I'd rather have Tristan or Whiteside Poll

[TurnUpTheHeat]

what does this post even mean then if it was not trying to make the point that the contract will put the CAvs over the repeater line going forward? What is your point?

Im saying his base salary isn't his true cost to the owner.
Therefore, using his base salary vs perceived player value isn't accurate with him or any other team who is over the tax threshold.

 

[WiggyRuss]

You pick and choose stats, like no other here.
You've been exposed as a joke for quite a while now when these types of debates get started.

wow..you seem ornery and really butt-hurt this morning

LOL--- i think that article that came down from ESPN showing how overrated Whiteside jammed that stick an extra quarter inch up your ass!! chill bro...ive never seen someone so freaking combative over every little thing--- and the HILARIOUS part- i continue to shoot your bullshit down with information and you keep coming back with more stupid shit that just keeps showing you simply do not have the knowledge to carry on an argument on equal footing....all i do is constantly correct your shabby 2nd rate knowledge of the CBA and procedure---- and i have absolutely zero issue with people that just like watching the games and ignore this stuff- but those people should probably not hold themselves out as experts when the fact is- they dont know shit about what they are talking about as you have proved OVER AND OVER AND OVER again.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Im saying his base salary isn't his true cost to the owner.
Therefore, using his base salary vs perceived player value isn't accurate with him or any other team who is over the tax threshold.

who cares what the true cost is to the owner? you think i am crying for billionaire 5 times over Dan Gilbert? lol....unreal....just because your owner has been on a season long mission to banish all the unproductive contracts he gave crappy bench players like chalmers and anderson- and dumpster dove for his bench that turned out to be a farce- doesnt mean other owners try and pinch every penny above the luxury tax line.

I can just see the image of Pat giving Mickey a boost into the big blue BFI can behind the Applebee's outside AA....picking through old bones, thrown out food, scattering cats, and finding Amare Stoudemire

 

[WiggyRuss]

You pick and choose stats, like no other here.
You've been exposed as a joke for quite a while now when these types of debates get started.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

wow..you seem ornery and really butt-hurt this morning

LOL--- i think that article that came down from ESPN showing how overrated Whiteside jammed that stick an extra quarter inch up your ass!! chill bro...ive never seen someone so freaking combative over every little thing--- and the HILARIOUS part- i continue to shoot your bullshit down with information and you keep coming back with more stupid shit that just keeps showing you simply do not have the knowledge to carry on an argument on equal footing....all i do is constantly correct your shabby 2nd rate knowledge of the CBA and procedure---- and i have absolutely zero issue with people that just like watching the games and ignore this stuff- but those people should probably not hold themselves out as experts when the fact is- they dont know shit about what they are talking about as you have proved OVER AND OVER AND OVER again.

I promise you, I didn't read the article.
And as far as the rest, look at the thread, look at the votes, read the comments.
The ONLY person you impress is yourself.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

who cares what the true cost is to the owner? you think i am crying for billionaire 5 times over Dan Gilbert? lol....unreal....just because your owner has been on a season long mission to banish all the unproductive contracts he gave crappy bench players like chalmers and anderson- and dumpster dove for his bench that turned out to be a farce- doesnt mean other owners try and pinch every penny above the luxury tax line.

I can just see the image of Pat giving Mickey a boost into the big blue BFI can behind the Applebee's outside AA....picking through old bones, thrown out food, scattering cats, and finding Amare Stoudemire

Nice post
Show us your stats and stories to support Gilbert being the more successful owner over Arison.

And, Amare's been pretty damn good lately, but you wouldn't know since you don't watch anything but Cavs games ( if they're winning).

 

[WiggyRuss]

I promise you, I didn't read the article.
And as far as the rest, look at the thread, look at the votes, read the comments.
The ONLY person you impress is yourself.

AND HERE COMES THE BITTER!!!--- at least your predictable like that- that after you have gotten thrashed around a little- you resort to either (a) WELL EVERYONE THINKS YOUR WRONG!! HAHA or (b) THE CAVS STILL HAVE NO TITLES....

