ANYBODY WANT TO DEFEND BEVELL NOW????

[WizardHawk]

So, they win in spite of his ton of stupid play calls?

So many of my brethren are still so locked in shock that they haven't even entertained the idea of looking into the information the coaches had to work with at the time they went through that last sequence, more or less stepping back from having it meet their existing hatred goals for Bevell. Every game lost comes down to him and him alone. Every blown play is bad because he didn't call the right one.

It's partially because Wilson can do no wrong, so anything he isn't successful with has to be Bevell. This makes it far worse than other teams that tend to also quickly blame the play caller for most offensive ills.

You won't make headway with it man. They are immovable. Hate Bevell and look for every excuse to justify it. He is the only thing that separates this team from being the 3 time defending champs. No, really.

 

[tzorn10]

So you still have not offered a single response to the literally numbered logic of the play call I posted. You just call names and rant. Genius.

So the kid with the big glasses and the pocket protector that's crunching numbers in the corner says the pass was the best option and your going to stick with him. That's fine. Ill side with the rest the world thinking it was the wrong call. What do we know though as the pass play was so successful.

No matter how you put it, the play will always be remembered as 'The Dumbest Play In Superbowl History'. There's your logic.

 

[ElTexan]

So the kid with the big glasses and the pocket protector that's crunching numbers in the corner says the pass was the best option and your going to stick with him. That's fine. Ill side with the rest the world thinking it was the wrong call. What do we know though as the pass play was so successful.

No matter how you put it, the play will always be remembered as 'The Dumbest Play In Superbowl History'. There's your logic.

Genius at work. The logic is there, without any numbers crunched.

Throwing on 2nd down is the best call in that situation since you have to throw once to use all four downs.

I've spelled it out for you, even numbered it.

All you have countered with is name calling, rants, and appeal to authority fallacies.

Good luck on getting through life without logic.

 

[WizardHawk]

So the kid with the big glasses and the pocket protector that's crunching numbers in the corner says the pass was the best option and your going to stick with him. That's fine. Ill side with the rest the world thinking it was the wrong call. What do we know though as the pass play was so successful.

No matter how you put it, the play will always be remembered as 'The Dumbest Play In Superbowl History'. There's your logic.

Kurt Warner disagrees and I'm sure others will be on his side when people take the time to look at it reasonably.

But you just go right on holding onto blind hate.

Kurt actually said on the radio this morning that this was the right pass play to call. I haven't gotten into that discussion because it's outside of my expertise, but I'll take his word for it over yours or the other haters. He doesn't have an agenda in this thing, you all do.

I will say that given there were 108 pass plays called inside the 2y this season and 64 went for TD's with 0 going for INTs before this ill-fated play, the numbers aren't on your side for how risky it was as well.

The math doesn't match the assessment you guys are making. Lynch was 1-4 in 5 attempts inside the 1 this season which says something about the goal line blocking.

Stop just blindly hating and have a discussion about it. Be reasonable. Then if you want to go back to hating, by all means do so.

Simply saying it was the worst call ever because everyone says so is kind of dumb. Look at it before you parrot what so many others are saying.

 

[WizardHawk]

Genius at work. The logic is there, without any numbers crunched.

Throwing on 2nd down is the best call in that situation since you have to throw once to use all four downs.

I've spelled it out for you, even numbered it.

All you have countered with is name calling, rants, and appeal to authority fallacies.

Good luck on getting through life without logic.

I've tried reasoning with them as well and it's just not possible yet. Maybe after they calm down they will be more open, but right now this fits in with the hate Bevell mantra so there is no chance they will look at anything else.

Doesn't mean I won't keep at it.

 

[ElTexan]

I've tried reasoning with them as well and it's just not possible yet. Maybe after they calm down they will be more open, but right now this fits in with the hate Bevell mantra so there is no chance they will look at anything else.

Doesn't mean I won't keep at it.

Thanks man. The irony is: I have NO love for Pete Carroll or the brazen Hawks. I wanted them crushed.

But running on 1st 3rd and 4th and throwing on 2nd is the BEST logic given time, time out, etc.

It's rock solid logic.

To these humps, running the same number of run plays but choosing to run on 3rd instead of 2nd is somehow THE DUMBEST CALL OF ALL TIME. How would that little change make for such a change in opinion?

