So Urban Meyer didn't lie.

[Gatorchip]

There are tons of small college towns in the US but none seem to have remotely the issues UF has. That UGA thing is pretty small potatoes compared to the sort of stuff the UF team is getting themselves into these days.

You're right. Being drunk in public is nothing compared to assault.

Does UF get the same treatment? probably. But, I suspect some school athletes get coverups more than others.

Zero tolerance doesn't mean you overcompensate, that's just overcompensating. Zero tolerance means when you commit a crime or violate a team rule, there is no tolerance. You don't get to do it and get away with it.

I won't fight the newly erected straw man here, but to put it bluntly, you're wrong. Google it son.

 

[Across The Field]

I quoted your own fucking post where you literally said “Or perhaps the dozens of instances of her being drunk off her ass? Including coming to practices after drinking and causing scenes? Don't think maybe those might be reasons not to just automatically believe her?”. You are pawning off internet rumor where someone is too chicken shit to put their name to it and no reputable news agency is quoting as truth.

I almost always take the word of a victim at face value. I did it with all of the assaults that have happened recently at michigan State, I didn’t go straight into , “all these bitches are lying because there was no police reports, and some were reported to the police.” No I said the university is scum for enabling this disgusting slimeball.

But anonymous guy must be telling the truth.

I never said she drove drunk dozens of times, as you said I did.

I also never once have said she's lying because there are no police reports.

I've said there is no concrete evidence yet. As with most things, I think the truth lies somewhere in the middle.

Do I think he's a pile of shit who hit her? Yes. Did he deserve to get fired earlier this year? Yes. Do I wish she would've filed charges back in 2015 so we could've at least gotten to the bottom of it and fired him with cause then and he could've gone through the legal process? Yes, absolutely.

Do I also think she had major character issues? Yes. Do I think she was an innocent housewife who married a monster who relentlessly beat her without any sort of provocation? No. Do I think there were instances where she was unquestionably the antagonist? Absolutely.

Usually, where there's this much smoke on both sides, there's fire on both sides. I still think he's more at fault and should do prison time if any actual charges/convictions come from this.

That said, that's their own personal matter that will work itself out. At the end of the day, if you think Urban Meyer should get fired and the only reason is because he didn't fire Smith 3 years ago without actual legal cause, you're simply trying to get a pound of flesh and see a giant fall.

 

[oaknightshockey1]

Do you know the connection between Urban Meyer, Zach Smith & Earle Bruce? That's why nobody has talked about what you mentioned.

Seems like an awful long time for Urban to let someone ride on his coattails, regardless of who his grandfather is. Add in the off the field issues and it just seems dumb.

 

[Across The Field]

You're right. Being drunk in public is nothing compared to assault.

Does UF get the same treatment? probably. But, I suspect some school athletes get coverups more than others.


I won't fight the newly erected straw man here, but to put it bluntly, you're wrong. Google it son.

Hardly talking assault. Moreso the credit card scheme, and now half a dozen players getting into an armed altercation with a local gambler who allegedly got them cheap rental cars. Of course, there are also tons and tons of assaults at Florida over the past several years.

Bluntly, you need to google "Straw man".

Zero tolerance policies require punishment for any infraction, whether it's mild or severe punishment. Nowhere does any "zero tolerance" definition state the punishment, regardless of the infraction, must be as severe as it possibly can be. You, my friend, are the one who is wrong.

 

[THUNDER]

Urban lied.
Libs suck.
Dez caught it.

 

[WizardHawk]

Yeah, DV normally just works itself out in the end. No need for others to step in or socially call it out.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Do you know the connection between Urban Meyer, Zach Smith & Earle Bruce? That's why nobody has talked about what you mentioned.

I've got to imagine that Meyer is pretty frustrated with Smith and his shit right about now.

 

[7Samurai13]

Urban lied.
Libs suck.
Dez caught it.

Dez was on the field without a helmet and should have been penalized.

