2020-21 The Carter Hart Era PT2(The raising of the cup)

[Tox 1]

Mo more over the hill experiments Mally. Please. No more. Lol

 

[Tox 1]

I'm out of words...

 

[Chris p Bacon]

How bad were the refs/linesman last night?

Two specific plays that come to mind are the Morin hit and worse than calling that was the missed shot over the glass by Boston from their own zone while he was literally looking right at it.

First one was iffy, Morin is just to big lol all his hits are gonna look worse than they are. I'm sure Carlo getting concussed by Wilson may have had an impact on that call.

 

[Chris p Bacon]

The closest we have come to a top 10 PP is we finished 11th in 2015-16 season. We finished 23rd two years ago 14th last season. I cant say this enough its not the coaches. Its the players.

14 should be trending up not backpeddling into oblivion!

 

[Chris p Bacon]

I've been trying to hang on but last night was it. 4th string goalie and they can't score more than two while giving up a shorty....naw it's done. My only smile is seeing Morin prove those fuckers wrong and actually showing that he cares that kid is giving 200%.

Sometimes desire conquers ability.

 

[Chris p Bacon]

I'm out of words...

That's okay, we've filled about 40 pages for you.

 

[lasgop8]

14 should be trending up not backpeddling into oblivion!

We never backpeddle opr move ahead we just

14 should be trending up not backpeddling into oblivion!

We never backpeddle or move ahead we just stay in the middle.

 

[awaz]

Marc Staal anyone? I was always a big fan of his years ago. How old is he now and how much does he have left?

I wouldn't use future assets to help the 2021 Flyers. If I were Chuck I'd either be selling or making bigger deals with guys that will help the team next year. But I expect the latter are more offseason type moves than at the deadline here.

 

[lasgop8]

I wouldn't use future assets to help the 2021 Flyers. If I were Chuck I'd either be selling or making bigger deals with guys that will help the team next year. But I expect the latter are more offseason type moves than at the deadline here.

I think we need to be cleaning house at the deadline and over the summer so we can start getting a team to compete for a cup in 4-7 years .

 

[awaz]

I think we need to be cleaning house at the deadline and over the summer so we can start getting a team to compete for a cup in 4-7 years .

Here's how I would categorize the Flyers roster and the top prospects:

Not interested unless they're moved as part of a package for top 10 @ their position type guys
Couturier
Provorov
Hart

Potential impact players that could be moved for other potential impact players (change the 'mix' type deal, have to give to get)
Farabee
Konecny
Sanheim

Would be selling low and return wouldn't be great (Low risk, high reward to keep, rather than move for scraps)
Lindblom
Patrick
Myers

Probably not going to get equal value (or have to retain salary which would reduce total value)
Giroux
Voracek
Hayes
JvR

Sell as rentals if you can
Laughton
Raffl
Gustafsson

Limited value at this point, could be replaced by "winners"
NAK
Hagg
Elliot
Ghost
Morin

Could be used in deals to bring in top half of the lineup NHL talent
Frost
Lacynski
Zamula
Allison
Brink
1st round pick

Prospects I would keep unless getting a true impact, top line/pair player
York
Foerster

 

[awaz]

Also, unless they add a d-man before the expansion draft (7/21) I think there's a good chance Seattle would take JvR, Voracek, or Ghost. Which hopefully frees up cap space to try for someone like Dougie Hamilton.

Expansion Draft (7/21)
Entry Draft (7/24)
Free Agency (7/28)

Giroux
Hayes
TK
Couturier
Lindblom
Patrick
NAK
Sanheim
Myers
Provorov
Hart

If that's your protection crew, Seattle is essentially picking from Voracek, JvR, Raffl (UFA), Laughton (UFA), Braun, Hagg, Ghost, Elliot (UFA).

*Farabee and important prospects are exempt

 

[lasgop8]

Here's how I would categorize the Flyers roster and the top prospects:

Not interested unless they're moved as part of a package for top 10 @ their position type guys
Couturier
Provorov
Hart

Potential impact players that could be moved for other potential impact players (change the 'mix' type deal, have to give to get)
Farabee
Konecny
Sanheim

Would be selling low and return wouldn't be great (Low risk, high reward to keep, rather than move for scraps)
Lindblom
Patrick
Myers

Probably not going to get equal value (or have to retain salary which would reduce total value)
Giroux
Voracek
Hayes
JvR

