Horny

[Sackataters]

I guess it depends on how sharp Jerry still is. I haven't heard him speak in two years. At the games, he looks quiet and reserved. He doesn't chime in like Layden, Nissalke, and Phil. Sometimes he looks confused and lost when they pan to him during games. Maybe that's because he is lost without his team.

I think our only hope lies in the new GM to strike gold, black gold, oil that is, Texas tea.

 

[MHSL82]

I guess it depends on how sharp Jerry still is. I haven't heard him speak in two years. At the games, he looks quiet and reserved. He doesn't chime in like Layden, Nissalke, and Phil. Sometimes he looks confused and lost when they pan to him during games. Maybe that's because he is lost without his team.

I think our only hope lies in the new GM to strike gold, black gold, oil that is, Texas tea.

He's lost because he can't understand why Corbin is playing who he's playing, calling the plays he's calling, and not riding the refs. Oh, and he's confused on why Corbin was chosen to replace him and still has the job.

Seriously though, I am surprised how often he's at the games. Do you think he unofficial lay and secretly assists Corbin. I mean they wouldn't want Corbin to be helped in public because it challenges his authority or makes him look less competent. I just didn't see Sloan as someone wanting much from basketball when he left, though I obviously knew he was passionate. I tjoughy he had spent his passion.

 

[MHSL82]

Phoenix Suns confirm hiring of Jeff Hornacek as coach

 

[ugafan6612]

Yes I'm here for the gangb...o nvm I see

 

[MHSL82]

Yes I'm here for the gangb...o nvm I see

Haha, thanks for the honesty.

 

[Sackataters]

What do you guys think of the Karl Malone part time hiring?

 

[MHSL82]

What do you guys think of the Karl Malone part time hiring?

Great! He could help our guys, whoever re-signs, and keeps him from joining Hornacek's team. if Hornacek didn't really want him, it saves the awkward non-signing. I like that it is part-time, as I think more could be a problem, perhaps (maybe not).

You should read the Salt Lake Tribune's Gordon Monson's argument for hiring him. It lists a lot of pros and cons.

The Return Of Karl Malone

 

[MHSL82]

Greg Miller and Malone have had public spats before. Malone has gone to the press publicly wondering outloud why he hasn't been asked to help, stating that he would be up for helping the team if they wanted. In the press conference, Miller said:

"With his success as a power forward in the NBA and the length of his career, he's obviously got a lot to teach," Miller said of Malone. "We're fortunate that he's now willing to make himself and his expertise available to us."

Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but that sounds like a shot or an insinuation that Malone wasn't willing before. I suppose he could have asked for more than a part-time job or wanted more money. But I feel he's a person who would have always wanted to share his expertise from the very beginning. Perhaps because he has a big ego or vanity, but still, always available, IMO.

Utah Jazz great Karl Malone to work with Derrick Favors, Enes Kanter - ESPN

 

[nuraman00]

1. Good players don't necessarily make good coaches.

2. A lot of times, they don't have the patience. The game came easy for them, and they think the players they are teaching aren't working hard enough.

3. The players being taught rarely are able to play like the great players they are learning from, anyways. Hakeem has taught several players over the past 11 years, and those players he taught picked up maybe 2% of his ability.

I think it's better though just from a mental side, and off-the-court lessons. Players can learn about preparation, attitude, eating right, how to deal with girlfriends or wives, and how to deal with money.

I like the move, but don't expect more than a 1-2% improvement from Kanter and Favors. Perhaps a change in attitude, if they required one. And just life lessons and friends, is what this is good for.

 

[nuraman00]

Great! He could help our guys, whoever re-signs, and keeps him from joining Hornacek's team. if Hornacek didn't really want him, it saves the awkward non-signing. I like that it is part-time, as I think more could be a problem, perhaps (maybe not).

Hyping up Hornacek as a coach a little too much. There is nothing appealing about him as a coach, other than the fact that Malone played with him.

He wasn't a highly sought assistant. 26 other teams wouldn't have hired him if they had a choice. Most wouldn't have even interviewed him.

Phoenix basically made a move to sell tickets to fans, who would think that "hey, he used to be a good player, maybe he'll make a good coach!" It was a cheap hire from a not highly sought after coach. If the Suns were serious about a coach, they would have hired someone other teams actually want too, or a veteran coach.

I'd say the same thing if Hornacek was hired by the Jazz. It was designed to sell hope. There were a lot of better options out there.

