AD will not sign extension and has requested a trade.

[WiggyRuss]

Now you're being a hater and not objective

And they are not going to give up Tatum

i mean- if they are going to give up Tatum - its definitely a better offer- esp. since the Celtics can also offer a lotto pick in the upcoming draft.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Now you're being a hater and not objective

And they are not going to give up Tatum

A top 3 pick is better than anything the Lakers have, individually, to offer.

You could not trade anyone on the Lakers, besides LeBron, for a top 3 pick- not even close

 

[Gman]

That's wishful thinking.

Nah... wishful thinking is the idea that if the Pel's don't trade with the Lakers RIGHT NOW, they won't receive any other good offers.

That's crazy talk.

 

[rmilia1]

well --- what if Kuzma or Ingram end up being great? are they staying? They are MUCH closer to leaving than Knox who was just drafted.

typically - if a guy is worth a max and you offer it to him- he accepts it instead of taking the QO- basically no one ever takes the QO over a max- they could have Knox for years and years to come- and Bender as well if they would get him

Or- you could get Ingram- and offer him enough money to stay- but there is nothing that i have seen that makes me think Ingram is worthy of a huge deal that he might get offered in RFA.

I think that if i am a rebuilding franchise id like the two most high ceiling guys like Knox and Barrett that are the farthest from free agency, wouldnt you agree?

Well that's assuming I think Knox or Barrett have higher ceilings ( which I don't really ). I think Knox will be fortunate to end up as good as Kuzma already is and I already stated my opinion on Barrett. If the Pels think like you then I could see that making more sense but you're risking a generational player on a lot of what ifs. I'd rather know I'm getting 47-50 points , 15-18 rebounds and 11-13 assists every night ( like I know I'm getting from Ball, Ingram and Kuzma )

 

[WiggyRuss]

Well that's assuming I think Knox or Barrett have higher ceilings ( which I don't really ). I think Knox will be fortunate to end up as good as Kuzma already is and I already stated my opinion on Barrett. If the Pels think like you then I could see that making more sense but you're risking a generational player on a lot of what ifs. I'd rather know I'm getting 47-50 points , 15-18 rebounds and 11-13 assists every night ( like I know I'm getting from Ball, Ingram and Kuzma )

i mean, you can think whatever you want- you are certianly welcome to your opinion- but if you think for one second that the Lakers could trade Kuzma AND Ingram for the #2 overall pick in the upcoming draft you are crazy. The #2 overall pick is more valuable than both of those guys combined.

 

[shopson67]

esp. since the Celtics can also offer a lotto pick in the upcoming draft.

Maybe. Memphis pick is top 8 protected (currently 6). Kings' pick is currently at the end of the lottery, could make the playoffs. Clippers pick is currently 18 and is lottery protected (and only 1/2 game ahead of the Kings for the final playoff spot right now). Their best pick could be as good as #9 (Memphis, if they improve) or as low as a post lottery Kings or Clippers pick.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Nah... wishful thinking is the idea that if the Pel's don't trade with the Lakers RIGHT NOW, they won't receive any other good offers.

That's crazy talk.

exactly

there is no reason that the Lakers offer would be any worse today than it would be 6 months from now.

And as i said---

If the Celtics offered a deal of Tatum, the Sacramento pick, Rozier, and a couple other late first rounders,

or the Knicks offered their lotto pick this year, Knox, Ntilikina, and whatever other flotsam out there- is better than the Lakers offer.

A top 3 pick is more valuable than any 2 of the Lakers players they are putting in deals. I dont know how anyone could even begin to dispute that- esp. with Ingram just 1 year away from RFA, and all the baggage that comes with Lonzo Ball (plus his terrible FT shooting), plus the lack of an elite ceiling for Kuzma.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Maybe. Memphis pick is top 8 protected (currently 6). Kings' pick is currently at the end of the lottery, could make the playoffs. Clippers pick is currently 18 and is lottery protected (and only 1/2 game ahead of the Kings for the final playoff spot right now). Their best pick could be as good as #9 (Memphis, if they improve) or as low as a post lottery Kings or Clippers pick.

thats true--- if the Kings jump the Lakers and make the playoffs--- then the Lakers would have a lottery pick to trade and the Kings pick would not be a lotto pick.

as much as i hope that happens- i rather doubt it. lol

what do you think? You think the Kings are making the playoffs and the Lakers will miss the playoffs?

 

[shopson67]

i mean, you can think whatever you want- you are certianly welcome to your opinion- but if you think for one second that the Lakers could trade Kuzma AND Ingram for the #2 overall pick in the upcoming draft you are crazy. The #2 overall pick is more valuable than both of those guys combined.

...until it's made. That hype dwindles quickly when that #2 overall is now a defined player. Top 2 this year seem pretty safe with Zion and Ja (Barkley and DeAaron?)

