was predicated on this philosophy of sustaining drives by good QB decision making.

This too helped our defense stay fresh by controlling the clock.

Amazing how we change QB's and all of a sudden our piss poor oline and our piss poor time of possession change at the same time.:


It's could just be a coincidence but we will just have to sit back and see how things play out and even then we would probably still disagree.

Either way Smed, one thing we can agree upon ...

Whichever direction we must take (Because neither of us has a say), let's hope it will be a very positive one!

You were correct about the less sacks, but the reason was because the oline played better, not anything Hill did or didn't do!

 

[Vitamike]

You were correct about the less sacks, but the reason was because the oline played better, not anything Hill did or didn't do!

Again we just disagree however a week ago, plenty here on these boards were saying how crappy the Rams offensive line was and that specifically attributed to Davis' poor play at QB.

Some went as far as posting a GIF to show a 'microcosm' of the Rams offensive line woes failing to block a 3 man rush giving Davis no time to do anything but take a sack. That same week, we get an announcement from Fisher of the change at QB and I predict, even with that same 'so called' crappy line, that Hill will get sacked less than Davis based on a philosophy of good decision making from a vet QB.

So what changed for you besides QB?

I mean, what do you account the miraculous turnaround by our offensive line to?

I'm sure it's something better than .. 'The Stars Aligned perfect! And Everything Went Our Way'.

So help me understand your argument and why our offensive line went from super crappy to 'playing better' in one short week?

 

[Smed55]

Again we just disagree however a week ago, plenty here on these boards were saying how crappy the Rams offensive line was and that specifically attributed to Davis' poor play at QB.

Some went as far as posting a GIF to show a 'microcosm' of the Rams offensive line woes failing to block a 3 man rush giving Davis no time to do anything but take a sack. That same week, we get an announcement from Fisher of the change at QB and I predict, even with that same 'so called' crappy line, that Hill will get sacked less than Davis based on a philosophy of good decision making from a vet QB.

So what changed for you besides QB?

I mean, what do you account the miraculous turnaround by our offensive line to?

I'm sure it's something better than .. 'The Stars Aligned perfect! And Everything Went Our Way'.


So help me understand your argument and why our offensive line went from super crappy to 'playing better' in one short week?

It was one game, we will see going forward! Maybe the stars did align, I don't know. But you tell me what did Hill have to do with it?

 

[SJ76]

On the road at AZ: crowd noise which is pretty crucial for a Oline, AZ has a better defense than Denver, Mason had twice as many carries versus Denver and ran effectively and yeah... Olines can improve. Especially coming home to play after a brutal 3 game road trip.

But the bottom line is: AZ is a top 3 defense. And make a case all u want for Denver, but they play in the AFC west, not the NFC west. Defenses rule in our division. It raises the bar.

It is what it is.

Bottom line #2: we won. but my MVPs go
Like this:

Defense
Greg Z
Mason and Oline
Hill

 

[SJ76]

And didn't Jake long get knocked out in the AZ game or before? So maybe it took them a game or so for the cohesion to take affect?

I don't know. I think if we run the ball down ANYONEs throat and don't abandon the run, any QB could manage the game. Problem is OCs these days abandon the run pretty quick. Granted AZ was stout against the run, but Mason was getting his chunks of yardage.

 

[SJ76]

I am not sure why the continued debate about Austin Davis, he is just not that good as an NFL QB.

Kansas City, SF and Arizona defenses completely confused him at critical times in the game and he made mistakes. If it was not for a fake punt against the Seahawks and a fumble by SF on the goal line, he would have only one 1 game in 8 starts.

Lol. The chiefs are in first place and torching people. We BEAT San Fran in San Fran and Davis played well. So what are you talking about? The rams led AZ for 3 quarters before the wheels came off. Did you see the Lions (playoff team) at AZ this week? Did you see what Stafford did? Nada and 1 INT. so
Basically Davis lost to 2 first place teams ON THE ROAD!

I think Davis needs to learn more for sure.

But you take any QB in the league and throw him on the road for 3 games in a row against top NFL talent and see what happens. Hill would not have done any better for those 3 straight road games.

Please. When Shaun Hill goes on the road against a stout D we can talk.

Oh and Denver's D isn't all that. They may have been ranked high at the time, but the lowest point total they have given up is 17!! put them in the NFC west and see how they do. New England just put up 43 on Denver so I'm calling bullshit on them being top 3 defense.

They got smacked around this weekend!

 

[SJ76]

So let me get this right here... Basically some of you are saying Davis is a worse QB than Hill because:

The Oline actually controlled the line of scrimmage against Denver, where the pocket kept Hill upright and allowed Mason to run the ball?



I just want to make sure I'm hearing this correct.

 

[Smed55]

So let me get this right here... Basically some of you are saying Davis is a worse QB than Hill because:

The Oline actually controlled the line of scrimmage against Denver, where the pocket kept Hill upright and allowed Mason to run the ball?



I just want to make sure I'm hearing this correct.

At least a few of us get it!

 

[SJ76]

Or Are these Sunday couch coaches/Monday critics that think:

Rams > Denver = Hill is better

But what about Rams > San Fran + On the road?

Many variables involved in winning and losing which is why u can't totally focus on stats. U can to a degree but there is more to the equation.


Again, I think some people need to lower expectations a bit. I get Davis made crucial mistakes that needs to learn from and maybe this works out great for everyone. But to say Davis is worse than Hill is pretty funny I think. Those were 3 brutal road games for our team. Maybe our Oline did learn something from them?


We will see after a road game how Hill does

Personally I think they are pretty close in performance. I think Davis has a higher ceiling, but has more to learn. He will be a solid back up somewhere. Or maybe he bounces back strong and starts. Who knows

 

[jacobarch]

So let me get this right here... Basically some of you are saying Davis is a worse QB than Hill because:

The Oline actually controlled the line of scrimmage against Denver, where the pocket kept Hill upright and allowed Mason to run the ball?



I just want to make sure I'm hearing this correct.

Im seriously glad we have people like you on these boards SJ. You notice the entire game not just one position. It boggles my mind when i see people blaming davis for the Rams offensive woes.

It's like the Rams Oline all of sudden "got it" vs. Denver. It's completely crazy to think that all of our offensive woes are corrected because the guys up front had a decent game. Sure they're playing better and we'll see if they can continue but I would take Davis over Hill any day of the week 365 days of the year.

 

[jacobarch]

To go further in what you're saying SJ.

Did you see all of the different formations with Hill in? Did you see the Pistol formation? I don't don't remember seeing that with Davis in...Schotty makes my head hurt.

 

[SJ76]

Jacob, it is my love for the game and sports in general that keep me on here, keep me fairly positive 90% of time, and it's you guys that put more info in my head that sometimes I don't even think about.

And yeah it's on coaching too. AKA stick with the run. Keep pounding it. Get another RB in the game... AND KEEP FUGGIN POUNDING IT! Play solid D. Get to their QB! That will help any QB/offense.

that is our identity.

It is what it is. Always will be.