Sell as rentals if you can
Laughton
Raffl
Gustafsson

Limited value at this point, could be replaced by "winners"
NAK
Hagg
Elliot
Ghost
Morin

Could be used in deals to bring in top half of the lineup NHL talent
Frost
Lacynski
Zamula
Allison
Brink
1st round pick

Prospects I would keep unless getting a true impact, top line/pair player
York
Foerster

I would add Farabee

Here's how I would categorize the Flyers roster and the top prospects:

Not interested unless they're moved as part of a package for top 10 @ their position type guys
Couturier
Provorov
Hart

Potential impact players that could be moved for other potential impact players (change the 'mix' type deal, have to give to get)
Farabee
Konecny
Sanheim

Would be selling low and return wouldn't be great (Low risk, high reward to keep, rather than move for scraps)
Lindblom
Patrick
Myers

Probably not going to get equal value (or have to retain salary which would reduce total value)
Giroux
Voracek
Hayes
JvR

Sell as rentals if you can
Laughton
Raffl
Gustafsson

Limited value at this point, could be replaced by "winners"
NAK
Hagg
Elliot
Ghost
Morin

Could be used in deals to bring in top half of the lineup NHL talent
Frost
Lacynski
Zamula
Allison
Brink
1st round pick

Prospects I would keep unless getting a true impact, top line/pair player
York
Foerster

GEE Voracek Hayes and JVR are taking up 37.7% of our cap and that cant happen even if we trade low and get less than we trade for. Its time to move on. If we are going to keep one keep Hayes. We need top 30 offensive players if we are going to eat up that much of the cap.

 

[lasgop8]

Also, unless they add a d-man before the expansion draft (7/21) I think there's a good chance Seattle would take JvR, Voracek, or Ghost. Which hopefully frees up cap space to try for someone like Dougie Hamilton.

Expansion Draft (7/21)
Entry Draft (7/24)
Free Agency (7/28)

Giroux
Hayes
TK
Couturier
Lindblom
Patrick
NAK
Sanheim
Myers
Provorov
Hart

If that's your protection crew, Seattle is essentially picking from Voracek, JvR, Raffl (UFA), Laughton (UFA), Braun, Hagg, Ghost, Elliot (UFA).

*Farabee and important prospects are exempt

I would 100% protect Laughton and sign him before i protected Lindblom.

 

[awaz]

I would 100% protect Laughton and sign him before i protected Lindblom.

Player for player, I'm not opposed to that at all. I really like Laughton. I consider the two almost a wash (assuming Lindblom bounces back to what he was once he gets back to full strength).

But, I think the expansion draft is your best opportunity to move Voracek or JvR without retaining salary. If you sign/protect Laughton and expose Lindblom, they snatch Lindblom up instead in a heart beat. Or, you give up assets to convince them to take Voracek/JvR. From a pure asset management standpoint, protecting Lindblom and leaving Laughton unsigned (or selling him at the deadline) is the best way to move Voracek or JvR.

The protection group I proposed basically puts Seattle in the position of "take an overpaid guy, or take a UFA". If Lindblom is exposed they can take a top 9 forward on a reasonable deal for the next 2 seasons. For the record, that's why I'd protect NAK too, even though at this point he's more of a liability on the ice because of his penalty taking.

Of course, if Seattle takes a pending UFA over JvR/Voracek/Ghost/Braun, then it's a backfire. But I take that gamble. I can't see Seattle taking a guy they might lose in a week rather than guys that can play in the top half of your lineup, they're just expensive. Particularly JvR who's only signed for 2 more seasons after this. He won't get in the way of their long term plans and can produce for them in the short term.

 

[awaz]

Also, according to CapFriendly, Morin is exempt unless he plays 16 more games this season. Flyers have 18 games left. So I'd scratch him for at least 3 games to keep him exempt and remove him has an outlet for Seattle. Even though he's UFA this summer too. Why give them that temptation if you don't have to?

 

[lasgop8]

I dont care how we do it we need to break this team up and start over. We are a middle of the road team and continue to be if we dont do it.

If your satisfied with either losing in the playoffs early or missing the playoffs thats fine. I want to actually have a real chance at a cup and be one of the top teams in the league and i dont see that happening anytime soon without breaking this team up and cleaning house

 

[awaz]

I dont care how we do it we need to break this team up and start over. We are a middle of the road team and continue to be if we dont do it.