 

[WiggyRuss]

I promise you, I didn't read the article.
And as far as the rest, look at the thread, look at the votes, read the comments.
The ONLY person you impress is yourself.

of course you didnt. You are SERIOUSLY self deluded to a level where you ACTUALLY believe you know more than people that cover the NBA for their livelihood. Why would you seek out information or cutting edge stats and information?

your like the 58 year old baseball scout with a big dip in his mouth, a gut hanging out a million miles, with his radar gun muttering to himself how all these youngsters with their stats dont know shit....a relic of a bygone era that refuses to enter the modern day.

and seriously the ego that it takes for you to HONESTLY believe you know more than the guys that do this for a living is parts hilarious, parts sad, and parts just down right pathetic.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

AND HERE COMES THE BITTER!!!--- at least your predictable like that- that after you have gotten thrashed around a little- you resort to either (a) WELL EVERYONE THINKS YOUR WRONG!! HAHA or (b) THE CAVS STILL HAVE NO TITLES....

View attachment 85942

Just standard replies to negate your butt hurt self.

You brought up Gilbert/Arison, not me.
You challenged the accuracy of my words.

My counter was based on the judge and jury of this thread which is the results and comments.
Memes can't save you.
Like I said, you've impressed ZERO people but yourself.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

of course you didnt. You are SERIOUSLY self deluded to a level where you ACTUALLY believe you know more than people that cover the NBA for their livelihood. Why would you seek out information or cutting edge stats and information?

your like the 58 year old baseball scout with a big dip in his mouth, a gut hanging out a million miles, with his radar gun muttering to himself how all these youngsters with their stats dont know shit....a relic of a bygone era that refuses to enter the modern day.

and seriously the ego that it takes for you to HONESTLY believe you know more than the guys that do this for a living is parts hilarious, parts sad, and parts just down right pathetic.

I factually know
Whiteside >>Tristan and
The Heat is a much better, more complete team with Whiteside.

Everyone including writers can state they're opinion, but it will never change mine when I can actually evaluate based on what I see.

 

[Heatles84]

I promise you, I didn't read the article.
And as far as the rest, look at the thread, look at the votes, read the comments.
The ONLY person you impress is yourself.

Sorry, Turnup. I have to disagree with you yet again. Wiggy's idiocy is beyond impressive. I've never seen anyone as oblivious to facts and logic then him.

He says he keeps proving you wrong, but he keeps losing avi bets to you.

 

[Heatles84]

Wiggy - I keep proving you wrong.....while I sport a Heat avitar because you beat me in a bet.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Sorry, Turnup. I have to disagree with you yet again. Wiggy's idiocy is beyond impressive. I've never seen anyone as oblivious to facts and logic then him.

He says he keeps proving you wrong, but he keeps losing avi bets to you.

its not my words- its the words of guys that get PAID to cover the NBA for a living....so discount them all you want- the fact remains you guys are partially informed regular joes- while the guys that write these articles worked their way up- have spent countless hours developing sources learning the game, learning about statistics- ON AND ON AND ON....for you to try and spin off these arguments as solely my arguments to try and discount them- is like i said- both predictable and pathetic- and shows just a MASSIVE ego to think that you know better when you watch a game or two a night in between scratching your balls and helping the kids with their homework (or whatever)....it just cracks me up

what more do i have to say- when guys that are paid to cover the league say the following?:

Lamar Odom once criticized JaVale McGee's basketball IQ by saying, "The game is called basketball, not run and jump."

That quote comes to mind when watching Miami Heat center Hassan Whiteside.

Whiteside blocks 3.9 shots per game, and for his career he is the NBA's most prolific shot-blocker in two decades. He's also fifth in the league in rebounding, ranking in the top 10 in both offensive and defensive rebounds per game.

Impressive, right? It sounds as if he should be the NBA Defensive Player of the Year, at least.

Mouse over bars to see leaders

Not so fast. Here, the box score fails us.

When Whiteside sits, the Heat are better on defense. Over the past two seasons, as Whiteside has burst onto the scene in Miami, the Heat have allowed three points fewer per 100 possessions with Whiteside out of the game.

That's not all. The Heat grab more rebounds when he sits as well: 80 percent of defensive rebounds without Whiteside versus 76 percent with him.

