2022-23 Flyers: How about just less suck?

[lasgop8]

Im reading a lot about Prov being traded stories. Today was article in the Athletic. In another article two teams were mentioned Vegas and Minn.

 

[lasgop8]

Its really embarrassing that another expansion team is much better than us in 2 years. How are we this mediocre/ bad for so long?

 

[awaz]

I feel that with Torts as coach and given the identity of this franchise that is becoming more and more clear, you don't want any one player being paid north of $6-7 million per season unless they are without question a top line superstar or elite, top pairing defenseman. So, obviously you move JvR, Hayes and give serious thought to Provy/Couturier, depending on what the return is. Also, no more signing any free agents for $7+ million unless it is a Gaudreau or someone of equal or greater caliber.

If someone like Konecny keeps producing at this rate, he will be worth $7 million easily on his next deal and we'll be happy to pay him too.

Bottom line: We would rather develop a youngster at $1-3 million per or pay some home-grown talent that has earned a new paycheck than overpay a veteran in the offseason that isn't deserving of that kind of money. It's a true team effort and no one player should be making significantly more than anyone else unless it is clear that he's an absolute offensive stud (that can still hold his own defensively too of course) or a perennial Vezina candidate (like Vasilevskiy).

Agree 100%. With the way the cap is and how dumb GMs are in free agency, you have to build like this. Very few guys get to free agency that can truly be a difference maker. Because they're drafted, signed to a bridge deal, then signed to a huge deal. So before anyone even has a chance to sign one of those 'build around him' guys, the team that drafted has him signed until he's 32. Just with that, the talent you're picking from in free agency is watered down. And there's lots of teams seeking that watered down talent, and boom you have overpaid mid-tier guys.

There's no other way to build a team than through the draft. It's why tanking exists. It's why people sell every spare part they have at the deadline for whatever draft picks they can get for them. Hextall knew this and tried to do this. He just didn't truly hit on enough of his picks (or the Flyers didn't develop them right). The plan was right, the execution was poor.

 

[lasgop8]

Agree 100%. With the way the cap is and how dumb GMs are in free agency, you have to build like this. Very few guys get to free agency that can truly be a difference maker. Because they're drafted, signed to a bridge deal, then signed to a huge deal. So before anyone even has a chance to sign one of those 'build around him' guys, the team that drafted has him signed until he's 32. Just with that, the talent you're picking from in free agency is watered down. And there's lots of teams seeking that watered down talent, and boom you have overpaid mid-tier guys.

There's no other way to build a team than through the draft. It's why tanking exists. It's why people sell every spare part they have at the deadline for whatever draft picks they can get for them. Hextall knew this and tried to do this. He just didn't truly hit on enough of his picks (or the Flyers didn't develop them right). The plan was right, the execution was poor.

The draft is not the only way see Rangers as direct proof.

 

[awaz]

The draft is not the only way see Rangers as direct proof.

Proof of what? 10th best points percentage in the league? 0 cups? Missing the playoffs 3 out of the last 5 years?

Even if there was something to celebrate for the Rangers their best player (probably the best goalie in the league) was a Rangers draft pick. And they drafted half of their top 10 in scoring (Kreider, Chytil, Miller, Lafreniere, and Kakko).

Their 2 best skaters are Panarin and Fox, and yes they came from the outside. Panarin refused to sign anywhere but NYR. Fox refused to sign with with Calgary after being a 3rd round pick and played in college until he could sign somewhere else. Then refused to sign for Carolina after they acquired his rights, then finally signed in a New York. So, again, even if there was something to celebrate in NYR, this isn't a reliably repeatable process. It's sitting around hoping something falls in to your lap.

The one piece that could maybe fit in to a 'build a contender through trades and free agency' is Zibanejad. They downright stole him from Ottawa and it's one of the more lopsided trades in recent NHL history. Excellent job by their GM on that trade. But that also took a horrible mistake from the other GM to pull off. I'll grant you, finding dumb GMs might be a repeatable process, but you're gunna need a few Zibanejad-level trades to pull it off.

And before you get in to "who would you rather be", of course I'd rather be in the Rangers position. I don't think there's a team in the league that I wouldn't trade the Flyers situation for. Fletcher took Hextall's failure and doubled down on some of those guys and then tried to add through free agency and trades and put them even further in the hole. Fletcher had the opportunity to cut bait and start again, but he tried to go free agency / trading and it made it worse.

 

[Chris p Bacon]

Do you think that will take JVR for McKinnon straight up?

Man that would be a worse raping than the Sharks did to the Bruins for Thornton, lol.

 

[lasgop8]

Proof of what? 10th best points percentage in the league? 0 cups? Missing the playoffs 3 out of the last 5 years?

Even if there was something to celebrate for the Rangers their best player (probably the best goalie in the league) was a Rangers draft pick. And they drafted half of their top 10 in scoring (Kreider, Chytil, Miller, Lafreniere, and Kakko).

Their 2 best skaters are Panarin and Fox, and yes they came from the outside. Panarin refused to sign anywhere but NYR. Fox refused to sign with with Calgary after being a 3rd round pick and played in college until he could sign somewhere else. Then refused to sign for Carolina after they acquired his rights, then finally signed in a New York. So, again, even if there was something to celebrate in NYR, this isn't a reliably repeatable process. It's sitting around hoping something falls in to your lap.

The one piece that could maybe fit in to a 'build a contender through trades and free agency' is Zibanejad. They downright stole him from Ottawa and it's one of the more lopsided trades in recent NHL history. Excellent job by their GM on that trade. But that also took a horrible mistake from the other GM to pull off. I'll grant you, finding dumb GMs might be a repeatable process, but you're gunna need a few Zibanejad-level trades to pull it off.

