A Swing and a Miss...Again!

[RamsFan88]

This ain't pee wee league. He shouldn't need a shit load of coaching. If he was that good, he'd be at least giving Keenum a run for his money.

Not to mention I've never even heard of Tampa's coach and Mike Mularkey is a journeyman coach in the NFL.

When your transitioning from a spread offense that doesn't translate into the pros, yeah, you are going to need a lot of coaching, and someone who is going to help you elevate your play. I'm not buying what you're trying to sell.

A damn good QB coach and OC would go a long way for Goff's development.

 

[SJ76]

When your transitioning from a spread offense that doesn't translate into the pros, yeah, you are going to need a lot of coaching, and someone who is going to help you elevate your play. I'm not buying what you're trying to sell.

A damn good QB coach and OC would go a long way for Goff's development.

Nobody's trying to sell you anything. Mariota had four touchdowns in week one last year and came from a spread offense.

And nobody's buying your homer love for your hometown boy Goff. Sure it takes some longer than others, but He's way behind obviously.

Any Rams fan that can keep being patient with this organization with the amount of projects they've brought to the table is better than me I guess

 

[shopson67]

I don't think anyone would argue that we made a good deal to get Goff. But anyone trying to label him a bust or mediocre at this juncture is just a reactionary fool. (I'm looking at the new Rams beat writer on ESPN)

I'll argue that the Rams made a good deal. No team has ever moved up to #1 from that far down in the first round, and they did so cheaper than the Redskins did to move up and take RG3.

You could argue that they didn't give up much more than the Eagles did, but moved up twice as far (#15 to #1, instead of #8 to #2). Rams gave up '16 1st, '16 2nd x2, '16 3rd, '17 1st, '17 3rd. Eagles gave up '16 1st, '16 3rd, '16 4th, '17 1st, '18 2nd (and get back a '17 4th). Those 2016 Eagles' picks were earlier in the rounds, and the '17 and '18 picks likely will be as well.

 

[shopson67]

Nobody's trying to sell you anything. Mariota had four touchdowns in week one last year and came from a spread offense.

And nobody's buying your homer love for your hometown boy Goff. Sure it takes some longer than others, but He's way behind obviously.

Any Rams fan that can keep being patient with this organization with the amount of projects they've brought to the table is better than me I guess

No mention of the struggles the other rookie QB in that week 1 game had? 16-33, 210 yards, 2 TD, 2 INT (including a pick 6 on his first throw), 2 fumbles for Winston?

 

[SJ76]

Yeah, I would have never done the trade, never, but I too was never in position to make that decision. We hear the comparisons to MM, Winston and other organizations starting their young QB Week 1, but I don't think those teams, were in win now situations.

This Rams team lost games by 6 and 3 points and two more in OT last year. So if they caught a few breaks here and there in those 4 games, they could have easily gone 11-5.

Throw in a Rookie QB this year, and they take steps back. Just look at Tampa, they were fortunate to win 6 games last year. One was in OT, two more by 4, another by a TD. The same goes for Tennessee, they won 3 games last year, one was in OT, the other was by 3 and their first win came against Tampa!

No, these Rams had poor QB play for most of last year and were still a few breaks here and there from having a decent season.

When you have a Vet like Case and a backup like Sean on the team, you don't throw your Rookie QB in there to learn on the job. You give him the time he needs to be the QB you drafted and let your veteran QB wins some games early on.

Pretty sure this organization has been going back and forth between a "win now" philosophy and rebuilding mode for awhile.

Identity issue?

 

[SJ76]

No mention of the struggles the other rookie QB in that week 1 game had? 16-33, 210 yards, 2 TD, 2 INT (including a pick 6 on his first throw), 2 fumbles for Winston?

Jameis wasn't even in a spread O tho was he. Like throwing for 4000 yards last year? Those rookie struggles? That other rookie QB?

A rookie QB is gonna struggle at times. Mariota did it too. See last years threads for my comments on them.

We were discussing the learning curve of a spread O QB transitioning to the NFL. Pretty obvious it takes time but Goff is way behind.

 

[shopson67]

Jameis wasn't even in a spread O tho was he. Like throwing for 4000 yards last year? Those rookie struggles? That other rookie QB?

A rookie QB is gonna struggle at times. Mariota did it too. See last years threads for my comments on them.