Why? Whiteside apparently doesn't know -- or doesn't care -- that the opposing center is the biggest threat to grab offensive boards, and that the most important job of any center, after a shot goes into the air, is making sure that opponent has no clear path to the basket for a rebound.

Instead of boxing out, Whiteside appears to want the rebound for himself, according to my video review of Whiteside's play. This boosts his totals but costs his teammates rebounds. At the same time, opposing centers actually see a bump in their rebounding numbers against Whiteside, who is often ball-watching once a shot goes up.

It's a similar story with the block numbers. Whiteside seems more concerned about getting his individual block numbers up than keeping the opponent from scoring. Many times he will leave his man to "help" a teammate and rack up a potential block, even if his teammate is in good defensive position.

So what happens? If Whiteside doesn't get the blocked shot (and he usually doesn't), the now double-teamed player often finds Whiteside's man free under the basket. Or if the shot goes up, Whiteside is completely out of position to grab the rebound.

Either way, the opposing team has an easier time grabbing offensive boards, and with no rim protector in sight, has no trouble putting the ball immediately in the basket.

Whiteside's real plus-minus (RPM) tells part of the story, as he's currently ranked 31st among centers. And in truth, his RPM is likely to be even lower in the future, as the credit received for blocks and rebounds is overwhelmed by his negative on-off numbers

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Wiggy - I keep proving you wrong.....while I sport a Heat avitar because you beat me in a bet.

I didn't even think I'd for sure win that bet, I just accepted because he keeps pussying out of Cavs vs Field championship bet.


Hes a trooper though, still carrying on about being right despite every basketball poster on SportsHoopla telling him he isn't.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

its not my words- its the words of guys that get PAID to cover the NBA for a living....so discount them all you want- the fact remains you guys are partially informed regular joes- while the guys that write these articles worked their way up- have spent countless hours developing sources learning the game, learning about statistics- ON AND ON AND ON....for you to try and spin off these arguments as solely my arguments to try and discount them- is like i said- both predictable and pathetic- and shows just a MASSIVE ego to think that you know better when you watch a game or two a night in between scratching your balls and helping the kids with their homework (or whatever)....it just cracks me up

what more do i have to say- when guys that are paid to cover the league say the following?:

Lamar Odom once criticized JaVale McGee's basketball IQ by saying, "The game is called basketball, not run and jump."

That quote comes to mind when watching Miami Heat center Hassan Whiteside.

Whiteside blocks 3.9 shots per game, and for his career he is the NBA's most prolific shot-blocker in two decades. He's also fifth in the league in rebounding, ranking in the top 10 in both offensive and defensive rebounds per game.

Impressive, right? It sounds as if he should be the NBA Defensive Player of the Year, at least.

Mouse over bars to see leaders

Not so fast. Here, the box score fails us.

When Whiteside sits, the Heat are better on defense. Over the past two seasons, as Whiteside has burst onto the scene in Miami, the Heat have allowed three points fewer per 100 possessions with Whiteside out of the game.

That's not all. The Heat grab more rebounds when he sits as well: 80 percent of defensive rebounds without Whiteside versus 76 percent with him.

Why? Whiteside apparently doesn't know -- or doesn't care -- that the opposing center is the biggest threat to grab offensive boards, and that the most important job of any center, after a shot goes into the air, is making sure that opponent has no clear path to the basket for a rebound.

Instead of boxing out, Whiteside appears to want the rebound for himself, according to my video review of Whiteside's play. This boosts his totals but costs his teammates rebounds. At the same time, opposing centers actually see a bump in their rebounding numbers against Whiteside, who is often ball-watching once a shot goes up.

It's a similar story with the block numbers. Whiteside seems more concerned about getting his individual block numbers up than keeping the opponent from scoring. Many times he will leave his man to "help" a teammate and rack up a potential block, even if his teammate is in good defensive position.

So what happens? If Whiteside doesn't get the blocked shot (and he usually doesn't), the now double-teamed player often finds Whiteside's man free under the basket. Or if the shot goes up, Whiteside is completely out of position to grab the rebound.

Either way, the opposing team has an easier time grabbing offensive boards, and with no rim protector in sight, has no trouble putting the ball immediately in the basket.

