21-22 Season - Jekyll or Hyde ?

[lasgop8]

Would anyone even take JVR? I mean...there aren't many other GMs that do the things a Flyers GM would do.

We would have to find the dumbest GM in the history of hockey in order to dump that POS on them.

Id suggest adding Frost into a deal that would get the anchor off of our books but was over ruled by the word potential.

 

[lasgop8]

Purdue what's going on your team dropped to 9th. Hope they got all their losses out before the tourney.

 

[Chris p Bacon]

Would anyone even take JVR? I mean...there aren't many other GMs that do the things a Flyers GM would do.

We would have to find the dumbest GM in the history of hockey in order to dump that POS on them.

Id suggest adding Frost into a deal that would get the anchor off of our books but was over ruled by the word potential.

We would probably have to retain some of his salary too.

 

[lasgop8]

We would probably have to retain some of his salary too.

2 million to get rid of 7 million I'm good with that.

 

[Chris p Bacon]

2 million to get rid of 7 million I'm good with that.

I agree, any room to make a better deal elsewhere I'm good with.

 

[purdue81]

Purdue what's going on your team dropped to 9th. Hope they got all their losses out before the tourney.

Lost 2 in a row and barely beat Indiana. This is a classic and predictable March swoon. Headcoach notably sucks when March arrives. I can say it is the coach as they’ve had serious talent multiple times in the last 20 years that just seems to fall apart come tournament time. They have talent for a final 4 team this year - size, speed, depth. I knew when Michigan blew them out that it was going to be another disappointing year.

 

[awaz]

I agree, any room to make a better deal elsewhere I'm good with.

I still think it's a lot to give up for 1 year of 5M in cap room (after you retain 2M). Obviously it depends on what you do with that 5M, maybe Fletcher turns that in to something useful. But the Flyers don't have enough young talent to be shipping it out just to clear cap space.

I could see Fletcher doing it, because he seems to think they can rebound and be back in the thick of it next year. But IMO, shedding assets to clear 5M in cap space for 2022-23 is kind of a waste. They probably aren't going to win a cup next year either, so why waste the assets? Just let his contract expire next summer. Bench him all year if you think he's poisoning the well so to speak.

Frost may be a total bust, but why take that chance just to clear cap space in what most likely will be a rebuilding-type year?

 

[awaz]

Trade talk: Florida’s interest growing in Flyers’ Claude Giroux; situation ‘weighing’ on captain

Another day, another serious Claude Giroux suitor. The list is getting longer. The Florida Panthers’ interest in the Philadelphia Flyers’ captain is growing, according to a well-placed NHL source. Giroux, 34, is expected to waive his no-movement clause and be dealt by the March 21 trade...

phillyhockeynow.com

Listening to Friedman's 32 thoughts podcast. They were speculating that Owen Tippet would be the main piece from FLA for Giroux. Plus maybe a 2023 1st (they don't have a 2022 1st). Speculated that Colorado may be in the discussions, but Friedman thinks they may go elsewhere. He, not very confidently, said Florida would be the favorite to get Giroux.

Also said he didn't think the Ristolainen 6x6ish was accurate. He speculated the offer was between 4-4.75M cap hit. Does think they're negotiating though. He seems to think Ristolainen re-signing is more likely

 

[lasgop8]

I still think it's a lot to give up for 1 year of 5M in cap room (after you retain 2M). Obviously it depends on what you do with that 5M, maybe Fletcher turns that in to something useful. But the Flyers don't have enough young talent to be shipping it out just to clear cap space.

I could see Fletcher doing it, because he seems to think they can rebound and be back in the thick of it next year. But IMO, shedding assets to clear 5M in cap space for 2022-23 is kind of a waste. They probably aren't going to win a cup next year either, so why waste the assets? Just let his contract expire next summer. Bench him all year if you think he's poisoning the well so to speak.

Frost may be a total bust, but why take that chance just to clear cap space in what most likely will be a rebuilding-type year?