Further, Running on 2nd means you have to throw on third and the D knows it. It's a WORSE logic.

I can't deal with stupidity.

 

[WizardHawk]

Thanks man. The irony is: I have NO love for Pete Carroll or the brazen Hawks. I wanted them crushed.

But running on 1st 3rd and 4th and throwing on 2nd is the BEST logic given time, time out, etc.

It's rock solid logic.

To these humps, running the same number of run plays but choosing to run on 3rd instead of 2nd is somehow THE DUMBEST CALL OF ALL TIME. How would that little change make for such a change in opinion?

Further, Running on 2nd means you have to throw on third and the D knows it. It's a WORSE logic.

I can't deal with stupidity.

If you look back to the first few pages of this thread I was saying that shortly after the game. Now I still think you run it anyway and not worry about 3 downs vs 2, but the decision itself wasn't a bad one because it did give them 3 tries with two of them being run if you had the match up you liked.

Kurt Warner is saying that now and I'm dead sure others will say it as well as they look at it.

These guys up here are just too emotional to see it. They can talk about Herm or the others that said run it that night, but none of them had access to what the team had when they made those reactions. No way they all stick with it after they do.

History will not be on the side of those looking for Bevell's head after this game. The facts don't support it. AT ALL.

 

[BHF]

Kurt Warner disagrees and I'm sure others will be on his side when people take the time to look at it reasonably.

But you just go right on holding onto blind hate.

Kurt actually said on the radio this morning that this was the right pass play to call. I haven't gotten into that discussion because it's outside of my expertise, but I'll take his word for it over yours or the other haters. He doesn't have an agenda in this thing, you all do.

I will say that given there were 108 pass plays called inside the 2y this season and 64 went for TD's with 0 going for INTs before this ill-fated play, the numbers aren't on your side for how risky it was as well.

The math doesn't match the assessment you guys are making. Lynch was 1-4 in 5 attempts inside the 1 this season which says something about the goal line blocking.

Stop just blindly hating and have a discussion about it. Be reasonable. Then if you want to go back to hating, by all means do so.

Simply saying it was the worst call ever because everyone says so is kind of dumb. Look at it before you parrot what so many others are saying.

Wait...you crib stats from other websites, and then use a report of a phone call from Warner as support for you argument...and then you to chastise others for parroting? Wow. The lack of self-awareness is pretty breathtaking. C'mon, man. Your numbers are off (at least from the article I read), but that's splitting hairs. The zero INTs is correct. It supports the argument that throwing in that situation wasn't a bad call. But the Devil is in the details. How many of those were slants against goalline man? That's really the only stat that matters.

At any rate. You use Warner's phone call to support your argument. I'll use the Butler quote where he states that he knew to jump the route because the scout team was running that exact play in practice this week to support mine.

 

[ElTexan]

Nah. These idiot experts will stick to their idiocy. I guarantee it. That's why when anyone cites "experts" to me, I laugh in their face.

The same expert USC HC KIFFIN who ran that goal line offense against ND?

The same expert nc winner Malzahn who turned three calm tries into the end zone at the end of the iron bowl first half into one hurried rushed try?

The same experts who drafted Tim Tebow first rond, then other experts who ransomed him to NYC?

The same experts who are nearly unanimously calling this the worst call of all time even though the clearly articulated cold logic says it was the best call?

Laughable experts.

 

[ElTexan]

Wait...you crib stats from other websites, and then use a report of a phone call from Warner as support for you argument...and then you to chastise others for parroting? Wow. The lack of self-awareness is pretty breathtaking. C'mon, man. Your numbers are off (at least from the article I read), but that's splitting hairs. The zero INTs is correct. It supports the argument that throwing in that situation wasn't a bad call. But the Devil is in the details. How many of those were slants against goalline man? That's really the only stat that matters.

At any rate. You use Warner's phone call to support your argument. I'll use the Butler quote where he states that he knew to jump the route because the scout team was running that exact play in practice this week to support mine.

26 seconds, 1 time out, 2nd down. There are three options:

A. Run Lynch twice and not even worry about running a play on a 4th down... a 4th down you'll never see because of time. We call this option the DUMB option.

