2021 NBA Offseason

[WiggyRuss]

the lotto odds change up was pretty drastic

the top team went from having a 25% chance at the top pick- and a 100% chance of drafting in the top 3--- to a 14% chance of getting the top pick, and a 40% chance of even having a top 3 pick.--- and a 48% chance of picking 5th!!! with the best odds!

really- the schedules are so much more even now-

not only that- but the league actually took ACTION to make the Sixers try and go forward and made it pretty clear that it was unacceptable what they were doing.

 

[trojanfan12]

Seems like some Cavs fans think the Cavs are being criticized, when that isn't the case.

The Cavs have handled their rebuild different than the Sixers. I don't think anyone is claiming one or the other is better. It's way too early for that, at least as far as the Cavs are concerned.

If the Sixers had drafted the guys that the Cavs did, Sexton would likely have already been shipped out and they'd be shopping Okoro and/or Garland because they appeared to be looking to move on from guys as soon as they realized they weren't that "special player" that you build around.

The Cavs have chosen to develop those players and try to add to them to bring everyone up together. It looks like basically the same approach they took when Lebron left the first time. Get a young roster, with a young head coach and let everyone develop together.

 

[The Q]

the lotto odds change up was pretty drastic

the top team went from having a 25% chance at the top pick- and a 100% chance of drafting in the top 3--- to a 14% chance of getting the top pick, and a 40% chance of even having a top 3 pick.--- and a 48% chance of picking 5th!!! with the best odds!

really- the schedules are so much more even now-

not only that- but the league actually took ACTION to make the Sixers try and go forward and made it pretty clear that it was unacceptable what they were doing.

guaranteed top 4, not top 3

 

[Shanemansj13]

Seems like some Cavs fans think the Cavs are being criticized, when that isn't the case.

The Cavs have handled their rebuild different than the Sixers. I don't think anyone is claiming one or the other is better. It's way too early for that, at least as far as the Cavs are concerned.

If the Sixers had drafted the guys that the Cavs did, Sexton would likely have already been shipped out and they'd be shopping Okoro and/or Garland because they appeared to be looking to move on from guys as soon as they realized they weren't that "special player" that you build around.

The Cavs have chosen to develop those players and try to add to them to bring everyone up together. It looks like basically the same approach they took when Lebron left the first time. Get a young roster, with a young coach head coach and let everyone develop together.

Agree, the Sixers did do it different could have worked for others but not so much for them to this point. I just don't agree with the Cavs starting off with more assets (not something you said). Not one top 3 in 3 years isn't ideal and the lottery change has some to do with that. Honestly, I've missed about 15 pages of this conversation so who really cares lol.

 

[trojanfan12]

Agree, the Sixers did do it different could have worked for others but not so much for them to this point. I just don't agree with the Cavs starting off with more assets (not something you said). Not one top 3 in 3 years isn't ideal and the lottery change has some to do with that. Honestly, I've missed about 15 pages of this conversation so who really cares lol.

Personally speaking, I like the Cavs way better than what the Sixers did.

Before Lebron joined the Lakers, I was really enjoying watching all those kids and Luke Walton all figuring it out together.

Don't get me wrong, I'm liking being contenders again...a lot. lol

But, if Lebron hadn't gone to the Lakers, I would have been very happy to watch that team continue to develop.

 

[tlance]

had Embiid been healthy they wouldnt have landed him.

Very true.

The Cavs would have.

You think they still would have traded him for Love?

Would have been interesting.

 

[tlance]

uhhhh what?

the Cavs had the 3rd pick........

Yes I know.

He was the 4th lottery guy they drafted.

Sexton, Garland, Okoro, Mobley

 

[tlance]

1st-no team can tank for 5-6 years and expect to have a legitimate fan base and any kind of culture.

2nd- I really think that you are not realizing your own stupidity----

I dont know how many times I have to repeat- that when the Sixers were tanking the lotto odds were drastically different.

for example- the lotto odds used to be for the first pick:

Worst record- 25%- 100% could pick no worse than 3rd under any circumstance
2nd worst- 19.9% - 100% chance the pick could be no worse than 4th
3rd worst- 13.8% - 100% chance the pick could be no worse than 5th
4th worst- 13.7%
5th worst- 7.6%
6th worst- 7.5%

now they are:
worst record- 14% at first pick----- only 40% chance of picking in the top 3 ----47.9% chance of picking 5th
2nd worst record- 14% ------- only 40% chance of picking in the top 3 -47.8 chance of picking 5th or 6th
3rd worst record 14% ------ only 40% chance of being in the top 3------- 47.8% chance of picking 5th 6th or 7th
4th worst record- 12.% ----- 37% chance of picking in the top 3-------51.8 % chance of picking 5th, 6th, 7th, or 8th
5th worst record- 10.5% etc.
6th worst record- 9.0%

i hope this is eye opening.

Yes. I understand all of that.

And I still think pressing forward with a mediocre cast is stupid for a small market team.

Unless fans are okay with an eternity of mediocrity.

I would much prefer to have extended periods of bad followed by a decent run of contention.

 

[DJ Fieri]

Seems like some Cavs fans think the Cavs are being criticized, when that isn't the case.