 

[Wamu]

Seems like an awful long time for Urban to let someone ride on his coattails, regardless of who his grandfather is. Add in the off the field issues and it just seems dumb.

I agree w/ you.

 

[Gatorchip]

Hardly talking assault. Moreso the credit card scheme, and now half a dozen players getting into an armed altercation with a local gambler who allegedly got them cheap rental cars. Of course, there are also tons and tons of assaults at Florida over the past several years.

Bluntly, you need to google "Straw man".

Zero tolerance policies require punishment for any infraction, whether it's mild or severe punishment. Nowhere does any "zero tolerance" definition state the punishment, regardless of the infraction, must be as severe as it possibly can be. You, my friend, are the one who is wrong.

Lesson #1:
Straw Man:
First hit on google: A straw man is a common form of argument and is an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument that was not presented by that opponent. One who engages in this fallacy is said to be "attacking a straw man."

Ok let's analyze your statements:
"Zero tolerance doesn't mean you overcompensate"
"(does not mean)...must be as severe as it possibly can be"
You erected both of those statements yourself. I did not, nor do I disagree with your statements as you have implied. It is the very definition of straw man.


Lesson #2:
Zero Tolerance:
the act of punishing all criminal or unacceptable behaviour severely, even if it is not very serious
Source: zero tolerance Meaning in the Cambridge English Dictionary

a policy of giving the most severe punishment possible to every person who commits a crime or breaks a rule
Source: Dictionary by Merriam-Webster: America's most-trusted online dictionary

Those are quite literally the first 2 things that pop up on google. Does it sound to you like the "punishment for your mistakes commensurate to what you did"? Not even close.

A zero tolerance policy would be something like SportsHoopla making a zero tolerance rule that states if you’re reported 3 times within 1 month, you get permabanned.


Then along comes one member who gets reported 3 times for spreading contact information of posters against their will.

Also, a second member is reported 3 times for spreading false rumors about another member, that cause no actual harm.


And yet both get banned. One certainty deserved it. The second poster might have, but really wasn’t a big deal.




But they both broke the rules. They get same punishment. That’s zero tolerance.

 

[Across The Field]

There were what, 9 police calls since 2009? If that was a player, they'd have been kicked off on the 2nd one.

Except for at michigan. At michigan, if you plead guilty to a felony and also plead guilty to assault and battery, you are welcomed back onto the team with open arms.

 

[Across The Field]

I disagree. Zero tolerances means severe consequences. Frequently considered unfair punishment.

Zero tolerance doesn't mean you overcompensate, that's just overcompensating. Zero tolerance means when you commit a crime or violate a team rule, there is no tolerance. You don't get to do it and get away with it.

@Gatorchip
First quote was yours. Second was mine. This is not a strawman.

 

[KingKoolKat75]

There were what, 9 police calls since 2009? If that was a player, they'd have been kicked off on the 2nd one.

“(Meyer) didn’t lie to (the media) on Media Day,” Koffel said. "(The media) asked a poor question based upon false internet reports. Get your facts straight before you ask a question like that on the record. I have the facts. I have all the police reports. Yes. Nine. You know what they are? They’re traffic violations. Six of them. Another call about an elderly man, 65-year-old, followed the assistant coach’s wife back to her house. She got spooked. Another was a well-being check on the kids. The police showed up and everything was just fine. There are no reports. There are no arrests. OK?”

Attorney for Zach Smith: ‘Who is the check and balance on the press?’ in Ohio State/Urban Meyer coverage

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Right, because if they HAD contacted her, there would be charges of intimidation and trying to get her to not press charges.

Ugh — don’t victim blame — you are way better than that.

I’m on board with Urban Meyer not losing his job. But Zach Smith is a waste of human space and the fact OSU didn’t even look into the incident or talk to his wife tells me one of two things:

1. Urban Meyer never told anyone at OSU about Zach Smith

Or

2. The athletic and compliance department is going to have a major overhaul, as many people will be losing their job for not even looking into the incident.