B. Run Lynch on 2nd down, call Time Out, and then the Defense knows that you have to Pass on 3rd.

C. Throw on 2nd which saves Time Out and keeps options open on 3rd [run or pass].

=====================

C. is the best option, which is what Carroll did.

 

[WizardHawk]

Wait...you crib stats from other websites, and then use a report of a phone call from Warner as support for you argument...and then you to chastise others for parroting? Wow. The lack of self-awareness is pretty breathtaking. C'mon, man. Your numbers are off (at least from the article I read), but that's splitting hairs. The zero INTs is correct. It supports the argument that throwing in that situation wasn't a bad call. But the Devil is in the details. How many of those were slants against goalline man? That's really the only stat that matters.

At any rate. You use Warner's phone call to support your argument. I'll use the Butler quote where he states that he knew to jump the route because the scout team was running that exact play in practice this week to support mine.

What other sites have I given stats from? And to me parroting Warner. You do realize I said those things AND THEN said he not only says the same thing, but goes farther. Meaning I didn't copy him. Or maybe you don't get the meaning of those words?

His phone call lasted quite a while. He ran down the options and went into detail about that particular pass play and what that was the best option. Again, I didn't memorize it and don't really care about that pass play vs any other.

My stance that it helps vindicate me holds true. I also contend you will find others coming around in the near future.

Still, I would have ran the ball, but in power formation and not worried about the need for a 4th down play. That's me.

The point is Bevell didn't ruin your SB victory parade and I will firmly stand by that.

Blame?
1. Pete Carroll. The buck stops with him. Don't let your OC worry over how many tries you get. Put the beast in and go for it.
2. Russell Wilson. Throw the ball away when you see Kearse sucked ass on his job for that play!
3. Bevell. Yes, I didn't like the call either, but it wasn't so bad he deserves first place in blame. Just wasn't.
4. Lockette. You don't get that many tries for a reason. Run the damned route like a pro.
5. Kearse. Browner fucking owned you man. Hold your head in disgrace.
6. Defense. They were letting Brady move at will to the point where the coaches HAD to worry about the clock if they scored.

One play doesn't win a game and one play doesn't lose it. The game was really lost when Lane and Avril went down. Too much for that defense to overcome. I guarantee you in more than 90% of their games with a reasonably healthy defense they win up 10 in the 4th. That they actually needed that late game comeback at all is against their formula because of it.

 

[WizardHawk]

I'll use the Butler quote where he states that he knew to jump the route because the scout team was running that exact play in practice this week to support mine.

Oh, and

So you will use information not known until after the game to justify how bad of a choice it was at the time it was made?

Wow. Just wow.

That's so dumb it just can't be discussed.

Wow.

 

[SJ76]

I you do throw in that sitiation... roll out Wilson and throw it outside or he can keep it.

But I run beast mode on 2nd down if it's me.

my .02

 

[BHF]

26 seconds, 1 time out, 2nd down. There are three options:

A. Run Lynch twice and not even worry about running a play on a 4th down... a 4th down you'll never see because of time. We call this option the DUMB option.

B. Run Lynch on 2nd down, call Time Out, and then the Defense knows that you have to Pass on 3rd.

C. Throw on 2nd which saves Time Out and keeps options open on 3rd [run or pass].

=====================

C. is the best option, which is what Carroll did.

And?

RIF, dude.

I've never said a pass was indefensible.

 

[BHF]

What other sites have I given stats from? And to me parroting Warner. You do realize I said those things AND THEN said he not only says the same thing, but goes farther. Meaning I didn't copy him. Or maybe you don't get the meaning of those words?

His phone call lasted quite a while. He ran down the options and went into detail about that particular pass play and what that was the best option. Again, I didn't memorize it and don't really care about that pass play vs any other.

My stance that it helps vindicate me holds true. I also contend you will find others coming around in the near future.

Still, I would have ran the ball, but in power formation and not worried about the need for a 4th down play. That's me.

The point is Bevell didn't ruin your SB victory parade and I will firmly stand by that.

