2015-16 NBA Eastern Conference OFFICIAL THREAD

[WiggyRuss]

Jabari Parker is activated tonight

cant wait to watch Jabari.....in an alternate universe with no LBJ I could see a Cavs starting lineup of something like PG KYrie SG Dion WAiters SF Gordon Heyward PF JAbari Parker C. Thompson lets say...

Bucks really make me want to get League Pass...

 

[WiggyRuss]

And...I know Cavs wanted pick more then Baron ...but don't tell me that they didn't think they would get some production from Davis and thought they were upgrading their chances at the time.

Baron barely even played. I mean dude you dont get an unprotected first round pick in the upcming draft which was guaranteed to be like WORST case scenario when the trade was made like a 10th pick if you are not just sucking down salary.

I do think that the only game the Cavs beat the Heat while LBJ was there was a game where Baron actually played and kinda went nuts. The Cavs had just started shipping everything out at that point since the whole roster was old- they had traded away picks for years and missed on the ones they had to keep....the cupboard was BARE!

Im trying to think of the only decent assets the Cavs had at that point when LeBron left them....We had Mo Williams- who was part of that Baron Davis deal- he was ok. JJ Hickson had some talent as a young guy but he only ended up fetching a conditional 1st rounder and Omri Casspi in a deal....Varejao was on the team and pretty good....Thats about it if i remember correctly...Mo, Varejao, Hickson....they were tearing it down to the bare bones..

and seriously how nice was it that the old fool still owned the Clips and traded a TOTALLY unprotected pick that was transferring in just a few months. THAT NEVER HAPPENS. NEVER. A team pretty much is certain its in the lotto- in a very competitive West- and trades their pick UNPROTECTED to save a bunch of money on a contract. Thats criminal. Its just so appropriate that the pick came in like that.

Gilbert kept doing it too- the next trade deadline I believe was hte Lakers deal, and the next trade deadline they made the Memphis deal to keep being proactive and adding assets by renting out their cap room to teams that wanted to cut salary.

 

[trojanfan12]

Again, this shows just how clueless you are. And if the Lakers had actually been proactive like the Cavs, Thunder, and now the 76'ers (and countless other teams had been) maybe they would not be digging themselves out of a huge hole right now.

Let me hold your hand through this explanation because obviously you need some big time help here. First- answer me this question- HOW DID THE CAVS GET THE PICK THAT BECAME KYRIE IRVING? did they "wait around" for NBA welfare? NOPE. They absorbed the last 2 years of Baron Davis ridiculous contract from the Los Angeles Clippers. They then waited until the new CBA and amnesty clause came out- and amnestied Davis. Total cost to Gilbert? AT least 30+ million- but he got the #1 overall pick.

Lets go to another trade where the Cavs benefitted from being under the salary cap. The Cavs dealt Ramon Sessions, and took back Luke Waltons terrible contract from the Lakers for a first round pick, and the ability to switch first round picks. Again- Gilbert takes on 2 years of Waltons awful deal in order to get ASSETS.

Lets think of another one here! You still with me? GOOD. When the Cavs absorbed Maresse Speights and Wayne Ellington from the Grizzlies to get ANOTHER first round pick (that actually had pretty good pro-Cavs protections which made it a pretty good 1st rounder). The Cavs take on salary- and take a 1st round pick for their troubles.

That strategy- that was also put into place by the Thunders beforehand, and the 76'ers subsequently- (and many other teams) is VERY SIMPLE. When you arent ready to compete because your roster is extremely young or you just started your rebuilding process and you have salary cap space you can BASICALLY RENT IT OUT TO OTHER TEAMS AND TAKE THEIR ASSESTS IN THE PROCESS. OKC worked this wonderfully in trades with the Suns, Jazz, etc. in order to get Ibaka and others. --- The Sixers the same thing- absorbing JaVale McGees terrible deal for a first rounder from Denver- absorbing those contracts from the Kings over the summer in order to get Stauskas and a first rounder.



but then again- this is Checkers- not Chess- and obviously this type of strategy just flies right over your head Trojanfan12---- all though- the Lakers even dipped their toe into the strategy when they took Linns deal and a 1st rounder from the Rockets.