The Cavs have handled their rebuild different than the Sixers. I don't think anyone is claiming one or the other is better. It's way too early for that, at least as far as the Cavs are concerned.

If the Sixers had drafted the guys that the Cavs did, Sexton would likely have already been shipped out and they'd be shopping Okoro and/or Garland because they appeared to be looking to move on from guys as soon as they realized they weren't that "special player" that you build around.

The Cavs have chosen to develop those players and try to add to them to bring everyone up together. It looks like basically the same approach they took when Lebron left the first time. Get a young roster, with a young head coach and let everyone develop together.

#butthurtintheirDNA

 

[WiggyRuss]

Yes. I understand all of that.

And I still think pressing forward with a mediocre cast is stupid for a small market team.

Unless fans are okay with an eternity of mediocrity.

I would much prefer to have extended periods of bad followed by a decent run of contention.

if you call finishing with the 4th worst record, 2nd worst record, 2nd worst record as mediocre- i can only assume its because you are a Wizards fan. lol.

and- ironically enough- the year they finished with the 4th worst record they got their highest pick. ughhhh. just one of Morant or Zion or Doncic- Trae Young, Ball, Edwards,--- maybe even Barrett-in those 2 drafts where they won 19 games in back to back seasons- would have been nice.

 

[tlance]

if you call finishing with the 4th worst record, 2nd worst record, 2nd worst record as mediocre- i can only assume its because you are a Wizards fan. lol.

and- ironically enough- the year they finished with the 4th worst record they got their highest pick. ughhhh. just one of Morant or Zion or Doncic- Trae Young, Ball, Edwards,--- maybe even Barrett-in those 2 drafts where they won 19 games in back to back seasons- would have been nice.

No, what I am talking about is topping out as a 4 or 5 seed.

Which has been the last 40 years for the Wizards.

And almost always because they never take the time to have a few years in a row of being really bad.

You know, like the Cavs have done.

 

[dtgold88]

I mean some are acting like they lucked into top picks year after year. If you look at the drafts the last 4 years, they were very top heavy the majority of the time and before this year the Cavs didn't have one top 3 pick.

Sexton #8
Garland #5
Okoro #5

If they land a top 3 pick in that 2018 draft they might have Trae or Luka. So the Cavs have been trying their best to make the best out of their picks and that's all they can do when don't pick top 3 every year. Now in the past is a different story they had their fair share of luck so this evens itself out, some may say.

Right...Kind of proves with lottery luck we can succeed. Without it (and with bad luck) we'll be set back. Our FO is not smarter if we pick 3rd and take Luka or 1-2 and take Zion or Morant. Now, had we passed on SGA and taken, say, Knox? That's something to rip them for.

 

[dtgold88]

Seems like some Cavs fans think the Cavs are being criticized, when that isn't the case.

The Cavs have handled their rebuild different than the Sixers. I don't think anyone is claiming one or the other is better. It's way too early for that, at least as far as the Cavs are concerned.

If the Sixers had drafted the guys that the Cavs did, Sexton would likely have already been shipped out and they'd be shopping Okoro and/or Garland because they appeared to be looking to move on from guys as soon as they realized they weren't that "special player" that you build around.

The Cavs have chosen to develop those players and try to add to them to bring everyone up together. It looks like basically the same approach they took when Lebron left the first time. Get a young roster, with a young head coach and let everyone develop together.

I mean I cannot speak for the other Cavs' fans but get the Cavs are not really being criticized. But in this case you are assuming too much that is far from factual. You don't know Philly trades Sexton or even that the Cavs would not have if offered what they wanted. But Philly was not trading MCW or Jrue just to trade them.

If Philly would have, in fact, dealt Garland or Sexton just to deal them that just makes them dumb.

 

[The Q]

Very true.

The Cavs would have.

You think they still would have traded him for Love?

Would have been interesting.

I wouldn’t have.

even with bron.

use the picks they used on mozgov and moving waiters to sweeten the pot

wouldn’t have moved a healthy embiid

 

[dtgold88]

Very true.

The Cavs would have.

You think they still would have traded him for Love?

Would have been interesting.

I've definitely thought about that. Maybe comes down to what Lebron preferred in order to come back?

 

[tlance]

I've definitely thought about that. Maybe comes down to what Lebron preferred in order to come back?

I think that is right.

And Wiggins was actually very highly regarded in his own right.

I believe they would have dealt him because LeBron would have preferred Love over any rookie.

 

[dtgold88]

Yes. I understand all of that.

And I still think pressing forward with a mediocre cast is stupid for a small market team.

Unless fans are okay with an eternity of mediocrity.

I would much prefer to have extended periods of bad followed by a decent run of contention.

agree.....we had an extended period of bad which I'm sure was not unexpected with 2 short, young guards and another 20-year-old starter (then another 22-year-old added).

 

[dtgold88]

I think that is right.

And Wiggins was actually very highly regarded in his own right.

I believe they would have dealt him because LeBron would have preferred Love over any rookie.

And to be fair, at that time, a seasoned stretch 4 all star would have fit better with Lebron.

 

[tlance]

And to be fair, at that time, a seasoned stretch 4 all star would have fit better with Lebron.

Yes he would

 

[bksballer89]

Cant believe this convo is still happening