Disappointment, uncertainty, and Elway

[Broncosballer32]

Well BB that topic just came up on nfl network and they just discussed that exact issue regarding Manning and the coach search. Touched on how it would be very difficult for a candidate to go to Denver with the uncertainty of Manning and whether they plan on life without him while Elway is saying he wants to give Manning 4-5 wks??? The more I think about it, as others mentioned before,etc. The only way Manning is back is if Gase gets the HC job. Otherwise, and according to this report, not many HC are going to touch Denver with all the uncertainty of what direction their going to go. Elway needs to make a decision on Peyton sooner than later if he has any hopes of getting a top quality HC. So, maybe some of you are right and Elway decides to give Gase and Manning a shot and try and make that D work with a new DC and staff. Very tricky situation Elway has to figure out.

Well, the way I see it, if the Elway hires a coach that is not Gase, Manning will retire.

To me, it will either be Kubiak, Gase....or Dennison. I sure hope it is not Dennison. That will make me tighten my jaws.

I am sure hoping he has a plan. It is a little hard to see what it is. The part that confuses me is I have no idea if I want Manning back or not. I am not really looking forward to Osweiler. I have not seen much out of him that makes my toes tingle. You never know.

I am tending to NOT want Manning back. They can blame the quad or whatever they want. Was that the reason they did what they did in the SB? No, nothing about a quad there. They said he injured it on December 14th. When was the Rams game? All year he has been a bit off.

Look, I mentioned it last year. Manning may very well go down as the greatest pocket passer ever. It is fun for us to watch, especially in this fantasy football era. Between Manning and Marino, no one could sling it from the pocket like them. Manning, even went a step further in being able to read defenses.

However, more often than not, that is not what gets it done. Meaning there is a reason why Manning gets criticized for the play off record. Not really Manning's fault, then again.....

The simple fact is he is too one dimensional. Always really has been, but especially so now. The Broncos cannot even run a simple QB sneak with him. BTW that is a very underrated aspect of Brady's game. He actually does that very effectively, and I have seen him run when he needs to.

Eventually, QBs that are one dimensional (Some QBs are running QBs only and others cannot do that at all) get figured out. Somewhere along the line it happens.

The problem we are all having I think is none of us can really define what we want. I mean, do we want Manning back for one season? You all think that shit we saw on Sunday was really all about a quad? He was not limping, I will put it that way.

 

[notorious98]

Why Dennison? If Elway is giving Manning a few weeks, why wouldn't Dan Quinn also be on the list of coaching candidates? I haven't seen anything about Dennison outside of Jacksonville's new OC.

 

[BroncoInCALI]

Just an idea........but, how about Kubiak is the hire, with Manning back for one run at the Title.....running his own offense. (I always kind of figure Manning is kind of calling the game at the line of scrimmage anyway)

In the meantime, in the case that nobody believes in Oz, they draft Hundley in the 2nd Round with the idea of him running Kubiak's system in the future.

Just a thought......

 

[Southieinnc]

Obviously another disappointing end to the season. Four straight trips to the playoffs since going 4-12 in 2010, the additions since then of some big time FAs, and some pretty solid drafts have all raised expectations very high. As Broncos fans know, however, it's really tough to win it all -- only one of thirty-two does each year. Life goes on.

Added to the disappointing end to this season is the uncertainty associated with building a coaching staff from scratch and perhaps losing Peyton Manning, along with several other very good players, in free agency. Hard not to speculate over what direction the team takes over the coming weeks, but I really don't have much of a clue.

The one clue that I am hanging my hat on, however, is that Elway will be both aggressive and competent in his approach to keeping Denver among the most competitive teams in the league. That's more than I can realistically expect. Very interesting offseason is just beginning.

It really is tough to win it all. Do you really trust Elway? or did he just shit the bed. You could be with a mediocre head coach and a mediocre QB very soon, after a run that should not be over if you just do it again? Really, you did not do anything wrong, Why not just try again?

 

[notorious98]

It really is tough to win it all. Do you really trust Elway? or did he just shit the bed. You could be with a mediocre head coach and a mediocre QB very soon, after a run that should not be over if you just do it again? Really, you did not do anything wrong, Why not just try again?

