Harper or Machado

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Nice argument. So Harper is better at OBP and he's better at SLG...so let's combine the two so we can give him another stat he can win at...yeah, great stat. I can combine things to make Machado look like he's winning more stats too. But I like real stats. And I like that you keep ignoring the part about defense, even though I keep admitting that Harper's bat is better. But yeah, you can act like I'm the one saying things are stupid if they don't support my point.

I’m not ignoring anything. I’m disagreeing with your statement that the two players are offensively comparable. Why would I mention their defense?

“I like real stats.”

Fuckin’ lolz.

 

[Chewbaccer]

It's not like Harper is a defensive liability. He might not be a platinum glove candidate, but he's a pretty good defensive right fielder. Good range and a cannon for an arm. It's not like when the Braves stuck Evan Gattis out in left field.

Machado's defense doesn't come close to making up the difference on offense with Harper.

 

[navamind]

BA, OBP and SLG are real stats.

 

[navamind]

And just for shits and giggles...

Damn MLB stadiums and their fake stats.

 

[scoutyjones2]

 

[Sharkonabicycle]

Machado.

More consistent hitter over the years and his swing is more clean than Harper's. In addition, Machado's defense is some of the best in game, and he plays a premium position where it's hard to find that production (SS/3B flex). Harper can just as easily injure himself in RF so the comparisons are meh... Granted Machado had knee surgery (twice) but he's been playing fine since.

Harper is a bigger name and had the huge season back in 2015 and the Nats have posted better seasons in recent years. End of day I think Harper will get more money, but if I'm building a franchise I take the stud 3B who plays both sides of the ball the best in game. Easier to find a good hitting RF with okay defense.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

More consistent hitter over the years

More consistently worse.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Easier to find a good hitting RF with okay defense.

lolz

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Oh, come on, @Mike A. S. , don’t just lurk around and rate comments, come back and post more stupid shit!

“I like real stats.”

lolz

 

[Sharkonabicycle]

lolz

What's so funny? Finding a 3B/SS (currently SS) who plays lights out defense and can hit 30+ homers CONSISTENTLY is ridiculously rare. The position is much harder than RF and when compared to peers Harper's value is closer than Machado...

I mean don't get me wrong. It's a slim margin, not saying Machado is the CLEAR and EASY choice here.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

What's so funny? Finding a 3B/SS (currently SS) who plays lights out defense and can hit 30+ homers CONSISTENTLY is ridiculously rare. The position is much harder than RF and when compared to peers Harper's value is closer than Machado...

I mean don't get me wrong. It's a slim margin, not saying Machado is the CLEAR and EASY choice here.

What I found funny was referring to Harper as "good hitting."

The guy is a fucking beast at the plate. Much, much better than Machado.

 

[Sharkonabicycle]

What I found funny was referring to Harper as "good hitting."

The guy is a fucking beast at the plate. Much, much better than Machado.

Well sure I'm not saying you just run out and find a hitter comparable to Bryce Harper... but you can find something closer in comparison to what Machado does at SS. Finding a combination of Machado's batting at SS is extremely difficult. Finding a player with his batting AND defense at the position he plays is a ridiculous expectation... Correa is the only other player that comes to mind off the top of my head. Finding Harper's batting ability at RF is extremely difficult as well.

Again it's extremely close. If we're talking dedicated batting and ignore position/defense (Harper's defense is above average mind you), I'd go Harper.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Well sure I'm not saying you just run out and find a hitter comparable to Bryce Harper... but you can find something closer in comparison to what Machado does at SS. Finding a combination of Machado's batting at SS is extremely difficult. Finding a player with his batting AND defense at the position he plays is a ridiculous expectation... Correa is the only other player that comes to mind off the top of my head.

Machado's OPS last year was .782.

That would have ranked tied for sixth among qualified SS.

So, last year he didn't have a top-5 bat at SS, and he would not be winning any GG's at SS.

Then there's the point that he had two or three knee surgeries before his twenty-second birthday.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Correa is the only other player that comes to mind off the top of my head

Lindor.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Machado's OPS last year was .782.

That would have ranked tied for sixth among qualified SS.

Even if you take his last three years, his OPS was .840. Would have been #3 at SS last year.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

BA, OBP and SLG are real stats.

SLG% and OPS, although they are real stats, they overestimate power and walks... now I am not saying I don't use them... But they are really just for a glance, there are better stats out there... which you know this...


what is nice about BA and OBP is that they measure what they actually intend to measure...

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Lindor.

Seager.

 

[Mike A. S.]

Machado's OPS last year was .782.

That would have ranked tied for sixth among qualified SS.

So, last year he didn't have a top-5 bat at SS, and he would not be winning any GG's at SS.

Then there's the point that he had two or three knee surgeries before his twenty-second birthday.

So now OPS is the ONLY stat that matters to determine a batter's worth?

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

So now OPS is the ONLY stat that matters to determine a batter's worth?

No, it's not the only stat, but if you're going to pick just one of the readily available stats, it's probably the best one to go with.

Regardless, the point was that he wouldn't have been the #1 hitting or fielding SS in baseball last year. Not even top three.

I did link to Machado's full B-R.com page, as well as the SS stats on ESPN, so it's not as if I'm trying to hide or cherry pick anything. Just to help you along, though, here is where Machado's slash stats would have ranked among qualified SS last year:

AVE - 11th
OPB - 15th
SLG - 4th
OPS - 6th

Which one of those would indicate to you that he was a top five bat at SS?

 

[Mike A. S.]

No, it's not the only stat, but if you're going to pick just one of the readily available stats, it's probably the best one to go with.

Regardless, the point was that he wouldn't have been the #1 hitting or fielding SS in baseball last year. Not even top three.

I did link to Machado's full B-R.com page, as well as the SS stats on ESPN, so it's not as if I'm trying to hide or cherry pick anything. Just to help you along, though, here is where Machado's slash stats would have ranked among qualified SS last year:

AVE - 11th
OPB - 15th
SLG - 4th
OPS - 6th

Which one of those would indicate to you that he was a top five bat at SS?

Well, first of all I didn't specifically say he was. Although I will say that now because I do believe he is top-5. But you can't base his abilities off of just one year. But there are more stats than just the ones you mentioned anyway, I haven't looked at them recently so I still don't know if he would've been top 5 anyway, I'm just saying there's more to it than just those specific stats in his one most recent season.