Glad I could help ya through that

The Cavs weren't proactive about shit. The above idiocy just shows how clueless you really are. Gilbert wrote a letter telling Cavs fans that the Cavs would win a title before Lebron. Instead, he let the sit in the toilet for the entire time he was in Miami. Then, when Lebron agreed to come back, he got himself capped out so he can't improve the roster. That's why he had to overpay TT.

I'm sure you missed all of that though, since you were an OKC fan at the time.

 

[trojanfan12]

yah- the Cavs were getting an UNPROTECTED first round pick that was at the very least going to be a top 10 pick- and of course BEING UNPROTECTED had the potential to be much much more. Gilbert took on that ridiculous contract of Davis' despite his knees being pretty much shot to inject another lotto pick into the team. Hence Thompson AND Irving! man its nice to have an owner who will eat 40 million dollars in Baron Davis' contract just to get a solid lotto pick!

Notice how teams just DONT TRADE unprotected picks anymore--- well- other than what i saw the Heat give the Suns but Riley will be long gone before those become due.

Gilbert tanked rather than live up to his promise. Period.

 

[WiggyRuss]

The Cavs weren't proactive about shit. The above idiocy just shows how clueless you really are. Gilbert wrote a letter telling Cavs fans that the Cavs would win a title before Lebron. Instead, he let the sit in the toilet for the entire time he was in Miami. Then, when Lebron agreed to come back, he got himself capped out so he can't improve the roster. That's why he had to overpay TT.

I'm sure you missed all of that though, since you were an OKC fan at the time.

again- at least hte Cavs had a clue how to rebuild and got it done in 4 years

TAke Baron DAvis' contract and get the #1 overall pick

Take Waltons deal and give up Sessions to get a #1 pick and rights to switch a pick

Take Mareese Speights and WAyne Ellington to get a first round pick....


This is what the smart teams do. The LAkers have been able to add 1 crappy 1st round pick from Houston for taking Jeremy Lin- and STILL owe picks in 2016 and 2018.....

The Cavs took a cupboard that was bare and had it teeming with picks and young players for LEBron to come back to in 4 years

Simple black and white facts....

 

[trojanfan12]

The Cavs didn't have a clue about shit. Gilbert didn't know what the fuck to do without Lebron and had no idea how to build anything. If he did, he would have been able to fulfill his promise or at least worked on putting together a roster that could have had a chance at making the playoffs.

He said they'd win a title before Lebron. So, if the Cavs had a clue, where's the trophy? Where's at least a playoff appearance?

He tanked, got lucky in the lottery and then got lucky when Lebron agreed to come back. There was no grand plan.

 

[ChrisGar15]

Interesting to watch how the Celtics are trying to build. Ainge is trying to do the same thing he did in 2006/2007 -- assemble a bunch of "assets" (decent / young players) -- ideally to package them + picks in a couple of trades to bring in a couple of All-Stars.

 

[The Derski]

TJ McConnell playing really well for the sixers

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

again- at least hte Cavs had a clue how to rebuild and got it done in 4 years

TAke Baron DAvis' contract and get the #1 overall pick

Take Waltons deal and give up Sessions to get a #1 pick and rights to switch a pick

Take Mareese Speights and WAyne Ellington to get a first round pick....


This is what the smart teams do. The LAkers have been able to add 1 crappy 1st round pick from Houston for taking Jeremy Lin- and STILL owe picks in 2016 and 2018.....

The Cavs took a cupboard that was bare and had it teeming with picks and young players for LEBron to come back to in 4 years

Simple black and white facts....

You're just making shit up.
You think you're dealing with the village idiots?

Didn't you cite an article stating the Cavs FO saying they knew they needed assets because they'd have to build their team through the draft?


Well, how did THOSE teams do?