Blame?
1. Pete Carroll. The buck stops with him. Don't let your OC worry over how many tries you get. Put the beast in and go for it.
2. Russell Wilson. Throw the ball away when you see Kearse sucked ass on his job for that play!
3. Bevell. Yes, I didn't like the call either, but it wasn't so bad he deserves first place in blame. Just wasn't.
4. Lockette. You don't get that many tries for a reason. Run the damned route like a pro.
5. Kearse. Browner fucking owned you man. Hold your head in disgrace.
6. Defense. They were letting Brady move at will to the point where the coaches HAD to worry about the clock if they scored.

One play doesn't win a game and one play doesn't lose it. The game was really lost when Lane and Avril went down. Too much for that defense to overcome. I guarantee you in more than 90% of their games with a reasonably healthy defense they win up 10 in the 4th. That they actually needed that late game comeback at all is against their formula because of it.

1. A defensive coach who micromanages the offense is nothing short of a dumbfuck.
2. This shows a clear lack of understanding of the play. Wilson has no time to read anybody but Lockette. Sure, eh should have put it lower, if it was physically possible. But it wasn't.
3. Well...yeah.
4. Sure. But in no way, shape, or form should a WR with his (lack of) skills be put in a do or die situation. Frigging stupid. You call that route for Baldwin or (maybe) Kearse. That is all on Bevell.
5. Umm..sure? I guess. Browner beat him on that play. It happens.
6. Really? No Lane. No Avril. Against a first ballot HOF QB and possible GOAT at his position? They gave up four scoring drives, but also forced two turnovers. Not a terrible day at all.

And are you going to argue to say that you spent the day researching every red zone pass attempt for the season? LOL. Okay.

 

[BHF]

Oh, and

So you will use information not known until after the game to justify how bad of a choice it was at the time it was made?

Wow. Just wow.

That's so dumb it just can't be discussed.

Wow.

Wow. You can't understand basic parallels, huh? Explains a few things.

 

[tzorn10]

Kurt Warner disagrees and I'm sure others will be on his side when people take the time to look at it reasonably.

Emmitt Smith said it was the worst play call he has ever seen in the HISTORY of football, but I'm sure you think Kurt Warner is more qualified.


I just watched 'Around The Horn' before I came into work and Bill Plaschke said he was covering the game and has never seen such dissension with players before. We only heard of a few from the media giving their opinions about how bad the call was, but Plaschke said it was so bad with just about all of them that he swears there's going to be problems next season. Some will be anti Carroll and others will stick beside him. He said don't be surprised if we saw the last of the Seahawks that we're all familiar with. Hope not.

 

[tzorn10]

Thanks man. The irony is: I have NO love for Pete Carroll or the brazen Hawks. I wanted them crushed.

But running on 1st 3rd and 4th and throwing on 2nd is the BEST logic given time, time out, etc.

It's rock solid logic.

To these humps, running the same number of run plays but choosing to run on 3rd instead of 2nd is somehow THE DUMBEST CALL OF ALL TIME. How would that little change make for such a change in opinion?

Further, Running on 2nd means you have to throw on third and the D knows it. It's a WORSE logic.

I can't deal with stupidity.

Given that you see yourself as such an intellect, I need to ask you,,,,do you feel Lynch would have scored if given the ball twice from the 1 yrd line? I and most others do.

 

[tzorn10]

The game was really lost when Lane and Avril went down. Too much for that defense to overcome.

I keep hearing about Avril, but am stumped on that. What had he done up to that point in the 3rd quarter when he went out? I remember him being pretty much absent until he got hurt. I told my buddy that Bennett was the only person doing anything on the D-Line. Lane is better then Simon for sure, but he probably gets scorched too for at least that TD. I don't see those 2 guys costing the Seahawks the game.

 

[ElTexan]

Emmitt Smith said it was the worst play call he has ever seen in the HISTORY of football, but I'm sure you think Kurt Warner is more qualified.


I just watched 'Around The Horn' before I came into work and Bill Plaschke said he was covering the game and has never seen such dissension with players before. We only heard of a few from the media giving their opinions about how bad the call was, but Plaschke said it was so bad with just about all of them that he swears there's going to be problems next season. Some will be anti Carroll and others will stick beside him. He said don't be surprised if we saw the last of the Seahawks that we're all familiar with. Hope not.

You still using "appeal to authority" arguments instead of responding to the clearly articulated and even numerated logic shown to you.

You are really special.