Series Thread: 2nd Round: Cleveland Cavs vs Toronto Raptors

[TJL]

He's not playing anything like the '01 Lakers and there is no one in the league anywhere close to prime Shaq. There isn't even anyone who could pretend to be prime Shaq. Lebron is also not at the height of his athletic prime. He's still the best player in the game, but he's not as athletic as he was in Miami.

Where he is better is that he is a better facilitator than he was then, has a mid-range jumper now and is better at posting up. In short, like MJ and Kobe at the same age, he's not as athletic anymore, but he is smarter.

The problem he would have would be trying to post up with Shaq in the paint. That would leave him with his mid-range jumper and trying to facilitate. He'd still be able to drive to the basket some, but not like he did in his younger days and he would still be trying to do that against Shaq.

There also aren't any teams in the league who can give him as many different defensive looks as those Lakers other than maybe the Warriors. I don't think even the current Spurs can give him as many different looks as the '01 Lakers.

I'd also take the '01 Lakes

Only LeBron team I'd take over '01 lakes is the '13 Heat

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Carroll, Tucker and Patterson a combined 1/12. If the Cavs are gonna blitz DeRozan- those 3 are gonna have to convert some of the time--- that rate is just not ognna cut it.

Now you are prob starting to understand why Heat fans were hoping to get to see what we could have done in the playoffs.

 

[Heatles84]

I'd also take the '01 Lakes

Only LeBron team I'd take over '01 lakes is the '13 Heat

I'd take the '13 Heat and '14 Spurs.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

see- i agree if you mean you dont think LeBron is at the height of his athletic prime- but i think LeBron right now today is the best version of LeBron. Never has been tougher to beat 4 times out of 7 in his career.

James is playing great, but as far as the never been tougher to beat part, I disagree.
I'm not saying this in a negative way, but his competition to making the Finals the last 2+ seasons has never been easier.

 

[Heatles84]

Now you are prob starting to understand why Heat fans were hoping to get to see what we could have done in the playoffs.

I'm fairly confident that Miami would've put up much more of a fight than Toronto. Which at this juncture isn't saying much.

 

[TJL]

I'd take the '13 Heat and '14 Spurs.

'14 Spurs :'(

 

[Heatles84]

'14 Spurs :'(

Fuck those guys. Game 1 in their series for the Rockets was what we experienced for 3 straight games. Bastards.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

I'm fairly confident that Miami would've put up much more of a fight than Toronto. Which at this juncture isn't saying much.

Without a doubt in my mind.
We might not have won, but we'd have seen tough fought games vs ones that are over by the first TV timeout.

 

[mick7-1961]

Check out my wad .........




Not my package, you perverts !!!!


My wad of cash !!!!!!!!!!!

 

[knowyourenemy]

Toronto is getting embarrassed. Then again, they got destroyed in games 1 & 2 last season and then put together solid games in games 3 & 4.

 

[WiggyRuss]

I like how the Cavs role players have stepped up--- and it seems like a different guy just about every night.

Frye had a great game tonight, going 5/7 from 3 and a total of 18 points.

and Shumpert had a really nice game. Ill admit- i was worried about Shumpert- he had a poor 2nd half, but he has been playing really well lately.

In game 4 Deron Williams had a really nice game.

In game 3 Korver came alive and hit 4 of 5 three's to supplement that come back

these guys just arent gonna get the opportunities very often- especially multiple guys on the same night- to have big stats-- but all of them are playing good, smart, fundamental basketball and playing their roles. They left the shooters tonight and frye lit em up. Shumpert looked athletic as hell and like he was healthy and motivated for once...who knew? --

JR Smith of all people- supposedly kept telling Lue that he doesnt care how many shots he gets- hes just concerned with defense and being the main defender on DeRozan...lol, who would have guessed something like that?