Only way you could possibly be right would be if the articles said that the FO knew they needed as many assets as possible because they were hoping to lure James back and then use those assets to acquire veteran players to surround him with.

Truth is, the Cavs were nothing but lucky that lotto balls popped out for them.
Any planning they have ever done has turned into a disaster.
They planned those rosters in James tenure years 5-6 by making horrible moves which lead to him leaving.
Heat never finished worse then EC champion with the moves thry made.

 

[wildturkey]

Cavs losing to Philly right now. This obviously proves they can't win a championship. Shut it down. Season's over

 

[DJ Fieri]

Noel and Okafor are killing the Cavs.

 

[WiggyRuss]

You're just making shit up.
You think you're dealing with the village idiots?

Didn't you cite an article stating the Cavs FO saying they knew they needed assets because they'd have to build their team through the draft?


Well, how did THOSE teams do?

Only way you could possibly be right would be if the articles said that the FO knew they needed as many assets as possible because they were hoping to lure James back and then use those assets to acquire veteran players to surround him with.

Truth is, the Cavs were nothing but lucky that lotto balls popped out for them.
Any planning they have ever done has turned into a disaster.
They planned those rosters in James tenure years 5-6 by making horrible moves which lead to him leaving.
Heat never finished worse then EC champion with the moves thry made.

I mean are you just ignoring the fact they made those trades? The year James left they had no first round pick. It was dealt for Jamison. That first offseason they were full of vets, had no draft pick- and needed to turn it all over- for shits sake- Mo Williams/Antwan Jamison and Mo Williams were their best players.

After that- every single trade deadline they made a major move to improve the team and take on significant money whether it was taking on Baron Davis bum ass or Luke Waltons bum ass or the Grizzlies - those first three years- or taking on Deng and Hawes the 4th year. EVERY SINGLE YEAR- all 4 of those years LeBron was gone the Cavs made a major deadline deal- and those first three years they cut out the veterans, added young players and draft picks.

I mean are you paying attention? The plan is eactly what OKC is did- what the 76ers are doing- teams obviously do it better than others- but the Cavs ended up adding a TON of picks young players

LeBron James WAS NOT COMING BACK TO A TEAM that sucked. He was NOT going back to a team that did not have a chance to win......but the Cavs just did a great job gathering FRANCHISE guys like Kyrie, good secondary guys like Thompson, Wiggins for crying out loud! - ya cant always hit but at least Waiters still had trade value, as did Tyler Zeller, etc....All those picks and young players. I mean- thats what the Lakers are trying to do right now- gather enough assets and young players to make themselves attractive to a free agent- maybe they should model the Cavs!

4 years the Cavs went from a cupboard that was bare to being the title favorites! IT sure does help getting Kyrie Irving though .....that AND Wiggins and having other assets to snag away a 25 year old All Star in Kevin Love!

 

[DJ Fieri]

Gilbert took on that ridiculous contract of Davis' despite his knees being pretty much shot to inject another lotto pick into the team. Hence Thompson AND Irving! man its nice to have an owner who will eat 40 million dollars in Baron Davis' contract just to get a solid lotto pick!

But, you criticized the Lakers when they absorbed Lin's contract to get a 1st rounder???


HYPOCRITE.

 

[WiggyRuss]

The Cavs didn't have a clue about shit. Gilbert didn't know what the fuck to do without Lebron and had no idea how to build anything. If he did, he would have been able to fulfill his promise or at least worked on putting together a roster that could have had a chance at making the playoffs.

He said they'd win a title before Lebron. So, if the Cavs had a clue, where's the trophy? Where's at least a playoff appearance?

He tanked, got lucky in the lottery and then got lucky when Lebron agreed to come back. There was no grand plan.

if you dont think their is any strategy to taking on other teams problems like Baron Davis, Luke Walton, Speights+Ellngton, and getting assets like first round picks then i dont know what to tell ya.