We were discussing the learning curve of a spread O QB transitioning to the NFL. Pretty obvious it takes time but Goff is way behind.

It's a bit hard to determine how far behind the curve he is, as he didn't get many first team reps in the preseason. Mariota and Winston got the vast majority of the first team reps for their squads as they were anointed from day 1.

Also, the Titans finished 3-13 and the Bucs 6-10. That was improvement for those teams (both were 2-14 in 2014), but if the Rams finish with either record this year, that's a big step backwards. The Rams aren't in that same situation to throw away regular season games for trial-by-fire QB training.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

Yeah, I would have never done the trade, never, but I too was never in position to make that decision. We hear the comparisons to MM, Winston and other organizations starting their young QB Week 1, but I don't think those teams, were in win now situations.

This Rams team lost games by 6 and 3 points and two more in OT last year. So if they caught a few breaks here and there in those 4 games, they could have easily gone 11-5.

Throw in a Rookie QB this year, and they take steps back. Just look at Tampa, they were fortunate to win 6 games last year. One was in OT, two more by 4, another by a TD. The same goes for Tennessee, they won 3 games last year, one was in OT, the other was by 3 and their first win came against Tampa!

No, these Rams had poor QB play for most of last year and were still a few breaks here and there from having a decent season.

When you have a Vet like Case and a backup like Sean on the team, you don't throw your Rookie QB in there to learn on the job. You give him the time he needs to be the QB you drafted and let your veteran QB wins some games early on.

Yep...TB and TN were definitely in different situations. The Rams are clearly in the same boat as SEA pre-RW...strong DEF, just need stability at the QB spot to become playoff caliber.

On that note, I'm very curious to see how Winston and MM do in their soph years.

Back to the Rams...HCs that are on the hotseat typically do not like starting rookie QBs...it makes sense to go with the vet until it no longer makes sense.

 

[Vitamike]

Yep...TB and TN were definitely in different situations. The Rams are clearly in the same boat as SEA pre-RW...strong DEF, just need stability at the QB spot to become playoff caliber.

On that note, I'm very curious to see how Winston and MM do in their soph years.

Back to the Rams...HCs that are on the hotseat typically do not like starting rookie QBs...it makes sense to go with the vet until it no longer makes sense.

Well said Steeler!

 

[RamsFan88]

Nobody's trying to sell you anything. Mariota had four touchdowns in week one last year and came from a spread offense.

And nobody's buying your homer love for your hometown boy Goff. Sure it takes some longer than others, but He's way behind obviously.

Any Rams fan that can keep being patient with this organization with the amount of projects they've brought to the table is better than me I guess

No, you're trying to sell people on the idea that great players don't need coaching and that's just complete and utter non-sense. Ask any great player why they got better over their career and they'll tell you it's because of coaches or veterans that helped them along in their development.

That's fine if you're not buying into Goff. I really don't care. I'm just not going to sit around and crap my pants all day because he's not starting or if he has a bad game. Talk to me in 3 or 4 years about him...granted he doesn't bust out like JaMarcus Russell before then.

Any rookie that they bring in, we should be patient with, especially QB's. Being patient with Fisher and Co., on the other hand, is a different story. I'm extremely worried about the prospects of him getting a contract extension, regardless of what happens this season.

 

[SJ76]

No, you're trying to sell people on the idea that great players don't need coaching and that's just complete and utter non-sense. Ask any great player why they got better over their career and they'll tell you it's because of coaches or veterans that helped them along in their development.

That's fine if you're not buying into Goff. I really don't care. I'm just not going to sit around and crap my pants all day because he's not starting or if he has a bad game. Talk to me in 3 or 4 years about him...granted he doesn't bust out like JaMarcus Russell before then.

Any rookie that they bring in, we should be patient with, especially QB's. Being patient with Fisher and Co., on the other hand, is a different story. I'm extremely worried about the prospects of him getting a contract extension, regardless of what happens this season.

I'll buy veterans pushing a rookie more than coaches coaching up a Pro. Great players don't need a lot of coaching. Jordan had Dean Smith in college, but you think Doug Collins did anything for him as a Pro? All he needed as a Pro was a coach to bring cohesion to a team. Had nothing to do with his talent.

