AL Central Smack Talk

[StanMarsh51]

Who was the giants best hitter in 2000?

The guy who led the team in...
-runs
-HR
-OBP
-SLG
-OPS+
-BB

And that guy wasn't Kent

 

[Cleaves2000]

Hahahaha, nothing to do with his poor arm eh? Stats monkeys always love em some Trout, unconditionally. I only hope I get to hear about Harper on here. Being its an AL Central Smack Talk Thread, I'm sure you cute little monkeys will find a way to spit some of his stats out before you meet up online to play Warcraft after you're done tutoring the baseball team in math.

Haha remember the south park episode where they played warcraft? Lol are u fat stan marsh? Zits all over your face....oops your hot pocket is done.

 

[Cleaves2000]

The guy who led the team in...
-runs
-HR
-OBP
-SLG
-OPS+
-BB

And that guy wasn't Kent

The 306 hitter bonds? So you chose 6 stats that bonds led.....not average.....not hits......walks? HR? So is adam dunn the white sox best hitter?

I think 334 33HR's and 125RBI's make u the best hitter on the team that year....he batted 28 points higher.....you said hitter, NOT player

 

[broncosmitty]

Nah it was goose from top gun....booger.....gay blk dood......kung fu's brother......the neighbor from married with children....the 2nd guy not the first one...think he was in happy days too.....john goodman was the coach.....the guy from field of dreams...the brother i think....ummmmmm....i think thats it. Ogre was the big guy that was in alot of movies....hes on the comercials as a barbarian or viking or sumthin

The brother with the beard, that doesn't believe ghosts live in the cornfield, that's sitting in the stands when the little girl chokes on the hotdog, and Moonlight Graham has to give up baseball? I didn't like that guy.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

..

Originally Posted by ImSmartherThanYou View Post
Trout .325/.399/.564, with a 169 OPS+ in 639 plate appearances
Cabrera .330/.393/.606 with a 166 OPS+ in 697 plate appearances

So offensively, they were pretty similar, but I'll give Miggy an edge since he played more games. Then, you have to consider that Cabrera was a liability on defense and a non-factor on the bases. Meanwhile, Trout played elite defense at a premium position and added value with his baserunning.

Seems like Trout was more valuable to me without ever looking at WAR. The Triple Crown is certainly impressive and historic, but it's ultimately an arbitrary accomplishment. Why are those the three Triple Crown categories? It's not like they're the three most important offensive stats or the three best measures of a hitter's quality. I'm glad I got to see someone hit for the TC in my lifetime, and Cabrera is obviously the best hitter in baseball, and his 2012 MVP isn't the most egregious selection of all-time by a longshot, but you'll never convince any objective, knowledgeable baseball fan that Trout wasn't the more valuable player.

I love how Cabrera is Trout were "comparable" offensively. Other than the fact, Cabrera led the AL in hits, home runs, RBI's, Batting Average, Slugging % and OPS -- they were virtually identical. LMAO.

Let's disregard the fact that in the last two months, when the Angels were making their push for the playoffs, Trout hit roughly .265-.270 with 64 strikeouts to go with 59 hits. Cabrera during that same time period, hit roughly .335-.340 with 18 home runs and 51 rbi's.

Trout was so valuable to the Angels -- their best month of the season, August, where they went 18-9. Trout hit .257 with 32 k's to go with 26 hits and a whopping 6 rbi's.

As I said last year -- if the MVP was handed out in July. Trout would have won it -- he was red hot for a couple months there. His last couple months though, when LAA was making a playoff push, he was average at best.

You can try and spin stats however you'd like. The only thing that matters is what you can prove. Sabermetrics is nothing more than educated guesses. As someone who used educated guessing quite often in my schooling, I can tell you with certainty -- you are wrong more than you are right. I learned that the hard way in high school, as I had to sign an academic probation waiver just to play sports my senior year. I did make up for it in college, by graduating with honors.

 

[StanMarsh51]

The 306 hitter bonds? So you chose 6 stats that bonds led.....not average.....not hits......walks? HR? So is adam dunn the white sox best hitter?

