"Wells Report" Released on Incognito/Martin Bullying Case

[ram29jackson]

So someone that tries to commit suicide that is bullied but has depression no blame can be put on the bully? So I guess you think that girls that are raped are just as guilty then as the raper.

LOL don't even compare the two.Completely separate issues.One has nothing to do with the other on any level

No, there is no law in place that I'm aware of where someone's suicide can be blamed on others. It doesn't even matter if there was. The fact is you are again talking about thought crimes which are foolish human assumptions. Life can be hard but when someone takes their own life they have only themselves to blame. You cant put people in jail because they made fun of someone who took their own life.Entire cities would need to be prisons for that

which goes back to what I said before...kids are committing suicide because they aren't taught to think critically anymore. Its all about how you feel without knowing how to deal with it.

 

[blstoker]

It's a fact. Be a fucking man.

I'm not saying incognito is a good guy. But shit, I was bullied as a kid and figured out quickly enough how to deal with it (and think that most bullying should be left to the kids to handle. it seriously does make you stronger). It's not hard.

A grown man that lets himself be "bullied" needs to be. Repeatedly. Until something finally clicks and he figures out that he's not a little kid.

There is no reason for any locker room to change. He just didn't belong.

You have to be a special kind of broken as a grown man to be "bullied". Not every environment is for everybody. If a team becomes comfortable for the mentally weak, it becomes just as unwelcoming to the rest of the team as the current version is to Martin. The difference is they're man enough to handle it, then get the fuck out to a team that isn't a joke.


No, not everyone can feel comfort everywhere. People are different and have different needs to feel comfortable. Many of these are at odds with each other. In this case, men will be men, and Martin had no place.

This is not a fucking office environment. This is a locker room. No remotely intelligent person old expect it to be significantly different than other locker rooms at every level. You're not just employees. You're a team. You're open with each other. You say a lot of shit that's not acceptable in an office environment. You're basically brothers. There are no limits, nor should there be.

Martin is not a victim and has no right to act like one.

The teammates pretty much all backed incognito though. The guy who hurt team cohesion was the guy who brought private issues in the locker room to the press.

Yeah, that's all absurd. The only thing I would even consider that they could have done differently is remove him from the team earlier, and even that isn't their fault if he hid that he was nuts.

I'm not disputing his head is broken, because it is. But that's not the dolphins fault, and that's not incognito or the other's fault. He hid the fact that he was a head case, so how can you blame people for the normal shit that goes on exacerbating it? It's not their fault he's a nut case.


As for anything about Martin for no reason, that's bullshit. There was a reason. You don't break the privacy of the locker room to the press. The second that he did that, he sealed that he will never be accepted in any locker room ever again, and that's well deserved.

A blow up doll? People talked shit to each other?


Oh, the horror

Spouting more ignorance to prove you're not ignorant doesn't make you smarter, just more ignorant.

 

[ram29jackson]

Spouting more ignorance to prove you're not ignorant doesn't make you smarter, just more ignorant.

IE you have no valid law/fact based rebuttal of any kind. Incognito is dumb but that isn't against the law yet. Martin is emotionally imbalanced and that's not Incognito's fault

 

[WizardHawk]

his depression or what ever cant be blamed on Incognito

So a guy who has been thrown off more than one team, had been arrested several times, had to pay off a woman he sexually harassed at a club for a team sanctioned event, who has had more than one other player say they liked him, but he was a loose cannon and is often uncontrollable, and had a massive melt down on twitter because he can't take what he dishes out can't possibly be blamed for anything he did to Martin?

All you see his Martin's mental condition and nothing about the trigger. Both have culpability. Without the established over the top way out of the ordinary abuse by Incognito there is no episode. It's really not a hard concept.

 

[ram29jackson]

So a guy who has been thrown off more than one team, had been arrested several times, had to pay off a woman he sexually harassed at a club for a team sanctioned event, who has had more than one other player say they liked him, but he was a loose cannon and is often uncontrollable, and had a massive melt down on twitter because he can't take what he dishes out can't possibly be blamed for anything he did to Martin?

All you see his Martin's mental condition and nothing about the trigger. Both have culpability. Without the established over the top way out of the ordinary abuse by Incognito there is no episode. It's really not a hard concept.

where is the broken law about this particular problem ? where is Incognito's arrest ? there is no story, there is no issue. His past has nothing to with whether anything should happen to him here. Reputation isn't against the law. Again, both are dumb self serving fools but nothing can be done about it in a court of law.

 

[WizardHawk]

where is the broken law about this particular problem ? where is Incognito's arrest ? there is no story, there is no issue. His past has nothing to with whether anything should happen to him here. Reputation isn't against the law. Again, both are dumb self serving fools but nothing can be done about it in a court of law.