Ok ill agree with this because you are right we aren't winning the cup any time soon.

 

[lasgop8]

Listening to Friedman's 32 thoughts podcast. They were speculating that Owen Tippet would be the main piece from FLA for Giroux. Plus maybe a 2023 1st (they don't have a 2022 1st). Speculated that Colorado may be in the discussions, but Friedman thinks they may go elsewhere. He, not very confidently, said Florida would be the favorite to get Giroux.

Also said he didn't think the Ristolainen 6x6ish was accurate. He speculated the offer was between 4-4.75M cap hit. Does think they're negotiating though. He seems to think Ristolainen re-signing is more likely

If you're an agent and your client got paid 5.4 million this year and you accept anything less than 5.8-6 million per season you are a terrible agent.

Please god let us trade him and not sign him.

 

[awaz]

If you're an agent and your client got paid 5.4 million this year and you accept anything less than 5.8-6 million per season you are a terrible agent.

Please god let us trade him and not sign him.

I mean, offering somewhere around 4.5M kind of fits the, "lets see if we can low ball him and maybe he likes the fit enough to accept it", idea.

I'd still rather move him, but if they could get him in that range, it wouldn't be the end of the world.

Like you though, I'm skeptical that he signs for less than 5.4M without at least getting to free agency this summer. I think they're going to be hard pressed to find a team willing to pay him that or more, but I'd be very surprised if they agree to less in March, when there's no competition to sign him. And if he's not willing to sign ahead of the deadline, you have to move him.

 

[lasgop8]

I still think it's a lot to give up for 1 year of 5M in cap room (after you retain 2M). Obviously it depends on what you do with that 5M, maybe Fletcher turns that in to something useful. But the Flyers don't have enough young talent to be shipping it out just to clear cap space.

I could see Fletcher doing it, because he seems to think they can rebound and be back in the thick of it next year. But IMO, shedding assets to clear 5M in cap space for 2022-23 is kind of a waste. They probably aren't going to win a cup next year either, so why waste the assets? Just let his contract expire next summer. Bench him all year if you think he's poisoning the well so to speak.

Frost may be a total bust, but why take that chance just to clear cap space in what most likely will be a rebuilding-type year?

What will we do if Frost turns down our qualifying offer and becomes a free agent?

 

[awaz]

What will we do if Frost turns down our qualifying offer and becomes a free agent?

Well the QO isn't the end all be all. The Flyers could offer as much as they wanted to. QO is just a starting point to retain his rights. As long as the Flyers extend the offer, they keep his rights and any other team would have to offer sheet Frost to sign him.

And Frost really doesn't have any negotiating power. 14 points in 52 games, no other teams are going to break the bank on an offer sheet because they won't want to give up assets too. And even if they did, the Flyers would have the option to match or take the assets.

So I don't think we need to worry to much about Frost being an RFA. The Flyers will either keep him on a low salary, or get assets via offer sheet if someone offers him something excessive that they don't want to match.

 

[lasgop8]

Well the QO isn't the end all be all. The Flyers could offer as much as they wanted to. QO is just a starting point to retain his rights. As long as the Flyers extend the offer, they keep his rights and any other team would have to offer sheet Frost to sign him.

And Frost really doesn't have any negotiating power. 14 points in 52 games, no other teams are going to break the bank on an offer sheet because they won't want to give up assets too. And even if they did, the Flyers would have the option to match or take the assets.

So I don't think we need to worry to much about Frost being an RFA. The Flyers will either keep him on a low salary, or get assets via offer sheet if someone offers him something excessive that they don't want to match.

It all depends on what we will offer him to play 3rd line center. If i were him id turn down any offer lower than 2.5 million per season.

 

[awaz]

It all depends on what we will offer him to play 3rd line center. If i were him id turn down any offer lower than 2.5 million per season.

He can decline anything less than 2.5M if he wants, but as long as the Flyers send the QO over it takes an offer sheet for him to sign with another team.