I think 334 33HR's and 125RBI's make u the best hitter on the team that year....he batted 28 points higher.....you said hitter, NOT player

You're arguing semantics...when I say hitter, I mean offensive player (you can exclude baserunner if you want). Does Derek Jeter have even a tiny argument of being a better hitter than Prince last year because he had a higher average? Of course not.

Kent had more RBI because he had 100 more total at bats and a lot more at bats with RISP. Bonds had a 1.114 OPS with RISP, while Kent had a 1.084 OPS...the obvious difference, Kent had a lot more at bats with RISP (181 to 107).

 

[Cleaves2000]

Miggy led in HR, SLG, OPS, RBI, HITS, AVG, 2B, less K, total bases, and IBB

trout led runs, OBP by .006, had 1 more BB, 3B, SB, more K's

Thats funny.....i dont even see where its close. Look at the stats trout led.....and he barely led in some of them. But yet bonds is a better hitter that year because he led certain stats.

Keep trying.....you just keep looking more dumb....especially since miggy IS the 2012 MVP

 

[Cleaves2000]

The brother with the beard, that doesn't believe ghosts live in the cornfield, that's sitting in the stands when the little girl chokes on the hotdog, and Moonlight Graham has to give up baseball? I didn't like that guy.

Yup. He might of been in that show thirtysomething.....not sure never watched it...but he was the nerd with the glasses and floppy hair...think he played the violin.....oh yeah there was a chinese guy too.....remember the poker scene....what the fruck is a frush

 

[Cleaves2000]

You're arguing semantics...when I say hitter, I mean offensive player (you can exclude baserunner if you want). Does Derek Jeter have even a tiny argument of being a better hitter than Prince last year because he had a higher average? Of course not.

Kent had more RBI because he had 100 more total at bats and a lot more at bats with RISP. Bonds had a 1.114 OPS with RISP, while Kent had a 1.084 OPS...the obvious difference, Kent had a lot more at bats with RISP (181 to 107).

Just because you have at bats with RISP......you still have to get him home. I just dont think kent won the MVP for his defense. 2B is easier than 3B......thats where we stuck raturd

 

[Cleaves2000]

I see where kent had over 20 errors in a few seasons.....is that alot for 2B? How many did miggy have last year? Has kent ever won a gold glove?

 

[Cleaves2000]

13 errors at the hot corner last year for miggy.....hell inge used to have more than that throwing to 1st. But i know....bring up his range.....gotta have alot of range to play 3B.

 

[broncosmitty]

Miggy led in HR, SLG, OPS, RBI, HITS, AVG, 2B, less K, total bases, and IBB

trout led runs, OBP by .006, had 1 more BB, 3B, SB, more K's

Thats funny.....i dont even see where its close. Look at the stats trout led.....and he barely led in some of them. But yet bonds is a better hitter that year because he led certain stats.

Keep trying.....you just keep looking more dumb....especially since miggy IS the 2012 MVP

But in their bizarro world - alternate universe, none of the real stats, accolades or championships really count. Voters didn't have UZR or WAR to consider. And we all have seen how the game, the accolades and the championships have changed since King Bill of the Nerds came up with.... Wait, what's that? The Tigers are going to win the Central for the third straight year!?! With their third straight AL MVP and their second Cy Young Winner in three years!?! But let's talk about a bunch of silly stats that don't make a bit of difference to anyone other than stat nerds.

 

[StanMarsh51]

As I said last year -- if the MVP was handed out in July. Trout would have won it -- he was red hot for a couple months there. His last couple months though, when LAA was making a playoff push, he was average at best.

.

Really? In the final 2 months of the season, Trout's numbers:

49 runs
12 HR, 28 RBI
.283/.383/.500
18/20 steals

How is a .883 OPS the final 2 months along with 49 runs, 12 HR, and 18 steals "average at best"....sounds like an exaggeration on your part.

Not to mention, a .883 OPS while 32 of his 58 games those final 2 months were against the 4 best team ERAs in the AL (Oakland, Seattle, Rays, Tigers). A lot better than average, wouldn't you say?