Whiteside's real plus-minus (RPM) tells part of the story, as he's currently ranked 31st among centers. And in truth, his RPM is likely to be even lower in the future, as the credit received for blocks and rebounds is overwhelmed by his negative on-off numbers

As Trojan suggested, why not GTFO of SportsHoopla and post with your reporters?
Again,
1. Read the thread.
2. Look at the voting
3. Read the comments.

Only person you impress is yourself.

 

[WiggyRuss]

As Trojan suggested, why not GTFO of SportsHoopla and post with your reporters?
Again,
1. Read the thread.
2. Look at the voting
3. Read the comments.

Only person you impress is yourself.

i think there are PLENTY of people on here that are not completely and totally delusional to the point where they ACTUALLY TRULY believe they know better then the professionals. You are the rare breed that someone actually thinks watching a couple games a night on your couch makes you as qualified as guys that have either worked in or around the NBA for years upon years. I hope you can see how that makes you look positively certifiable.

 

[bksballer89]

i think there are PLENTY of people on here that are not completely and totally delusional to the point where they ACTUALLY TRULY believe they know better then the professionals. You are the rare breed that someone actually thinks watching a couple games a night on your couch makes you as qualified as guys that have either worked in or around the NBA for years upon years. I hope you can see how that makes you look positively certifiable.

You do realize that most fans watch more games of their favorite team than those guys who work on ESPN, NBATV, Yahoo, or TNT right?

You're one of those idiots who believe everything the media tells you to believe.

 

[WiggyRuss]

wit

I factually know
Whiteside >>Tristan and
The Heat is a much better, more complete team with Whiteside.

Everyone including writers can state they're opinion, but it will never change mine when I can actually evaluate based on what I see.

do you seriously fail to see that advanced stats were created to take opinion and "feel" out of it?

taking a genious PHD statistician and developing/building a statistic based off of every single piece of data from every recorded NBA game that has ever been played- DOES NOT CONSTITUTE AN OPINION YOU MORON.

It spits out an OBJECTIVE piece of data- free from the bias that is ingrained in fools like you who think they know better by watching a game or two or even three a night.

How you can keep on trying to defend Whiteside as the talent you hold him out to be- when the OBJECTIVE BLACK AND WHITE DATA says otherwise- just shows how truly idiotic you are. I guess you seriously fail to understand their is a difference between an opinion- and a statistical model that is built specifically to take opinion out of it.....

but i guess thats why they pay you the big bucks right?



its really the moneyball argument- as i said- your the big fat scout with pastrami hanging out of his mouth saying I KNOW WHAT I SEE--- but the simple fact of the matter is- in baseball and basketball- those guys WAIVED BYE BYE a LONG time ago for the most part.....

you think its coincidence harvard and yale PHds run teams now and integrate all this information?


both you and Whiteside belong in the NBA of 20 years ago- where a traditional center could actually stay on the court---- and where the great leap forward in information that has occured in pro sports wont hurt your wittle head and overwhelm your brain.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

i think there are PLENTY of people on here that are not completely and totally delusional to the point where they ACTUALLY TRULY believe they know better then the professionals. You are the rare breed that someone actually thinks watching a couple games a night on your couch makes you as qualified as guys that have either worked in or around the NBA for years upon years. I hope you can see how that makes you look positively certifiable.

1. Read the thread
2. Look at the voting
3. Read the comments

You, posting the same nonsense over and over, to impress yourself, can't and won't change it.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

wit

do you seriously fail to see that advanced stats were created to take opinion and "feel" out of it?

taking a genious PHD statistician and developing/building a statistic based off of every single piece of data from every recorded NBA game that has ever been played- DOES NOT CONSTITUTE AN OPINION YOU MORON.

It spits out an OBJECTIVE piece of data- free from the bias that is ingrained in fools like you who think they know better by watching a game or two or even three a night.

How you can keep on trying to defend Whiteside as the talent you hold him out to be- when the OBJECTIVE BLACK AND WHITE DATA says otherwise- just shows how truly idiotic you are. I guess you seriously fail to understand their is a difference between an opinion- and a statistical model that is built specifically to take opinion out of it.....

but i guess thats why they pay you the big bucks right?

In a few months when he's offered approx 20m,how will you feel about your data?

I think I'll keep my businesses and let the reporters keep their pay checks.