1. Teams don't do offer sheets very often.
2. For another team to sign him to a 2.5M deal they'll have to part with a 3rd round pick probably (2021 rules crossed to a 2nd rounder at 4M, probably won't come down that much).

I don't think there are many teams that would give a 2.5M deal and a 3rd round pick for a guy with 14 NHL points. And even if they do, maybe the Flyers take the 3rd rounder over Frost at that cap hit. But, right or wrong, NHL GM's don't stab each other in the back over the Morgan Frosts of the world. Weber, Aho, and Kotkaniemi are the only offer sheets I can think of and those are (or were) bigger fish.

I expect Frost will get a 1 or 2 year deal around 1.5-2M. Flyers will probably push for low money and 2 years when he'll still be an RFA, Frost will probably push for 1 year in hopes that he can establish himself as an NHL-er so his next deal will make more money. Flyers probably cave a little on the $$ to get the 2nd year in case he does establish himself, then year 2 is a bargain.

 

[Chris p Bacon]

I still think it's a lot to give up for 1 year of 5M in cap room (after you retain 2M). Obviously it depends on what you do with that 5M, maybe Fletcher turns that in to something useful. But the Flyers don't have enough young talent to be shipping it out just to clear cap space.

I could see Fletcher doing it, because he seems to think they can rebound and be back in the thick of it next year. But IMO, shedding assets to clear 5M in cap space for 2022-23 is kind of a waste. They probably aren't going to win a cup next year either, so why waste the assets? Just let his contract expire next summer. Bench him all year if you think he's poisoning the well so to speak.

Frost may be a total bust, but why take that chance just to clear cap space in what most likely will be a rebuilding-type year?

How about Giroux, JVR, and Frost for Newhook, Compher and a 1st rd pick next year, plus we retain 2 million of JVRs contract?

 

[Chris p Bacon]

It all depends on what we will offer him to play 3rd line center. If i were him id turn down any offer lower than 2.5 million per season.

I wouldn't sign him to more than 3 years, and I def wouldn't offer more than 2.5 tops. I gotta see a full season to see what he's truly about.

 

[awaz]

How about Giroux, JVR, and Frost for Newhook, Compher and a 1st rd pick next year, plus we retain 2 million of JVRs contract?

I'm all for adding pieces to Giroux to return a higher end piece. I would do that deal. Colorado would have some work to do money wise, but I would do that deal from a Flyers perspective.

 

[lasgop8]

How about Giroux, JVR, and Frost for Newhook, Compher and a 1st rd pick next year, plus we retain 2 million of JVRs contract?

I love this deal from our side!!!! Lets do this!!!!

 

[lasgop8]

He can decline anything less than 2.5M if he wants, but as long as the Flyers send the QO over it takes an offer sheet for him to sign with another team.

1. Teams don't do offer sheets very often.
2. For another team to sign him to a 2.5M deal they'll have to part with a 3rd round pick probably (2021 rules crossed to a 2nd rounder at 4M, probably won't come down that much).

I don't think there are many teams that would give a 2.5M deal and a 3rd round pick for a guy with 14 NHL points. And even if they do, maybe the Flyers take the 3rd rounder over Frost at that cap hit. But, right or wrong, NHL GM's don't stab each other in the back over the Morgan Frosts of the world. Weber, Aho, and Kotkaniemi are the only offer sheets I can think of and those are (or were) bigger fish.

I expect Frost will get a 1 or 2 year deal around 1.5-2M. Flyers will probably push for low money and 2 years when he'll still be an RFA, Frost will probably push for 1 year in hopes that he can establish himself as an NHL-er so his next deal will make more money. Flyers probably cave a little on the $$ to get the 2nd year in case he does establish himself, then year 2 is a bargain.

Ask Montreal how it feels about losing Kotkaniemi to Carolina last summer. Offers are out there and if we offer 1.5 if i were Frost i would reject it in hopes of another team to match. I mean why wouldn't another team match that offer with all of his "potential"?