THATS how you jump start a rebuilding project. Add in an extra lotto pick or two- and about 3-4 extra 1st round picks over a 4 year period---- keep some, deal some- hit BIG on some like Kyrie.....

either that or you can do the decade rebuild thing....SO glad Dan spent all that money on Baron Davis' contract to get Kyrie and get the whole thing started!!! And so glad Dan signed off on taking Waltons deal and getting those picks from the Lakers which laid a base for the Cavs clearing the max cap space to sign LeBron! Like I said- gotta give some props to the Clips and Lakers!!! without them I sure as hell dont see Bron back here yet...

 

[WiggyRuss]

Sixers play some good defense.....they are giving a lot of effort...playing hard....when your the CAvs your gonna get everyones best shot- thats a given- but it looks like a young team that is playing had....Ill try and stay unbiased on Okafor as i didnt like him very much in the draft- but hes looked pretty good here thus far. Hes not backing down to Mozgov.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

if you dont think their is any strategy to taking on other teams problems like Baron Davis, Luke Walton, Speights+Ellngton, and getting assets like first round picks then i dont know what to tell ya.

THATS how you jump start a rebuilding project. Add in an extra lotto pick or two- and about 3-4 extra 4th round picks over a 4 year period---- keep some, deal some- hit BIG on some like Kyrie.....

either that or you can do the decade rebuild thing....SO glad Dan spent all that money on Baron Davis' contract to get Kyrie and get the whole thing started!!! And so glad Dan signed off on taking Waltons deal and getting those picks from the Lakers which laid a base for the Cavs clearing the max cap space to sign LeBron! Like I said- gotta give some props to the Clips and Lakers!!! without them I sure as hell dont see Bron back here yet...

Nothing started with Kyrie.
Failing to be a top 8 seed in a weak EC simply continued.

Cavs accomplished nothing as far as winning from any move you've mentioned.

Like we keep telling you, it was blind lotto luck combined with Gilbert knowing he could never possibly win anything without James, so he offered him anything if he'd agree to come back.

So far, he still hasn't won anything.

 

[DJ Fieri]

Irving isn't playing?














Oh.......he's not injury prone. Nope, not at all.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Irving isn't playing?



He'll prob play as many games as there are in a NCAA schedule, even though when he had to play an NCAA schedule he lasted for what?
11 games?














Oh.......he's not injury prone. Nope, not at all.

 

[WiggyRuss]

I mean i seriously dont know how anyone in their right mind can say the Cavs didnt freaking do it pefectly.

LeBron leaves at the end of 2009/10-
The best Cavs remaining? Jamison/MoWilliams/Varejao/Sessions/Gibson/Hickson/AnthonyParker and a bunch of nobodies. No first round pick that previous summer as it went to the Wiz for Jamison.

They turn that roster of vets- and not even one good young player besides maybe Hickson- in just 3 drafts and 3 offseasons- they are in position to tell LeBron James - come back to Cleveland- we got more than you got in Miami- and we got an owner who will spend BIG TIME.

THINK of that. Kyrie, Wiggins, Bennett, Zeller, Waiters, Karasev, still multiple picks in your pocket, the Haywood contract, cap room.........Its just too crazy.....3 offseasons because the 1st offseason was wasted with no pick- a team with not even one good young player (besides maybe Hickson), without one all star level vet....

In that short time gathered enough assets and young players for LeBron to say "ya know what- love ya Dwade and Bosh but im going to play with better youger guys in Cleveland"

THAT is how you execute a rebuild right there. Take notes.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Nothing started with Kyrie.
Failing to be a top 8 seed in a weak EC simply continued.

.

OF COURSE IT DID. If Kyrie was not here LeBron is not jumping back to Cleveland so soon. He wouldve signed another 2-3 years in Miami if Cleveland did not turn their roster from being bare to being READY TO GO in 3 drafts.

If the Cavs never make that Baron Davis deal- and JUST get the #4 pick in the draft and take like Brandon Knight NO EFFEN WAY is LeBron back. You have got to be outta your mind.