And before you get in to "who would you rather be", of course I'd rather be in the Rangers position. I don't think there's a team in the league that I wouldn't trade the Flyers situation for. Fletcher took Hextall's failure and doubled down on some of those guys and then tried to add through free agency and trades and put them even further in the hole. Fletcher had the opportunity to cut bait and start again, but he tried to go free agency / trading and it made it worse.

Zibanajad trade
Panarin Free agent
Trouba free agent
Fox trade
Lindgren trade
Trouchek free agent

I dont need a long winded post to prove my point but hey you type away.

 

[awaz]

Zibanajad trade
Panarin Free agent
Trouba free agent
Fox trade
Lindgren trade
Trouchek free agent

I dont need a long winded post to prove my point but hey you type away.

Then I’ll keep it short. What have the Rangers won?

 

[lasgop8]

Then I’ll keep it short. What have the Rangers won?

The point is you put those 6 players on any team and they are instantly a Stanley cup threat just like the Rangers are.

So there is more than one way to build a cup contender other than just the draft.

 

[awaz]

The point is you put those 6 players on any team and they are instantly a Stanley cup threat just like the Rangers are.

So there is more than one way to build a cup contender other than just the draft.

They’ve won nothing. Just like the Flyers have won nothing.

But sure. Keep trying it. 50 years is probably not enough evidence.

 

[lasgop8]

They’ve won nothing. Just like the Flyers have won nothing.

But sure. Keep trying it. 50 years is probably not enough evidence.

Maybe you should read your own posts instead of just typing so long "There's no other way to build a team than through the draft. "

I would think that the Rangers have built themselves a pretty solid Stanley cup contender with 6 players whom they didn't get through the draft.

I would think being a huge threat to win the cup is proof that a team is built but hey if you think a team has to have won a cup to prove that a team is built i can only point out that i wish our team was a cup contender with players we traded for and signed.

 

[lasgop8]

86 Joel Farabee - 49 Noah Cates - 11 Travis Konecny
25 James van Riemsdyk - 48 Morgan Frost - 74 Owen Tippett
13 Kevin Hayes - 21 Scott Laughton - 57 Wade Allison
44 Nicolas Deslauriers - 38 Patrick Brown - 17 Zack MacEwen

9 Ivan Provorov - 45 Cam York
6 Travis Sanheim - 77 Tony DeAngelo
24 Nick Seeler - 55 Rasmus Ristolainen

79 Carter Hart
[33 Samuel Ersson]

 

[purdue81]

Its really embarrassing that another expansion team is much better than us in 2 years. How are we this mediocre/ bad for so long?

With Hakstol. He’ll win a cup b4 the Flyers. Oh the humanity

 

[Maverick426h]

The Washington Capitals become the next team to realize that we are not the same Flyers that we were earlier this season when they beat us 2-3 and 1-4. Tonight, we took care of business 5-3. Although it got nervous late and we nearly blew a 4-1 lead, I attribute most of that to an egregious giveaway by Provy in our own zone that directly led to the second goal by the Caps.

Travis Konecny remains white hot with a hat trick in this one, scoring at even strength, shorthanded and then an empty-net power play goal to seal it. He is arguably the most productive offensive player in the entire Nhl right now with a 10 game point streak that includes 12 goals, 8 assists and 20 points. This dude missed 6 games due to injury and he's STILL on pace for 86 points in 70 games.

I don't want to jump to conclusions, but Owen Tippett is perhaps turning into a star before our very eyes. He sniped our 3rd goal tonight at a critical moment early in the final stanza, added an assist, 6 shots and drew 3 penalties all by his lonesome.

Another solid performance by Laughton, winning faceoffs, being an absolute pain in the ass to play against and scoring 3 points too, including the beautiful assist to Konecny while laying on the ice for the empty-net clincher.

The entire 4th line of MacEwen, Deslauriers and Brown continues to cycle the puck in the offensive zone and bang bodies. They can occasionally be a liability defensively, but that doesn't fully diminish the good they are doing out there.

For the second game in a row, we silence a streaking team, as the Caps had won 7 straight road games in dominant fashion.

 

[Maverick426h]

Konecny ties his career high in goals with 24 (for the 4th time), but in only 36 games. His previous best was 66 games.

Although not pretty statistically, I would say that Hart bounced back tonight and slammed the door shut when we needed it throughout the 2nd period and late in the 3rd.

Our Flyers now sit 17-18-7 with 41 points in 42 games, having won 6 of the last 7 games.

Last season's squad had 34 points in 42 games. They only won 12 more games the rest of the season.

 

[lasgop8]

I just love watching this team play. They move their feet for 60 minutes every night and its so refreshing to see. The commitment to hustling back on defense from our forwards is something we haven't seen in Philly in 10 years.

 

[lasgop8]

TK pulls into the top 10 in goals scored
We lead the league in points by players under 23
Our goal scoring is way up since December ,i thought i saw it was 4th best in the league
One top tier goalie and a second one being groomed to be a top starter

 

[lasgop8]

Bobby Brink 2 games 2 goals at Lehigh

 

[lasgop8]

Cates' cleaning up a culture-building strength to Flyers' present and future

Noah Cates has looked like the Flyers’ best defensive forward, but his humility is just as impressive. By Jordan Hall

www.nbcsports.com

I love his game and now that he's coming on offensively he is very impressive.

 

[lasgop8]

Midseason NHL Draft rankings: Connor Bedard headlines elite talent at the top

Connor Bedard will undoubtedly go first-overall in the 2023 NHL Draft, but how will the rest of the first round shake out?

www.yahoo.com