Hornacek wasn't highly regarded. He isn't going to come up with an innovative offense or defense, an will probably stick with something basic that fits his team.

 

[nuraman00]

Someone like Lionel Hollins, he's worked for 3 different organizations at least, and had long stops at 2 of them, before he was a head coach. That means other organizations thought he brought something, to keep him around for so long.

With Hornacek, only 2 teams considered him, all conveniently teams he played for. The Bobcats also interviewed him, but went with someone else.

 

[nuraman00]

I've never seen this many available coaches. Jazz really should be interviewing others. A good combination of highly regarded assistants, and good veteran coaches too.

 

[nuraman00]

You know I'm a Jerry fan, but it would be odd to go back now.

It wouldn't be odd if Jerry resigned because he needed a break, and now wants to get back into coaching. Then it would just be because he needed some time off to recoup from the NBA grind.

However, there have been 22 vacancies since he stepped down. Most have reached out to him. The fact that they haven't hired him, means that they feel Jerry isn't really back into coaching, or they don't think he can handle the traveling / health issues. They don't think he has the energy and stamina. They don't want someone with 40% of the fire he used to have.

Jerry was old when he stepped down as is. Only 3 other coaches were older when they stopped coaching. The traveling and health gets to them, IMO.

 

[MHSL82]

It wouldn't be odd if Jerry resigned because he needed a break, and now wants to get back into coaching. Then it would just be because he needed some time off to recoup from the NBA grind.

However, there have been 22 vacancies since he stepped down. Most have reached out to him. The fact that they haven't hired him, means that they feel Jerry isn't really back into coaching, or they don't think he can handle the traveling / health issues. They don't think he has the energy and stamina. They don't want someone with 40% of the fire he used to have.

Jerry was old when he stepped down as is. Only 3 other coaches were older when they stopped coaching. The traveling and health gets to them, IMO.

He's turned some down or stepped away - though a few of those may be because he saw the writing on the wall? I don't know. I'd like him back. I'd go up or down with that ship - or more like consistently stay above average and not win (we didn't with Malone and Stock and now we have neither).

 

[MHSL82]

1. Good players don't necessarily make good coaches.

If you limit them in what you are asking them to do, then being a good player or just a regular coaching candidate has nothing to do with it. ANY coach good at anything besides coaching (scouting, agent, high school coach) doesn't necessarily make for good coaches. If your comment was in regard to Malone, I think if they have him help in the ways that he would be good, it would necessarily make him a good coach in that role. I know that's a bit of a circular reference or self-defining, but I wouldn't apply your comment to a part-time guy. I suppose a good player could have no clue what he was doing and not be good - just not any more than an average guy coming into coach.

2. A lot of times, they don't have the patience. The game came easy for them, and they think the players they are teaching aren't working hard enough.

3. The players being taught rarely are able to play like the great players they are learning from, anyways. Hakeem has taught several players over the past 11 years, and those players he taught picked up maybe 2% of his ability.

I think it's better though just from a mental side, and off-the-court lessons. Players can learn about preparation, attitude, eating right, how to deal with girlfriends or wives, and how to deal with money.

I like the move, but don't expect more than a 1-2% improvement from Kanter and Favors. Perhaps a change in attitude, if they required one. And just life lessons and friends, is what this is good for.

Agree. Earlier, I was just

 

[MHSL82]

Hyping up Hornacek as a coach a little too much. There is nothing appealing about him as a coach, other than the fact that Malone played with him.

He wasn't a highly sought assistant. 26 other teams wouldn't have hired him if they had a choice. Most wouldn't have even interviewed him.

Phoenix basically made a move to sell tickets to fans, who would think that "hey, he used to be a good player, maybe he'll make a good coach!" It was a cheap hire from a not highly sought after coach. If the Suns were serious about a coach, they would have hired someone other teams actually want too, or a veteran coach.

I'd say the same thing if Hornacek was hired by the Jazz. It was designed to sell hope. There were a lot of better options out there.

Hornacek wasn't highly regarded. He isn't going to come up with an innovative offense or defense, an will probably stick with something basic that fits his team.

Where's the hype? I looked over the thread and in other threads and didn't find any. Who's hyping him?

I'm not a Suns fan so what do I care? Oh, and I wasn't hyping the Hornacek hire. I was just happy for him. If I hyped it, I would have wished out loud for him to have gone to Milwaukee so that we didn't have to play his team so much.