 

[rmilia1]

i mean, you can think whatever you want- you are certianly welcome to your opinion- but if you think for one second that the Lakers could trade Kuzma AND Ingram for the #2 overall pick in the upcoming draft you are crazy. The #2 overall pick is more valuable than both of those guys combined.

Sure but value doesn't equate to reality . I mean Ingram was the number 2 pick too lol . So you kind of ruin your own argument ( and Ingram isn't anywhere close to the worst number 2 pick the past decade ).

 

[shopson67]

exactly

there is no reason that the Lakers offer would be any worse today than it would be 6 months from now.

Untrue. If the Knicks pick drops below 3rd, or the Celtics hold back Tatum, the Lakers could very easily reduce their offer as well. Davis could also directly say that he will ONLY sign with the Lakers in 2020. That would cause ALL offers to come crashing down.

 

[shopson67]

thats true--- if the Kings jump the Lakers and make the playoffs--- then the Lakers would have a lottery pick to trade and the Kings pick would not be a lotto pick.

as much as i hope that happens- i rather doubt it. lol

what do you think? You think the Kings are making the playoffs and the Lakers will miss the playoffs?

I certainly hope not. However, they could bump both the Clippers and Utah. Regardless, the pick will be a lottery pick in name only, as it will be very late with very poor probability of moving up.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Sure but value doesn't equate to reality . I mean Ingram was the number 2 pick too lol . So you kind of ruin your own argument ( and Ingram isn't anywhere close to the worst number 2 pick the past decade ).

wtf? how do i ruin my own argument?

I think its pretty clear that Ingram has not lived up to the billing of a #2- and not only that- he is an RFA next summer and will be in line for a big payday.

I mean- this is nothing earth shattering here-- a #2 pick, still years away from free restricted free agency, is worth a lot more than a dissapointing #2 pick, that is in his 3rd year and will soon be an RFA and due a huge pay raise.

 

[rmilia1]

exactly

there is no reason that the Lakers offer would be any worse today than it would be 6 months from now.

And as i said---

If the Celtics offered a deal of Tatum, the Sacramento pick, Rozier, and a couple other late first rounders,

or the Knicks offered their lotto pick this year, Knox, Ntilikina, and whatever other flotsam out there- is better than the Lakers offer.

A top 3 pick is more valuable than any 2 of the Lakers players they are putting in deals. I dont know how anyone could even begin to dispute that- esp. with Ingram just 1 year away from RFA, and all the baggage that comes with Lonzo Ball (plus his terrible FT shooting), plus the lack of an elite ceiling for Kuzma.

The Cs aren't giving up Tatum or that pick for a 1 year rental though

 

[WiggyRuss]

The Cs aren't giving up Tatum or that pick for a 1 year rental though

did danny ainge tell you this?

do you KNOW its a 1 year rental?

when the rubber hits the road- like with Paul George- being on a contender and taking the bird-rights much bigger contract is a pretty big thing to abandon.

 

[rmilia1]

wtf? how do i ruin my own argument?

I think its pretty clear that Ingram has not lived up to the billing of a #2- and not only that- he is an RFA next summer and will be in line for a big payday.

I mean- this is nothing earth shattering here-- a #2 pick, still years away from free restricted free agency, is worth a lot more than a dissapointing #2 pick, that is in his 3rd year and will soon be an RFA and due a huge pay raise.

You're saying the number 2 is more valuable than a 18/5 guy. I'm saying that value doesn't equate to reality because Ingram himself was a 2 and there are plenty of 2s in the last decade who aren't even that good ( and some 1s). You can assume the 2 will end up better than Ingram , Kuzma or Ball but the reality I'd it's about 50-50 and that's only to be as good as 1 of them not all 3 together

 

[WiggyRuss]

You're saying the number 2 is more valuable than a 18/5 guy. I'm saying that value doesn't equate to reality because Ingram himself was a 2 and there are plenty of 2s in the last decade who aren't even that good ( and some 1s). You can assume the 2 will end up better than Ingram , Kuzma or Ball but the reality I'd it's about 50-50 and that's only to be as good as 1 of them not all 3 together

yes...i am saying that- that the #2 overall pick is more valuable than an 18 and 5 guy- without a doubt 100%.

 

[WiggyRuss]

ddo you know how many guys average 18 and 5?

Jamal Murray, Gallo, Kuzma, Lou Willims, Russell, Randle, Conley, Harris, Vucevic, Holliday, are just a few---- and none of them- NONE of them, could be traded for the #2 overall pick

to look at raw statistics is a pretty meaningless exercise.

its the potential ceiling, its the cost certainty, its KNOWING you will have the guy for x years for a cheap contract--- there is so much more that goes into it that you are just ignoring.

 

[flyerhawk]

Now you're being a hater and not objective

And they are not going to give up Tatum

Hate to break the news to you but I hate the Celtics WAYYY more than the Lakers.

You just think the Lakers young players are much better than most people do.

 

[GNG]

I hate the Celtics WAYYY more than the Lakers.

I don't hate either team.