Yeah I am officially done with fighting in the NHL

[DaBoltsNIsles]

Edmond isn't that far from where I grew up, but I never had occasion to go there except to pass through onthe way somewhere else.

They could very well have had an ice rink kids in my neighborhood knew nothing about.

And while I'm thinking about it, OKC did have minor league hockey while he was a kid, but it didn't
when I was younger than 10.

In your defense Donovan is the first NHL player from Oklahoma.

 

[Brahmsian]

sorry if you guys already answered this. Got through a few pages of this & realized wasn't gonna go through 17 pages of same stuff said, so I just skipped to the end.
I am not a Big Hockey fan so if you tell me I know nothing I will agree.
My understanding on Enforcers though is they were there to protect your stars from being roughed up or taken out. So if this is true , my question is. If you take Fighting out altogether, wouldn't this mean your stars would start missing more games? I mean the other team takes a lesser player & wipes out your star, so the lesser plays gets the boot, but your star is out as well. Wouldn't that be a win for the other team? I guess I looked at it like Enforcers keeping teams honest.

Kinda like in football when someone goes after a teams QB, an offensive lineman shows up to say not so fast little man!

Or am I wrong about Enforcers?
Wouldn't no fighting be worse on the stars?

More suspensions of so-called "enforcers" would do more for the stars than allowing fighting does.

Believe me, most "enforcers" are LOUSY as skaters or stick-handlers. They're turnovers waiting tohappen when they get near the puck.

There are a few who have business being on the ice more than 5 minutes a game,
but they're very rare.

 

[oaknightshockey1]

More suspensions of so-called "enforcers" would do more for the stars than allowing fighting does.

Believe me, most "enforcers" are LOUSY as skaters or stick-handlers. They're turnovers waiting tohappen when they get near the puck.

There are a few who have business being on the ice more than 5 minutes a game,
but they're very rare.

the league is trending away from the enforcer who can do nothing but fight, and I think that is a good thing. there are still guys that are the team's "go-to" when someone needs to fight, but most of the new guys coming up have to be able to hold their own and provide some value outside of being a tough guy.

I will say I am completely for fighting in the NHL. a lot of the arguments you guys have used against it, while true, are NOT good arguments AGAINST fighting (sorry if any of this has been mentioned...17 pages is too much):

-someone commented that it discourages big, clean hits. of course it does, that's why they do it. the enforcer's goal is to free up space for the skill guys. if a guy lays a solid, clean hit on a star player, and then has to face the big, bad enforcer, he's gonna think twice about it before he does it again. therefore, the skill guy will have more space and the enforcer has done his job.

-someone else said that the fights are staged. they are. as it's been said before, it usually ends up being the 2 fighters for a team going at it over whatever wrong was done. you act like the guy that cheap shotted someone to prompt that gets off free...i can guarantee that's not the case. if an enforcer has to continually answer the bell for some cheap shot artist on his team, the two of them are going to be having some serious "discussions" either in the locker room or at practice.

-i think someone said something about hurting the flow of the game. again, it depends on the intentions of the fighter. sometimes it provides a boost for his team, or it can be like hitting the reset button and starting over.

 

[pixburgher66]

the league is trending away from the enforcer who can do nothing but fight, and I think that is a good thing. there are still guys that are the team's "go-to" when someone needs to fight, but most of the new guys coming up have to be able to hold their own and provide some value outside of being a tough guy.

I will say I am completely for fighting in the NHL. a lot of the arguments you guys have used against it, while true, are NOT good arguments AGAINST fighting (sorry if any of this has been mentioned...17 pages is too much):

-someone commented that it discourages big, clean hits. of course it does, that's why they do it. the enforcer's goal is to free up space for the skill guys. if a guy lays a solid, clean hit on a star player, and then has to face the big, bad enforcer, he's gonna think twice about it before he does it again. therefore, the skill guy will have more space and the enforcer has done his job.

-someone else said that the fights are staged. they are. as it's been said before, it usually ends up being the 2 fighters for a team going at it over whatever wrong was done. you act like the guy that cheap shotted someone to prompt that gets off free...i can guarantee that's not the case. if an enforcer has to continually answer the bell for some cheap shot artist on his team, the two of them are going to be having some serious "discussions" either in the locker room or at practice.