Having said that, I won't say anything further to judge him before he coaches. I don't blame him for not being highly sought, highly regarded. He was sought, hired, and now will have a chance to show himself. Most teams aren't hiring, he was interviewed at a few that were last year and who knows if he turned down others and if he turned down some this year knowing Phoenix was interested.

He has to start somewhere and he did have some success independent of Malone and Stockton. He wasn't the best, but he held his own for the type of player he was (20 points in Phoenix, consistently 14+, great three point shooter. White. ) Not crossing my fingers, but my loyalty will remain with him, as long as we hire someone eventually over Corbin. I hope he does better than expected because better than expected doesn't mean beating us. I'm not going to bet on him, just rather see him coach than someone else I don't care about on a team I don't care about.

 

[Sackataters]

Horny describes Corbin as a players coach. Would you describe Pop as a players coach? You have to be able to communicate, sure. But with these types of players, you have to get their respect to demand production. I don't think you can always be the nice guy.

I want a coach that can think on his feet and adjust. How frustrating it was to see Corbin only making personnel moves after it was obvious to even the most basic fan (like me).

 

[nuraman00]

Horny describes Corbin as a players coach. Would you describe Pop as a players coach? You have to be able to communicate, sure. But with these types of players, you have to get their respect to demand production. I don't think you can always be the nice guy.

I want a coach that can think on his feet and adjust. How frustrating it was to see Corbin only making personnel moves after it was obvious to even the most basic fan (like me).

I don't know. Players like playing for him. They talk about how he gives them confidence, and how they understand their role. That's got to make him a players coach to some extent, if players like playing for him.

Heck, someone who's never played for Popovich, Tyreke Evans, said he would like to play for SA and Popovich if he could.

Just because a coach isn't nice, it doesn't mean they aren't a players coach either.

 

[nuraman00]

Having said that, I won't say anything further to judge him before he coaches. I don't blame him for not being highly sought, highly regarded. He was sought, hired, and now will have a chance to show himself. Most teams aren't hiring, he was interviewed at a few that were last year and who knows if he turned down others and if he turned down some this year knowing Phoenix was interested.

While he hasn't been an assistant coach for very long, his name has never come up as one that was sought after by other teams.

And teams have been hiring coaches for years, and many didn't interview him. Teams are hiring. Just this offseason, there have been 5 vacancies filled, with five more to go (Detroit, Philadelphia, Memphis, L.A. Clippers, Milwaukee).

Last year, there were four vacancies.

Among the last 14 vacancies, he's had 2 head coaching interviews? Someone other organizations think is good, would have gotten a few more.

I'm not going to bet on him, just rather see him coach than someone else I don't care about on a team I don't care about.

Good. He can go coach on another continent, or another planet.

I hope he does better than expected because better than expected doesn't mean beating us.

Who cares if the Suns even sweep the Jazz? The goal isn't to compare oneself to one team, it's to compare oneself to 29 other teams.

A team beating another team even if a regular season series doesn't mean they're better overall, it just means they happened to win the majority of 3 or 4 games.

A 15 win team might sweep another team during the regular season, but at the end of the day, they still only had 15 wins.

It's like being glad a player that's traded away is sent to another conference. The goal is to get better the fastest, or help rebuild the fastest, not place all emphasis on a few regular season games next year. That's why I don't compare the teams involved in trades directly; I compare teams relative to all other teams that are either trying to rebuild or contend, depending on what bucket they fall in.

Suns with Hornacek vs. Jazz doesn't matter unless it's in the playoffs, and if both teams are in the playoffs, then there should be more emphasis on the Jazz outlook rather than who the opposing coach is. Milwaukee with Hornacek vs. Jazz just means 1.5 less regular season games.


I think had Hornacek gone through the D-League, or international teams, or college, there would be a greater indicator of what he could do. Right now, he just looks like a cheap hire by teams trying to keep coaching costs down (Charlotte, Phoenix).

 

[nuraman00]

Hornacek seems like he'll be like McHale or Bill Russell as a coach. They got hired because of what they did as a player, rather than prove themselves as a head coach elsewhere first, or be an assistant coach for a longer period of time, and someone who was sought after.

I think McHale, for example, is ok on defense as a coach. I haven't seen his teams enough to form an opinion about his offense. What I mean is that he's only been a head coach for 4 years, so there hasn't been enough time, with enough different players, for me to see anything special on offense. He's probably just ok, meaning good enough to coach in the league, but perhaps not distinct enough to stand out.