It all comes back to LeBron too- the way he makes everyone better, and the way he brings together a locker room. Its just unbelievable. Raptors came into this series after pushing the Cavs to 6 games last year- had Carroll healthy (who wasnt last year), ahd Valuniunas healthy (who sat out most of the series with injury last year), and had added Serge Ibaka to shore up their rebounding and putting a guy who can stretch the D a little bit with his jumper------ but thus far- they just havent shown they are in the same class as the Cavs. Maybe that will chance once the series shifts back to Toronto- it certainly did last year for the first 2 games....but the Cavs were playing their game and doing some really good things and i hope they take this seriously and finish it out early/God willing that they win in the first place.

 

[wildturkey]

This series has nothing to do with Cavs, playoff Lebron, a flipped switch, or anything else. This is entirely about the Raptors, specifically their style of play. Like I said in their 1st round playoff thread, they have more talent this year but they're heavy iso dependent (aka ridiculously easy to stop in the playoffs). They play like a team from 15 years ago. They're capable of beating anyone on a given night, but not over the course of the playoffs. Milwaukee lost because they just didn't have the experience yet. The Raptors were never a threat to anyone else and definitely not the Cavs. The Cavs don't even have to make any adjustments because they've already outschemed the Raptors before the ball is tipped.

 

[Shanemansj13]

You do understand that the Cavs had a lot to do with how bad the Raptors looked...right?

Well I was waiting for Toronto to make a run but for the first time in a long time the Csvs held a big lead for basically the whole game and didnt give it up. They got a long ways to go defensively IMO but they are improving. I'm sure Bron agrees they need to get better too

 

[Shanemansj13]

I like how the Cavs role players have stepped up--- and it seems like a different guy just about every night.

Frye had a great game tonight, going 5/7 from 3 and a total of 18 points.

and Shumpert had a really nice game. Ill admit- i was worried about Shumpert- he had a poor 2nd half, but he has been playing really well lately.

In game 4 Deron Williams had a really nice game.

In game 3 Korver came alive and hit 4 of 5 three's to supplement that come back

these guys just arent gonna get the opportunities very often- especially multiple guys on the same night- to have big stats-- but all of them are playing good, smart, fundamental basketball and playing their roles. They left the shooters tonight and frye lit em up. Shumpert looked athletic as hell and like he was healthy and motivated for once...who knew? --

JR Smith of all people- supposedly kept telling Lue that he doesnt care how many shots he gets- hes just concerned with defense and being the main defender on DeRozan...lol, who would have guessed something like that?

It all comes back to LeBron too- the way he makes everyone better, and the way he brings together a locker room. Its just unbelievable. Raptors came into this series after pushing the Cavs to 6 games last year- had Carroll healthy (who wasnt last year), ahd Valuniunas healthy (who sat out most of the series with injury last year), and had added Serge Ibaka to shore up their rebounding and putting a guy who can stretch the D a little bit with his jumper------ but thus far- they just havent shown they are in the same class as the Cavs. Maybe that will chance once the series shifts back to Toronto- it certainly did last year for the first 2 games....but the Cavs were playing their game and doing some really good things and i hope they take this seriously and finish it out early/God willing that they win in the first place.

What is so dnagerous about the Cavs is there are a ton of guys from that second unit that can go off and all they really need is one or two of them if the Big 3 are playing great. Deron, Korver, Frye, and Shumpert are all dangerous shooters. Got it from Shump and Frye tonight. And they have all been pretty consistent of late, the good thing about that second unit is they are so good at moving the balll and finding the open. Overall, this is the best I have seen the ball movement in a long time, that is elite, the defense intensity is increasing and I really think we havent seen even close to the best of it. They are saving it for the best but I liking the effort more now.

 

[WiggyRuss]

What is so dnagerous about the Cavs is there are a ton of guys from that second unit that can go off and all they really need is one or two of them if the Big 3 are playing great. Deron, Korver, Frye, and Shumpert are all dangerous shooters. Got it from Shump and Frye tonight. And they have all been pretty consistent of late, the good thing about that second unit is they are so good at moving the balll and finding the open. Overall, this is the best I have seen the ball movement in a long time, that is elite, the defense intensity is increasing and I really think we havent seen even close to the best of it. They are saving it for the best but I liking the effort more now.

very true.

I mean- i have definitely been impressed with Shumpert especially lately. He looks like a different player once the REAL NBA season started. He has had some crazy athletic plays, has played some solid D against George and DeRozan, and is actually making his jumpers.