 

[Across The Field]

Ugh — don’t victim blame — you are way better than that.

I’m on board with Urban Meyer not losing his job. But Zach Smith is a waste of human space and the fact OSU didn’t even look into the incident or talk to his wife tells me one of two things:

1. Urban Meyer never told anyone at OSU about Zach Smith

Or

2. The athletic and compliance department is going to have a major overhaul, as many people will be losing their job for not even looking into the incident.

That wasn't even remotely victim blaming. Please stop being some 2018 media tool who just regurgitates buzz phrases when they don't apply.

How on earth do you know it's a fact they didn't look into it? If anything, it seems like the opposite is true. The police were called and nothing happened. Do you think Urban Meyer is then responsible for hiring an undercover task force to look into it or something??

 

[KingKoolKat75]

incident or talk to his wife tells me

Talk to his wife? She accused the Florida University of putting pressure on her. Why would OSU talk to her?

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

That wasn't even remotely victim blaming. Please stop being some 2018 media tool who just regurgitates buzz phrases when they don't apply.

How on earth do you know it's a fact they didn't look into it? If anything, it seems like the opposite is true. The police were called and nothing happened. Do you think Urban Meyer is then responsible for hiring an undercover task force to look into it or something??

THEY DID NOT CONTACT ZACH SMITH’S WIFE. Her lawyer just released a statement saying OSU never reached out to her.

And yes, saying the reason OSU didn’t contact the victim is because the victim would just file harassment charges is putting the blame on the victim.

 

[oaknightshockey1]

That wasn't even remotely victim blaming. Please stop being some 2018 media tool who just regurgitates buzz phrases when they don't apply.

How on earth do you know it's a fact they didn't look into it? If anything, it seems like the opposite is true. The police were called and nothing happened. Do you think Urban Meyer is then responsible for hiring an undercover task force to look into it or something??

To me it is their (OSU’s) responsibility to investigate whether or not their employee was abusing his wife. They ultimately have to make the decision whether or not to continue employing Smith, so they should gather facts to make that decision. To me, this is a pretty clear indication that something is wrong with the situation. One of two things happened:

a. OSU investigated allegations in 2015
b. OSU did not investigate allegations in 2015

Obviously (b) would be concerning, so let’s assume they did investigate. Post-investigation, they determined that Smith could continue as coach. There are two possibilities for how this could have happened:

a. Smith is clean and the accusations were unfounded
b. The accusations had merit but OSU elected to keep him employed anyways

The way I see it, in order for (a) to happen, there was evidence that Smith was not at fault. It should be relatively easy for OSU to make this information/evidence public and make this into a non-story. The fact that they have not done so yet (key word there) is what makes me think OSU could have misstepped somewhere along the way and Meyer getting in trouble is merited.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Ugh — don’t victim blame — you are way better than that.

I’m on board with Urban Meyer not losing his job. But Zach Smith is a waste of human space and the fact OSU didn’t even look into the incident or talk to his wife tells me one of two things:

1. Urban Meyer never told anyone at OSU about Zach Smith

Or

2. The athletic and compliance department is going to have a major overhaul, as many people will be losing their job for not even looking into the incident.

There is a 3rd possibility, and that is that there were no credible reports of domestic violence.

We don't have all the info. I look forward to the findings of committee.

 

[Across The Field]

THEY DID NOT CONTACT ZACH SMITH’S WIFE. Her lawyer just released a statement saying OSU never reached out to her.

And yes, saying the reason OSU didn’t contact the victim is because the victim would just file harassment charges is putting the blame on the victim.

WHY WOULD THEY CONTACT HER WHEN SHE HAD ALREADY SPOKEN TO POLICE? DO YOU BELIEVE THE ATHLETIC DEPARTMENT DOUBLES AS A DETECTIVE AGENCY?

And no, it absolutely isn't. Even you know better than that.