Once a player reaches the Pro level they shouldn't need a lot of coaching. That's why they are called Professionals.


#2 -- you expect us to be patient with this organization that reaches on "projects" ?? Sorry man I'm tired of it. Pick an identity and go with it. If you are a smash mouth football team with a good RB and defense then you shouldn't need a fucking project QB and a project LT -- while giving up multiples draft picks.

 

[SJ76]

It's a bit hard to determine how far behind the curve he is, as he didn't get many first team reps in the preseason. Mariota and Winston got the vast majority of the first team reps for their squads as they were anointed from day 1.

Also, the Titans finished 3-13 and the Bucs 6-10. That was improvement for those teams (both were 2-14 in 2014), but if the Rams finish with either record this year, that's a big step backwards. The Rams aren't in that same situation to throw away regular season games for trial-by-fire QB training.

I don't want Goff to start. Just think he's not that good and never really was good. Certainly wasn't all that to give up 2 years of picks.

The QB class was weak.

Inactive though?? Really?

#1 pick in the draft man.. It's fucking stupid

 

[shopson67]

I don't want Goff to start. Just think he's not that good and never really was good. Certainly wasn't all that to give up 2 years of picks.

The QB class was weak.

Inactive though?? Really?

#1 pick in the draft man.. It's fucking stupid

The inactive part doesn't bother me at all. If he's not ready to start, he's not ready to jump in if there's an emergency either. Let him learn for at least a few weeks and revisit his status.

The Rams protected Mannion in a similar manner last year by not throwing him into the mix when both Keenum and Foles failed to set the world on fire.

 

[SJ76]

Has the #1 pick of the draft ever been inactive in week 1?


Let's all sing koom-by-yah and wait for another project to hopefully be average

 

[shopson67]

Has the #1 pick of the draft ever been inactive in week 1?


Let's all sing koom-by-yah and wait for another project to hopefully be average

How often has a .500ish team picked a QB #1 overall? It's a foreign situation.

 

[SJ76]

The inactive part doesn't bother me at all. If he's not ready to start, he's not ready to jump in if there's an emergency either. Let him learn for at least a few weeks and revisit his status.

The Rams protected Mannion in a similar manner last year by not throwing him into the mix when both Keenum and Foles failed to set the world on fire.

So I guess he's on the 2 year plan since nows he's #2?



These QBs are sitting because they can't beat out Keenum. Plain and simple

 

[shopson67]

Did you watch the first Florida State episode the other night? I only caught the end of it, but liked Jameis lighting the team up at halftime.

 

[LongtimeRamsFan42]

Of course the biggest question is: Will our D still have the talent to be a dominant force by the time Goff matures to be the QB we all hope he will...

 

[SJ76]

Did you watch the first Florida State episode the other night? I only caught the end of it, but liked Jameis lighting the team up at halftime.

I saw his speech online but didn't see the episode. I need to get showtime.

Watch out for Tampa this year.

I'm pretty stoked on my Noles this year. Finally got another good QB

 

[RamsFan88]

I'll buy veterans pushing a rookie more than coaches coaching up a Pro. Great players don't need a lot of coaching. Jordan had Dean Smith in college, but you think Doug Collins did anything for him as a Pro? All he needed as a Pro was a coach to bring cohesion to a team. Had nothing to do with his talent.

Once a player reaches the Pro level they shouldn't need a lot of coaching. That's why they are called Professionals.


#2 -- you expect us to be patient with this organization that reaches on "projects" ?? Sorry man I'm tired of it. Pick an identity and go with it. If you are a smash mouth football team with a good RB and defense then you shouldn't need a fucking project QB and a project LT -- while giving up multiples draft picks.

So Peyton Manning and Brett Favre knew everything they needed to know about how to play the QB position right when they became pros and never needed a coach to help them along in their development? If you believe that, I have some swamp land to sell if you're interested.

As far as rookies, yes, and it doesn't matter who is in charge of Rams- whether it's Snead & Fisher now, or whoever replaces them. I'm sick of taking "projects", but when we get talented rookies (Donald, Gurley, Ogletree) we should be patient, allow them to make mistakes and grow before trying to label them something they aren't. Go ahead and write off Goff if it makes you feel better, and you may very well be right about him once it is all said and done, but I'm not going to do that.