I hate to tell you this (not really), but people get fired for things all the time that they don't get arrested for. Where did you get that there should be a formal legal process in order to lose your job?

And his past history goes to show that the reports are much more likely to be accurate. He has a long history of not conducting himself in anything that resembles professional. He treats many people like shit and always has. That makes the reports of what he is accused of doing far more likely. You have multiple people saying he was way over the line and a history of being way over the line. It appears that only you fail to see that he was indeed, way over the line. Not surprised.

 

[ram29jackson]

I hate to tell you this (not really), but people get fired for things all the time that they don't get arrested for. Where did you get that there should be a formal legal process in order to lose your job?

And his past history goes to show that the reports are much more likely to be accurate. He has a long history of not conducting himself in anything that resembles professional. He treats many people like shit and always has. That makes the reports of what he is accused of doing far more likely. You have multiple people saying he was way over the line and a history of being way over the line. It appears that only you fail to see that he was indeed, way over the line. Not surprised.

you are going in pointless circles about a non-issue. people getting fired at boring jobs have nothing to do with this. People are trying to blame Incognito for the other guys problems and that is not going to help the other guy in any way. The legal system cant do a damn thing about it and that's what everyone is getting at. Your opinion doesn't matter and what happens to regular people at regular jobs doesn't matter because those things are often just as bogus. Plenty of regular people abuse harassment accusations too and try to get money or advantage out of it for no valid reason.

multiple people said he went over the line ? so what ? yeah we know that,we've been through that but it doesn't matter, its already been concluded that it doesn't matter...it doesn't matter because it don't lead to any form of criminal conviction ....and so what he got fired..the same company will hire him back. Stop comparing this to real life...this is an entertainment business with 40 immature men in a locker room.

LOL its not my fault. You are worried about and focusing on pointless crap. Theres nothing I need to get. I Don't like either guy but the decision has been made....theres been a few hand slaps and its over. There is no story,there is no issue..just 2 dumb asses and some childish drama.

 

[WizardHawk]

First of all I don't give two shits (and no one else on this board does either) if you think my opinion is valid or not. I assure you that you telling me it doesn't matter won't stop me from saying it anyway.

Decided? Can you show me a link where anything has actually been decided. I'd like to read that. An independent report was just released to the league and as far as we know nothing has been stated officially afterward. We do not know what will happen (if anything) to the coaches, staff, or other members named in this. We know you didn't actually read any of the report based on responses, but there was no finality in it.

And all of my responses were based on my earlier statement that neither guy should ever play in the NFL again. I have made no mention of legal action, nor do I care. I said Incognito shouldn't play another down and I doubt anyone will want Martin back either. You can continue on whatever other non related tangent you want, but don't put words in my mouth. This guy shouldn't be allowed in a locker room again. You either agree with that or don't and either way I don't really care. You haven't added anything that refutes that. You just keep blowing smoke about unrelated garbage (as usual).

 

[ram29jackson]

First of all I don't give two shits (and no one else on this board does either) if you think my opinion is valid or not. I assure you that you telling me it doesn't matter won't stop me from saying it anyway.

Decided? Can you show me a link where anything has actually been decided. I'd like to read that. An independent report was just released to the league and as far as we know nothing has been stated officially afterward. We do not know what will happen (if anything) to the coaches, staff, or other members named in this. We know you didn't actually read any of the report based on responses, but there was no finality in it.

And all of my responses were based on my earlier statement that neither guy should ever play in the NFL again. I have made no mention of legal action, nor do I care. I said Incognito shouldn't play another down and I doubt anyone will want Martin back either. You can continue on whatever other non related tangent you want, but don't put words in my mouth. This guy shouldn't be allowed in a locker room again. You either agree with that or don't and either way I don't really care. You haven't added anything that refutes that. You just keep blowing smoke about unrelated garbage (as usual).

LOL that's right, I already said there was no finality in it IE nothing will be done by the law to either person. The report does have finality in it...it says the Dolphins should shape up in the future but that's all it says

LOL whats with the personal attacks ? I didn't insult you...I meant you=no one here including me can do anything about this and our opinions don't matter =as far as no opinion mattering...the league is the body that will take any action but no police or anything like that will be involved.=that is what has been decided... LOL at him not being allowed in another locker room. If he is football ready he will get hired.every player does it to a degree, he just went overboard with a weak member of the club and got in trouble

what a bunch of pussies this generation is with their feelings and their thought crime problems. I already said in a sense both are wrong but there is nothing ground breaking or important about any of it. Dumb jocks being childish is not a major problem or issue and it wont change in the future at all. There may well be less swinging of socks full of coins but the cussing and insults will never go away and no thought police or stupid rules on billboard in camp will ever change that.