If your satisfied with either losing in the playoffs early or missing the playoffs thats fine. I want to actually have a real chance at a cup and be one of the top teams in the league and i dont see that happening anytime soon without breaking this team up and cleaning house

I don't agree that they need to start over. But I do agree they need a significant change. I think if you can get Seattle to take JvR/Voracek/Ghost and you sell Laughton/Raffl, you create some cap space to change the make up of the team.

They've got 62.7M tagged for next season. Patrick, Sanheim, and Hart are RFA's, but with the seasons they've had I don't think you're spending more than 8M on those 3 guys. So you've got 11.5M with 12 fwds, 6 dmen, and 1 goalie. If Seattle takes JvR/Voracek, you've got 18.5-19.7M. You could spend 8M on Dougie Hamilton if you wanted to (Pietrangelo got 8.8M for reference). Even if Seattle takes Ghost, you still have 16M and could spend 8M on Hamilton.

I also think you have space to put a blockbuster out there. Could you trade one of TK/Farabee/Sanheim plus a high pick or prospect for a guy like Filip Forsberg? Or what does it take to get Matt Tkachuk out of Calgary who is in a similar "need to change things" situation? Or do you to try sign a reclamation project in Laine who I can't imagine is looking to re-sign in Columbus with the way his career is tanking there. I think they have options to re-shape the forward core without getting rid of everyone.

I think the Flyers have enough talent on the roster, and enough pieces in the "futures" toolbox to re-shape the NHL squad and get it to contention.

 

[Chris p Bacon]

I don't agree that they need to start over. But I do agree they need a significant change. I think if you can get Seattle to take JvR/Voracek/Ghost and you sell Laughton/Raffl, you create some cap space to change the make up of the team.

They've got 62.7M tagged for next season. Patrick, Sanheim, and Hart are RFA's, but with the seasons they've had I don't think you're spending more than 8M on those 3 guys. So you've got 11.5M with 12 fwds, 6 dmen, and 1 goalie. If Seattle takes JvR/Voracek, you've got 18.5-19.7M. You could spend 8M on Dougie Hamilton if you wanted to (Pietrangelo got 8.8M for reference). Even if Seattle takes Ghost, you still have 16M and could spend 8M on Hamilton.

I also think you have space to put a blockbuster out there. Could you trade one of TK/Farabee/Sanheim plus a high pick or prospect for a guy like Filip Forsberg? Or what does it take to get Matt Tkachuk out of Calgary who is in a similar "need to change things" situation? Or do you to try sign a reclamation project in Laine who I can't imagine is looking to re-sign in Columbus with the way his career is tanking there. I think they have options to re-shape the forward core without getting rid of everyone.

I think the Flyers have enough talent on the roster, and enough pieces in the "futures" toolbox to re-shape the NHL squad and get it to contention.

More than anything, if they don't do something on the defensive big, then it's gonna be the same next season. Gotta start there IMO.

 

[lasgop8]

I don't agree that they need to start over. But I do agree they need a significant change. I think if you can get Seattle to take JvR/Voracek/Ghost and you sell Laughton/Raffl, you create some cap space to change the make up of the team.

They've got 62.7M tagged for next season. Patrick, Sanheim, and Hart are RFA's, but with the seasons they've had I don't think you're spending more than 8M on those 3 guys. So you've got 11.5M with 12 fwds, 6 dmen, and 1 goalie. If Seattle takes JvR/Voracek, you've got 18.5-19.7M. You could spend 8M on Dougie Hamilton if you wanted to (Pietrangelo got 8.8M for reference). Even if Seattle takes Ghost, you still have 16M and could spend 8M on Hamilton.

I also think you have space to put a blockbuster out there. Could you trade one of TK/Farabee/Sanheim plus a high pick or prospect for a guy like Filip Forsberg? Or what does it take to get Matt Tkachuk out of Calgary who is in a similar "need to change things" situation? Or do you to try sign a reclamation project in Laine who I can't imagine is looking to re-sign in Columbus with the way his career is tanking there. I think they have options to re-shape the forward core without getting rid of everyone.

I think the Flyers have enough talent on the roster, and enough pieces in the "futures" toolbox to re-shape the NHL squad and get it to contention.

Well at least youre positive but you put one or more of these posts up every season since the ESPN days and we are still in the middle of the road as per every season so forgive me if i dont believe it anymore .

 

[lasgop8]

More than anything, if they don't do something on the defensive big, then it's gonna be the same next season. Gotta start there IMO.

We need stars. At least one more up front maybe 2 and one on the back end and a couple of more players with decent skill who can play a 200 foot game and be able help out Morin too.