-i think someone said something about hurting the flow of the game. again, it depends on the intentions of the fighter. sometimes it provides a boost for his team, or it can be like hitting the reset button and starting over.

...players health?

 

[forty_three]

Tell that to Matt Donovan who's from Edmond, Oklahoma. He's going to be making his NHL debut tonight for the Islanders against the Devils.

California is becoming a hockey hot bed as well. There are plenty of ice rinks where kids play hockey in California.

Wait... they are finding ways to freeze water - INDOORS?

20 years ago, that may have been a factor. But not anymore. And hey, found this and it's a cool thing:
NHL Player Birth Places | Hockey-Reference.com

sorry if you guys already answered this. Got through a few pages of this & realized wasn't gonna go through 17 pages of same stuff said, so I just skipped to the end.
I am not a Big Hockey fan so if you tell me I know nothing I will agree.
My understanding on Enforcers though is they were there to protect your stars from being roughed up or taken out. So if this is true , my question is. If you take Fighting out altogether, wouldn't this mean your stars would start missing more games? I mean the other team takes a lesser player & wipes out your star, so the lesser plays gets the boot, but your star is out as well. Wouldn't that be a win for the other team? I guess I looked at it like Enforcers keeping teams honest.

Kinda like in football when someone goes after a teams QB, an offensive lineman shows up to say not so fast little man!

Or am I wrong about Enforcers?
Wouldn't no fighting be worse on the stars?

The way it started was the way you described. But like any arms race everyone now has the same weapons and they have to stage fights to justify the roster spot. Hockey needs to address useless fights and dangerous play and then fighting becomes less of a stupid sideshow and more of a natural passionate occurrence. Hockey is an intense game, and sometimes it comes to blows. Too much now for most people, and now pretty much staged for no real purpose.

In an ideal world it will be if you take a cheap shot at someone, you answer the bell. And logically if you don't want to or can't answer - you don't cheap shot someone. We're way beyond that now, unfortunately.

 

[oaknightshockey1]

...players health?

i guess i thought it was pretty obvious that not punching each other in the face was better for the players' health than punching each other in the face...and that it had probably been covered pretty thoroughly in the preceding 17 pages. i do think that there is not all that much more risk of catastrophic injury in a fight than there is in other aspects of the game, and i think the health aspect has been overstated before.

 

[IPostedWhat]

i guess i thought it was pretty obvious that not punching each other in the face was better for the players' health than punching each other in the face...

Players aren't educated enough in the medical field to understand that repeated blows to the head is not good for them or their well being.

Only about 30 years ago, Doctors use to prescribe getting punched in the head to cure common ailments such as whooping cough and being a chronic asshole.

 

[Winged_Wheel88]

Tiger catcher Avila just got drilled AGAIN for the umpteenth time in the facemask by a foul ball. He's already had a concussion this year. I immediately thought of this thread.

 

[IPostedWhat]

Tiger catcher Avila just got drilled AGAIN for the umpteenth time in the facemask by a foul ball. He's already had a concussion this year. I immediately thought of this thread.

Balls to the face is also the most common injury suffered in the pron industry.

 

[Brahmsian]

I just don't see how any of the arguments for fighting stand up anymore.

1) Self-policing? Right. Because the cheapshot artists of the NHL are worried about having to fight later? They just turtle, let their goon deal with the consequences, and cheapshot another day. And anyway, now we see fights after every big hit, clear or dirty, so it's not like these guys can make a good judgement as to what needs to be policed.

2) Popular amongst players? So what? They didn't want helmets or a salary cap either. And somehow, I'm not surprised that most of them are against a rule that would essentially put one of their teammates out of business and a career. Shocking.

3) Popular amongst fans? Again, a popular opinion is not necessarily a good one. And IPW, a self-reported voluntary survey on a website isn't exactly representative, stats 101. Also, asking just hockey fans the question doesn't really capture the possibility of people who would be fans if there wasn't fighting.

4) Hits are dangerous too, why not take it out of the game? Okay, but hitting is legal. It's a contact sport. There's a purpose to hitting other than hurting your opponent. Fighting? Not so much. And there are plenty of contact sports with high intensity that don't allow fighting. (Basically, every other one.)