LOL take a chill pill dude and stop having hissy fits about stuff outside your immediate life. LOL you are the one acting like a Incognito :rollseyes: towards me

LOL at not being allowed in another locker room for doing something that's not even a criminal offense.

many players have played after doing much more worse things against the law I don't like that either, its sad but its true.


Ive refuted plenty. Ive used facts while you rely on your feelings towards the problem. the fact is there is no criminal offense and there will be no actions taken that are important to anyone...just some slap on the hand bullcrap to appease softies like you

 

[blstoker]

IE you have no valid law/fact based rebuttal of any kind. Incognito is dumb but that isn't against the law yet. Martin is emotionally imbalanced and that's not Incognito's fault

It's the kind of ignorant rants that people are making about these situations, and this one in this one in particular as it pertains to this conversation, that leads people with mental issues to not come forward with these things. There is such a stigma against anyone who may suffer from any type of mental issue that it is nearly impossible to have any confidence that dealing with it at all will in any way make the situation better, and a long track record to show that matters only get worse. You want situations like this handled better than they have been in the past, then people need to stop acting like people with even minor mental issues are in some way inferior as human beings.

 

[antone112]

Andrew McDonald was OBVIOUSLY bullied so badly that he is still playing along. Classic victim attitude.

SARCASM

 

[jakedog56]

My opinion? I'm glad you asked!

Incognito is now and has always been an asshole and a bully. We have years of evidence on this. The Dolphins should have sat him down and told him before they signed him that they would be keeping a close eye on his behaviour and would take quick action if he behaved out of control. They didn't. They let him run wild. Fuck em both.

As for Martin, NFL football is a man's game and the OL in particular demands a warriors mentality. If he had a problem with the way he was being treated he should have physically made his point clear by beating Incognito's ass at every turn until the team did something or the bullies got the point and backed off. It seems to me that he is not mentally capable of playing in the NFL and should step away from the game. He has the physical skills but not the mental toughness.

 

[cdumler7]

LOL don't even compare the two.Completely separate issues.One has nothing to do with the other on any level

No, there is no law in place that I'm aware of where someone's suicide can be blamed on others. It doesn't even matter if there was. The fact is you are again talking about thought crimes which are foolish human assumptions. Life can be hard but when someone takes their own life they have only themselves to blame. You cant put people in jail because they made fun of someone who took their own life.Entire cities would need to be prisons for that

which goes back to what I said before...kids are committing suicide because they aren't taught to think critically anymore. Its all about how you feel without knowing how to deal with it.

Actually there have been charges brought up many of times before on those who have tormented those who commit suicide. 12 states have criminal charges that can be brought up for the very thing that Icognito was doing. 36 states have at least some kind of law in place that civil charges can be brought up against those who torment others. Only 1 state (Montana) has no laws in place for the very things that Icognito was doing.

 

[sonnyblack65]

So someone that tries to commit suicide that is bullied but has depression no blame can be put on the bully? So I guess you think that girls that are raped are just as guilty then as the raper.

Reminds me of that teenager girl that commited suicide because of the bullying on facebook or twitter. There was also a 10-12 yr old kid in Ma that killed himself after being bullied at school and by his little league teammates. Icognito is a punk piece of shit and Martin needs professional help and meds for depression. I always told my son that bullies were just cowards and hiding in that persona but when it comes down to it ,they fold like pussies. I would'nt want Ritchie on the Patriots,l you want cohesion and not some retard caveman

 

[sonnyblack65]

LOL don't even compare the two.Completely separate issues.One has nothing to do with the other on any level

No, there is no law in place that I'm aware of where someone's suicide can be blamed on others. It doesn't even matter if there was. The fact is you are again talking about thought crimes which are foolish human assumptions. Life can be hard but when someone takes their own life they have only themselves to blame. You cant put people in jail because they made fun of someone who took their own life.Entire cities would need to be prisons for that

which goes back to what I said before...kids are committing suicide because they aren't taught to think critically anymore. Its all about how you feel without knowing how to deal with it.

How are you taught to think, especially when your a kid?

 

[sonnyblack65]

Martin should get out of football too. Depression can affect anyone. Look at Junior Seau, always thought he was a tough stable man

 

[CaptainStubing]

Martin should get out of football too.

i believe that's the reason all of this happened. martin wanted out.

 

[JDM]

^^^

Didn't read the report.

I did.

Martin is a bitch who doesn't belong anywhere.

 

[sonnyblack65]

I did.

Martin is a bitch who doesn't belong anywhere.

Sounds like he has some mental issues. Anyone who is a bully is the biggest bitch out there. Icognito needs to get the shit beat out of that fat fuck

 

[JDM]

Incognito's an asshole, but he didn't target Martin. He tried to be his friend.

Honestly nothing that was said was not something I have heard said between friends countless times. If Martin wasn't a bitch he would have laughed and said some shit back.