.400?

[obxyankeefan]

Like I said, I am not supporting the vote. But when player A plays for the 1st place team that finished 17 games ahead of the 2nd place team and is also a well-established star on the darling team for the country, I can see why he will receive a few additional votes over the kid on the "losing" team.

Miggy beat out Trout a few years ago for similar arguments. The Tigers were a playoff team while the Angels were not. Both had monster, historic seasons that were certainly MVP-worthy. The tie-breaker was that one of the players made a difference while the other did not.

When one of the Boston writers leaves Williams competely off the ballot, I got to go with the award was won on popularty that year.

Miggy deserved it over Trout.

 

[DHoey]

????

Explain please, because that makes absolutely zero sense.

I mean that both are worthy stats and neither is above the other.

If you get a walk with a runner on third, OPS goes up, average stays the same but the run doesn't score. You get a walk with the bases loaded, average stays the same, OPS goes up and a run scores. You get a single with runners on 2nd and 3rd; 2 runs score, average and OPS goes up. You get a single with a runner on 1st; no runs score, OPS goes up and average goes up.

Both are good stats, both have their flaws.

 

[ElTexan]

Next year the Indians' team batting average will be over .400.

 

[calsnowskier]

When one of the Boston writers leaves Williams competely off the ballot, I got to go with the award was won on popularty that year.

Miggy deserved it over Trout.

A Boston writer left him off the ballot??? Wow, there must have been a story there...

I agree about Miggy. He had done something that had not been done in, what, 40 years? He was also the main player on a playoff team. Take him off the tigers and they do not make the playoffs. Take Trout off the Angels and the Angels still do not make the playoffs.

 

[calsnowskier]

I mean that both are worthy stats and neither is above the other.

If you get a walk with a runner on third, OPS goes up, average stays the same but the run doesn't score. You get a walk with the bases loaded, average stays the same, OPS goes up and a run scores. You get a single with runners on 2nd and 3rd; 2 runs score, average and OPS goes up. You get a single with a runner on 1st; no runs score, OPS goes up and average goes up.

Both are good stats, both have their flaws.

That is judging only on a binary scale, though.

True, no single stat is perfect. But to claim they are both equally imperfect is, IMHO, indefensible.

That is like saying a grenade detonated 5 feet from the target was just as effective as a grenade detonated 5 states away.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

I mean that both are worthy stats and neither is above the other.

If you get a walk with a runner on third, OPS goes up, average stays the same but the run doesn't score. You get a walk with the bases loaded, average stays the same, OPS goes up and a run scores. You get a single with runners on 2nd and 3rd; 2 runs score, average and OPS goes up. You get a single with a runner on 1st; no runs score, OPS goes up and average goes up.

Both are good stats, both have their flaws.

Are you talking about OPS or OBP? Seems to me you might be talking about OBP, but if OBP goes up, obviously OPS will go up with it.

What I don't understand is why you're providing different baserunner situations when we're talking about an batter's performance. The batter has virtually zero ability to influence who gets on base ahead of him, which is why looking at RBI's is significantly more flawed than either BA, OBP, or OPS.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

That is like saying a grenade detonated 5 feet from the target was just as effective as a grenade detonated 5 states away.

I don't get that analogy.

 

[calsnowskier]

I don't get that analogy.

Neither are perfect, but one is CLEARLY more effective than the other.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

True, no single stat is perfect. But to claim they are both equally imperfect is, IMHO, indefensible.

I agree with this 100%. If you were to tell every baseball GM that they could have one offensive stat to evaluate hitters by, BA or OPS, I would be shocked if a single one picked BA.

 

[obxyankeefan]

A Boston writer left him off the ballot??? Wow, there must have been a story there...

I agree about Miggy. He had done something that had not been done in, what, 40 years? He was also the main player on a playoff team. Take him off the tigers and they do not make the playoffs. Take Trout off the Angels and the Angels still do not make the playoffs.

I had the wrong year and the only article I could find on it calls it false, but if you would like to read it here:

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/spo...cause-a-boston-voter-left-him-off-the-ba.html

 

[calsnowskier]

I had the wrong year and the only article I could find on it calls it false, but if you would like to read it here:

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/spo...cause-a-boston-voter-left-him-off-the-ba.html

I have not read the whole article yet, but it did bring up that '41 was the year of the 57-game hitting streak....

 

[obxyankeefan]

I have not read the whole article yet, but it did bring up that '41 was the year of the 57-game hitting streak....

Yes but '47 was the year that supposedly Williams was left off a Boston writers ballot. giving DiMaggio the MVP.

 

[obxyankeefan]

That is judging only on a binary scale, though.

True, no single stat is perfect. But to claim they are both equally imperfect is, IMHO, indefensible.

That is like saying a grenade detonated 5 feet from the target was just as effective as a grenade detonated 5 states away.

All stats have their plus sides and all have their negatives. Some just have more positives then others.

 

[calsnowskier]

I had the wrong year and the only article I could find on it calls it false, but if you would like to read it here:

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/spo...cause-a-boston-voter-left-him-off-the-ba.html

Hey, Vern Stevens got a shout-out in that article!!!

 

[williewilliejuan]

If they go back to excluding all of the black and brown people from playing, maybe. Otherwise, not much chance.

 

[Wazmankg]

Sure, Miggy is going to do it this year. He's hitting .500 since he came off the DL and is up 12 points to .364.



But seriously, no... never. Facing a fresh arm the last AB or 2 just about every game, the increased use of shifts and such will never allow it to happen.

 

[BrockForBroglio]

Keep an eye on the ever improving player that continues to put fear in the hearts of every pitcher.....Peter Michael Kozma