 

[broncosmitty]

I see where kent had over 20 errors in a few seasons.....is that alot for 2B? How many did miggy have last year? Has kent ever won a gold glove?

If its not UZR, it won't matter to these yahoos. That way you can comment on a guys defense when you don't actually watch him play. Leaves more time for Zelda that way.

 

[broncosmitty]

Really? In the final 2 months of the season, Trout's numbers:

49 runs
12 HR, 28 RBI
.283/.383/.500
18/20 steals

How is a .883 OPS the final 2 months "average at best"....sounds like an exaggeration on your part.

Not to mention, a .883 OPS while 32 of his 58 games those final 2 months were against the 4 best team ERAs in the AL (Oakland, Seattle, Rays, Tigers). A lot better than average, wouldn't you say?

If you list enough stats, ya think Ol' Bud'll finally see the light, give you stat guys a prize? Or another one to Trout? (.283, didn't cut it compared to the real world MVP)

 

[StanMarsh51]

If you list enough stats, ya think Ol' Bud'll finally see the light, give you stat guys a prize? Or another one to Trout? (.283, didn't cut it compared to the real world MVP)

So, was he average at best, or better?

Or am I correct in that you don't call out Tiger fans anytime they make a ridiculous claim? Nothing biased there, smitty.

 

[ImSmartherThanYou]

You mean the more nerdy fan.....i love how the defense always comes up....why did omar vizquel never get mentioned in an MVP talk....he played great SS defense.....played great defense at a premium position? So the hot corner is easy to play? I didnt see miggy being a liability on defense....he wasnt great, but i cant remember ONE game where i said, dammit if only miggy didnt blow it in the field.....but i remember plenty of times he carried us on the offensive side.

I guess the al east must have nothing going on.....their fans are coming in here to tell us why trout should of won the MVP.....oh well he didnt......the people that know voted, and the right guy won......same will happen this year. Miggy back to back MVP's

Omar Vizquel? That's the best strawman argument you can come up with?

As for why I'm here, the board is slow today and this thread looked like one of the few that had activity.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Really? In the final 2 months of the season, Trout's numbers:

49 runs
12 HR, 28 RBI
.283/.383/.500
18/20 steals

How is a .883 OPS the final 2 months along with 49 runs, 12 HR, and 18 steals "average at best"....sounds like an exaggeration on your part.

Not to mention, a .883 OPS while 32 of his 58 games those final 2 months were against the 4 best team ERAs in the AL (Oakland, Seattle, Rays, Tigers). A lot better than average, wouldn't you say?

If you include the 3 meaningless games in October -- yes -- he managed to put up respectable numbers. He raised his average over the last two months by 18 points by going 7 for 13 in the last 3 games. In the 2 months prior -- he hit .269 with 64 strikeouts. He struck out at a clip of almost 30% of his ABs.

.269 is respectable -- it is FAR from MVP worthy. If the MVP voting was done at the end of July. Mike Trout would have won in a land slide. Problem is -- there was still 2 months of the season left and Trout didn't come close to putting up the numbers he did the 1st few months, while Cabrera put up other worldly numbers.

 

[ImSmartherThanYou]

Right.....if trout was so great at a "premium" position.....why did they move him to one of the easiest positions to play.....thats where you stick soriano and irks and 2E.......good point smitty......but im sure the angels needed bourjos bat

Because Bourjos is possibly the best defensive outfielder in baseball and you want your best defensive outfielder in center... Seems like a pretty elementary decision to me.

 

[broncosmitty]

So, was he average at best, or better?

Or am I correct in that you don't call out Tiger fans anytime they make a ridiculous claim? Nothing biased there, smitty.

Tigers fans are on this thread to talk Smack with Royals, WSox, Twins and Injuns fans. You're on here to be annoying and spit useless stats out. I don't give a fuck if you think I'm biased. This thread is about being biased, and brash, and the AL Central. What's your Warcraft handle? (Do you have handles on there?)