Why wouldn't we trust Elway? He brought in Knighton, Sanders, Ware, Talib, Ward, Manning, and Welker. He also drafted Von Miller, Roby, Sylvester Williams, Kayvon Webster, Travathan, Malik Jackson, Hillman, Wolfe, Franklin, Irving, Julius Thomas, and Moore. All of those draft picks played significant roles for this team. Why would anybody say he "shit the bed"? The team went to a Super Bowl last year. This year, the players shit the bed. The coaches shit the bed. Elway gave them plenty of tools to win and they failed.

 

[MileHigh64]

It really is tough to win it all. Do you really trust Elway? or did he just shit the bed. You could be with a mediocre head coach and a mediocre QB very soon, after a run that should not be over if you just do it again? Really, you did not do anything wrong, Why not just try again?

The phrase "In Elway we trust" is a real deal in Denver. Not only is he viewed as the greatest Bronco of all time in this town but he's built a ton of trust with the fanbase in his role as Executive VP/GM of the team. Elway is decisive, aggressive, driven and transparent with the fans. He also resurrected the organization from the dark years of Shanahan's last couple of years and the failed Josh McDaniels experiment. So yeah, he's universally trusted by the vast majority of Broncos fans.

 

[TDs3nOut]

It really is tough to win it all. Do you really trust Elway? or did he just shit the bed. You could be with a mediocre head coach and a mediocre QB very soon, after a run that should not be over if you just do it again? Really, you did not do anything wrong, Why not just try again?

Elway was obviously not satisfied to have lost in the playoffs or SB in each of Fox's four years as HC, despite a good bit of regular season success. He is clearly willing to risk mediocrity in order to try to win a SB. If that wasn't clear before he fired Fox, it ought to be entirely transparent now.

 

[cdumler7]

I honestly am impressed that Elway could make this decision. Fox has been one of the winningest coaches of the last few years and won our division 4 straight times. Now yes that seems like great success and it is but we all know all too well that Fox has struggled especially in big games to get our team ready to compete. It seems like when we lose it is not just in a close game but in an embarrassing blowout. While we have had highly ranked defenses 2 of the last 3 years most of those stats were picked up against mediocre teams. It seemed like when we played top notch quarterbacks the game plan was just to go to pre-season style defense and rush 4 every time while having 7 drop back making it very easy for those quarterbacks to pick us apart. I was like watching a slow wound slowly bleed out. Still ends in death.

Now if it were me this would be what I would do...Hire Gary Kubiak. The guy is a great offensive mind and honestly he fits well with what I think Osweiler can do as a quarterback. I think he can be a better version of Schaub when Schaub was actually playing decent football. Then I would go out and try to get Jim Schwartz to coach the defense. This guy had the 4th overall ranked defense, was in the top-3 in turnovers forced and was 1st in sacks. I think with the defensive players we have they could fit well with his very aggressive style of play. Throw in over the last part of the season he had a defense that helped to shut down guys like Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers, and even Peyton when we played them. They had only 1 game all season that they allowed more than 30 points and that was early in the year to the Patriots when they were hitting their stride.

 

[notorious98]

Let's not give Schwartz credit with "shutting down" Brady. Gronk and Edelman didn't play in that game and Brady played a half of football. The Patriots mostly wanted to give Brady some reps with the other guys as a "just in case" measure and to try and sort out some issues that had been going on with the offense as a whole. Manning was in the beginning of his decline. The only guy they truly shut down was Rodgers. However, I remember there being conversation about how QBs have historically performed poorly in Buffalo in the month of December. Can't remember who said it or where it was said, but I remember it came before the game against the Packers.

That being said, he was able to turn that defense around from where it was the year before.

 

[cdumler7]

I can agree somewhat Notorious98 (welcome to the board by the way!) but even beyond all that like I said they only had one game all season where they allowed 30 or more points. So to me that speaks of a defense that was consistent no matter who they played. Throw in they were very creative up front with what they liked to do blitzing wise or just even trying to get pressure with the front 4. I think with Del Rio what irritated me more than anything is there just was no creativity to his defense. There are ways you can mix up that front-4 bringing pressure like looping guys around or even doing zone blitzes where you are still only bringing 4 but have no clue which 4 are coming at the quarterback. All he did was tell his front 4 go get the quarterback. Now while that worked some that was more based on just the talent we had/have. To me we need somebody who can maximize that talent and Schwartz I feel did that pretty darn well with the Bills.