I don't mind the occasional fight, but a 5 minute penalty is ridiculous. Maybe an increasing system? First time, it's a game misconduct, with suspensions of increasing length as the season goes on. After five fights, you're done for season. So you can still have your fights, and the subsequent momentum swings, but it better be worth it.

That's very similar to an idea I've had.

Many so-called "enforcers", as I'm sure I've posted elsewhere, are minimal ability types under the impression that
fighting helps them keep roster spots. Make sure that fighting or otherwise indulging in questionable behavior shortens careers even for those who don't suffer concussions could cut down the interruptions to the actual game
and improve it's flow. Genuine hockey fans would enjoy that.

 

[BadMotoWeazal]

If fighting goes away can I still use my "I went to a fight & a hockey game broke out" line????

 

[DragonfromTO]

the league is trending away from the enforcer who can do nothing but fight, and I think that is a good thing. there are still guys that are the team's "go-to" when someone needs to fight, but most of the new guys coming up have to be able to hold their own and provide some value outside of being a tough guy.

I will say I am completely for fighting in the NHL. a lot of the arguments you guys have used against it, while true, are NOT good arguments AGAINST fighting (sorry if any of this has been mentioned...17 pages is too much):

-someone commented that it discourages big, clean hits. of course it does, that's why they do it. the enforcer's goal is to free up space for the skill guys. if a guy lays a solid, clean hit on a star player, and then has to face the big, bad enforcer, he's gonna think twice about it before he does it again. therefore, the skill guy will have more space and the enforcer has done his job.

-someone else said that the fights are staged. they are. as it's been said before, it usually ends up being the 2 fighters for a team going at it over whatever wrong was done. you act like the guy that cheap shotted someone to prompt that gets off free...i can guarantee that's not the case. if an enforcer has to continually answer the bell for some cheap shot artist on his team, the two of them are going to be having some serious "discussions" either in the locker room or at practice.

-i think someone said something about hurting the flow of the game. again, it depends on the intentions of the fighter. sometimes it provides a boost for his team, or it can be like hitting the reset button and starting over.

But if the player who is strictly an enforcer is never required to "answer the bell" for a teammate's cheap shot he no longer has a purpose/role, a job or a paycheck. How angry and confrontational should he get with the teammate that indirectly provides him with those positive things in his life?

 

[mattola]

how much more does he need to take before he gets it.

Habs F Parros back on ice after season's second concussion

hes going to have a very poor after hockey life

 

[jstewismybastardson]

HEY PARROS!!! ...

 

[IPostedWhat]

I just discovered that Paul Maurice was talking about fighting in Hockey on TSN, and his experience with it over in Europe with the KHL.

Fighting is banned over there, and he said it has caused nothing but trouble and problems. A lot of skilled players are being targeted on purpose just to injure them or get them to take a penalty. He said the slashing, spearing, and cheap shots are getting out of hand, and the refs are in way over their head trying to keep it in check somehow.

Just wanted to throw that out there.

 

[Comeds]

how much more does he need to take before he gets it.

Habs F Parros back on ice after season's second concussion

hes going to have a very poor after hockey life

Watching 24CH last night and saw his two young kids. He is also a Princeton graduate so I assume he has some smarts. He needs to hang them up or change his game. I honestly don't know if he has the skills to change it or not, but I think he needs to avoid getting hit in the head.

I don't even know him well, I just hope I don't read about him having difficulties in a few years.

 

[BF4L]

how much more does he need to take before he gets it.

Habs F Parros back on ice after season's second concussion

hes going to have a very poor after hockey life

Watching 24CH last night and saw his two young kids. He is also a Princeton graduate so I assume he has some smarts. He needs to hang them up or change his game. I honestly don't know if he has the skills to change it or not, but I think he needs to avoid getting hit in the head.

I don't even know him well, I just hope I don't read about him having difficulties in a few years.

Just looked him up on Hockey Fights. He has had 6 fights this year and all are the heavy weight variety. The one against Boulton at the end was tough to see. 2 hard punches direct to the face.

Hope he is ok and changes his game. He continues on like these fights and he very well could be hurt for life.