Frye is just so money from the 3 pt line. He is one of the best big men at hitting 3's in the game- you leave him open at your own risk....but its like- so what do you do then? single lebron and kyrie? leave Korver open? leave Jr open? or Jefferson or Shumpert?---- all guys that can shoot the 3?---

its funny this playoffs is breaking down so extremly similar to last--- in that last year Detroit played them tough in a sweep- and then the Cavs beat the crap out of the Raptors the first 2 games in both seasons.


What i think is OVERWHELMINGLY obvious is that the people that based their opinion on the Cavs being vulnerable in the East put WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too much emphasis on regular season games that the Cavs just did not put a priority on. As i tried to say numerous times --- the goal wasnt to win 60 games. The goal was to get to the playoffs healthy with everyone on the same page. With all the acquisitions and injuries they suffered this year- that meant a little bit more of a bumpy process down the stretch.

 

[WiggyRuss]

And Ty Lue and his assistants deserve some major credit for scheming defenses against George and DeRozan that really have forced both of those guys to play below their capabilities--- ESPECIALLY considering those type of guys are supposed to UP their games once the playoffs start- not see them decline.

Toronto--- has a very solid roster:

PG- Lowry, Joseph
SG- DeRozan, Powell
SF- Carrol, Tucker
PF- Ibaka, Patterson
C- Jonas,

2 all stars- a pretty damn solid front court- and a bench of Jospeh, Powell, Tucker, Patterson is about as good in the East as you will get outside of Boston and probably Cleveland.

I think they are definitely the 2nd most talented roster in the East from top to bottom and no one is better equipped roster wise to deal with the Cavs in a series, however the Cavs adjustments and schemes have been head over heals better than the Raptors....Lue and his coaching staff deserve some credit for that.

 

[WiggyRuss]

i mean- think about this--- in the last couple+ weeks- since the regular season ended- i heard on the radio the Cavs have practiced more in that time frame- then they did the last 3 months of the season.

They had a ton of guys in and out the lineup- new guys coming in and out/resting guys....it should not surprise anyone that they look a lot better now that they have their full compliment of players- and that everyone is on the same page and has had some practice time together....i mean- its common sense- of course guys that have barely played together and have barely ever practiced together arent gonna look great on defense-- ESP. when guys are in and out of the lineup for rest, injuries, etc.

They only have half the wins they need to get out of the East- but its playing out pretty much how i suspected- but as the East is improved this year- i didnt think they would be 6-0 at this point. --- but thats the greatness of LeBron.

Also helps when Kyrie Irving goes for a postseason career-high in asssists- and then breaks that career-high the VERY next game. lol.

There were ACTUALLY people who thought the Cavs would be better off trading irving and that he wasnt a good fit with LeBron like @tlance ---imagine the freaking DISASTER the Cavs would be in today if they gave up on a guy who was 22 years old and had ZERO playoff experience when LeBron came here....they would truly be fucked. Instead?-- the guy hits one of the biggest shots in NBA history- and keeps improving- while he hasnt even hit the top of his prime yet. they would be screwed so hard right now if they dealt Irving. He has turned out not only to be a GREAT fit with LeBron, but also the RIGHT fit.

 

[DJ Fieri]

no way they lose

They did.

 

[gordontrue]

When people mention the amount of playoff games MJ played in comparison to Lebron they forget to mention the fact MJ was avery high volume shooter, he attempted 5 more FGA's a game. That's a big difference over almost 200 games

You are correct sir.

LeBron has played in 26 more playoff games than Jordan... yet he has attempted 256 less shots in the playoffs than Jordan. Its likely that when LeBron passes him (210 points away), he will have done it in less shots.

 

[WiggyRuss]

You are correct sir.

LeBron has played in 26 more playoff games than Jordan... yet he has attempted 256 less shots in the playoffs than Jordan. Its likely that when LeBron passes him (210 points away), he will have done it in less shots.

When LeBron is getting to the line like that and hitting 3's- the Cavs arent gonna lose. Nothing Toronto did really worked.