 

[Broncosballer32]

I can agree somewhat Notorious98 (welcome to the board by the way!) but even beyond all that like I said they only had one game all season where they allowed 30 or more points. So to me that speaks of a defense that was consistent no matter who they played. Throw in they were very creative up front with what they liked to do blitzing wise or just even trying to get pressure with the front 4. I think with Del Rio what irritated me more than anything is there just was no creativity to his defense. There are ways you can mix up that front-4 bringing pressure like looping guys around or even doing zone blitzes where you are still only bringing 4 but have no clue which 4 are coming at the quarterback. All he did was tell his front 4 go get the quarterback. Now while that worked some that was more based on just the talent we had/have. To me we need somebody who can maximize that talent and Schwartz I feel did that pretty darn well with the Bills.

I have said this before, and it bears repeating. There is not much creativity from a 4-3 base. The Bills sack production mainly came from the DL. It helps to have a healthy Mario Williams, who had 14.5 sacks. Then, their DT Marcel Dareus at 10. That is from the center, and that is rather rare. You hardly ever see that kind of sack production from the middle.

The elite QBs in this league feast off of the blitz. Let me define "Blitz." That is a defense that sends MORE THAN 4 RUSHERS.

Brady etc relish the fact that a team needs to send 5 or more. They count on it really. Brady kryptonite (along with most QBs) is when his pocket collapses. The Giants, in two SBs exposed that weakness with that NASCAR DL. The Giants rarely sent more than 4 rushers, and most 4-3 base defenses do not do that. If they did, they would get crushed.

The Broncos "creativity" came when they kicked Von Miller down to DE on "passing downs." I put quotes around passing downs cause in todays NFL every and any down can be considered a passing down.

Del Rio did not exclusively play from the 4-3 base and I noticed that when they did go to a 3-4, they had better success. Nearly every game, they started out in a 3-4 look. For some reason they always went away from the 3-4 they often started out in. They would rarely ever get into that 3-4 look again, which frustrated me.

IMO, there is more creative POSSIBILITIES from the 3-4 base. You still rush 4 rushers, but the offense does not know which of the 4 LBs are coming, and from where they are coming. The zone blitz gets implemented.

The Broncos HAVE the personnel to run it. They have a quintessential NT in pot roast (the most important part of a 3-4). They have a ready made projected OLB edge rushing OLB in Von Miller, who thrived in a 3-4 at Texas AM and was projected as a 3-4 OLB by all NFL scouts entering the 2011 draft. BTW, they have Demarcus Ware, WHOSE BEST PRODUCTION came when he was a 3-4 OLB. Take a look at it.

The Broncos also have perfect 5 technique DEs that can thrive in that defense with Derek Wofle and Sylvester Williams.

Yes, I sound like a broken record, but I feel I need to express it over and over again.

 

[Broncosr0k]

Another consideration about the 3-4 is that Pot Roast is a FA. If he wants to leave we may be SOL in one of the hardest positions to fill in a 3-4.

 

[Broncosballer32]

Another consideration about the 3-4 is that Pot Roast is a FA. If he wants to leave we may be SOL in one of the hardest positions to fill in a 3-4.

Either way, he is a priority. JDR being in Oakland is not a good thing imo. Make no mistake, JDR will be trying to get him.

If he gets away, then the 3-4 is sort of out of the question.

Probably out of the question anyway.

 

[Malibu]

All I know is that I got bashed for saying J.D.R. wasn't the answer 3 years ago. I'm glad it took some of you three years about to come around. Yes I get it most of you can't stand me but believe it or not I know wtf I am saying most of the time. I study this team and it's staff very closely and I know a turd when I see one. Just saying.

 

[iknowftbll]

All I know is that I got bashed for saying J.D.R. wasn't the answer 3 years ago. I'm glad it took some of you three years about to come around. Yes I get it most of you can't stand me but believe it or not I know wtf I am saying most of the time. I study this team and it's staff very closely and I know a turd when I see one. Just saying.

JDR had a good season for the Broncos in 2012. He was really good last year when you consider how obscene the injury/legal report looked throughout the season. This year he had no excuses. He had a huge amount of talent assembled, relatively good health, and high expectations. We saw against Kansas City a few glimpses of what we expected our defense to be all season. Instead, it was not a very aggressive unit, did not play into its players' strengths, gave up too many scores (albeit a lot of those in garbage time) and never really took over games the way we thought they were going to. This is what has soured me on Del Rio. I would wish him well, but he went to Oakland so I can't. Either way, I'm glad he is not our DC any more.