Why didn't McCoy get traded to the Titans?

[Skin'EmAll]

Maybe I overlooked some info already posted but I'm surprised Kelly couldn't work out McCoy and the 20th overall pick for their 2nd. (Maybe more picks included)
But the eagles still would be able to be aggressive in FA and obviously draft Mariota.
...Surprised the Titans would pass on McCoy...

 

[redskinsfan]

That wouldn't come close to being reasonable. To put this in perspective, our trade from 6-to-2 represented a 1,000 difference in the trade value chart. That costed us two firsts and a second.

In contrast, a trade from 20 to 2 would be a move up of 2,150 points. That would warrant more than double the compensation we had to give up in the RGIII trade. Yes, McCoy would add to the deal if Philly wanted to trade with the Titans, but it would be still way, way short of market value for their pick.

As I've said before, there's no reasonable deal Philly can make for the Titans or Jags picks. The deal starts to get reasonable if they've got to deal with the Raiders fourth overall pick. But that would involve giving up the same picks we gave up in 2012. While the Raiders, if they were a sane and rational team, may want to take that deal, they're too in love with either Kevin White or Amari Cooper. While Cooper is the better of the two, they'd be too enamored with White's speed to pass up on him. So, realistically, we're the next in line. And if they want our pick, the RGIII batch of picks is a good starting point.

 

[Skin'EmAll]

makes a lot of sense. And thats why I still don't see why they wouldn't do a deal with the Titans.
Now we have a chance to rise from the ashes, next year from picks. throwing the kitchen sink at the titans means nothing. Helping us could cost Kelly his job. Honestly, I would have given Tennessee Foles, McCoy, The 1st-3rd. Lose nothing next year and go crazy in FA. he played his McCoy card wrong. I don't believe he couldn't get a 2nd or 3rd from anyone....this wasn't a DJAX gang fabrication.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

There are several other things you have to factor in for this type of deal. A lot of (possibly most) other teams would not want McCoy given his age & price tag. He will be 27 when the season starts. That is relatively young in general. However - with very few exceptions this is when RBs start to decline somewhat (might still be good but past their peak). This would be a more significant factor for a team like the Titans who are likely at least 2-3 years away from being contenders (a bit different than Bills situation).

Also - it is highly likely that McCoy will demand some type of extension when being traded to a lower tier team like the Titans. Lastly - we are talking about RB where teams have had great success with lesser profile, cheaper players (e.g. Morris). In this era it probably doesn't make a lot of sense to spend a fortune on the RB position (Bills see it differently). If you look at this type of trade from the Titans perspective it likely makes no sense (especially given their experience with Chris Johnson in the recent past).

 

[David_son]

Do the Titans have any Oregon Ducks on their team. If not you have your answer.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

That wouldn't come close to being reasonable. To put this in perspective, our trade from 6-to-2 represented a 1,000 difference in the trade value chart. That costed us two firsts and a second.

In contrast, a trade from 20 to 2 would be a move up of 2,150 points. That would warrant more than double the compensation we had to give up in the RGIII trade. Yes, McCoy would add to the deal if Philly wanted to trade with the Titans, but it would be still way, way short of market value for their pick.

As I've said before, there's no reasonable deal Philly can make for the Titans or Jags picks. The deal starts to get reasonable if they've got to deal with the Raiders fourth overall pick. But that would involve giving up the same picks we gave up in 2012. While the Raiders, if they were a sane and rational team, may want to take that deal, they're too in love with either Kevin White or Amari Cooper. While Cooper is the better of the two, they'd be too enamored with White's speed to pass up on him. So, realistically, we're the next in line. And if they want our pick, the RGIII batch of picks is a good starting point.

That is skewed logic. Just because the Redskins gave up that much does not mean that it was the correct move according to guidelines, charts, etc & it does not mean that other teams will make the same type of trades (let alone better ones). Do some research & you will see that the Redskins overpaid in that situation (regardless of the career of RG3 & please folks let's not use this as a starting pt for the 1000th RG3 debate).

You have to remember that these charts are guidelines and not gospel. There is also a major chance that most teams are wary of these type of trades because of the outcome of the RG3 trade. You also have to remember that the trading partner is the 2015 Eagles not the 2012 Redskins - huge difference.

I would love to see the Redskins net something like this in a trade but don't count on the fact that it will happen nor the fact that other teams like the Titans won't make a trade with the Eagles.

 

[Lonewate44]

makes a lot of sense. And thats why I still don't see why they wouldn't do a deal with the Titans.
Now we have a chance to rise from the ashes, next year from picks. throwing the kitchen sink at the titans means nothing. Helping us could cost Kelly his job. Honestly, I would have given Tennessee Foles, McCoy, The 1st-3rd. Lose nothing next year and go crazy in FA. he played his McCoy card wrong. I don't believe he couldn't get a 2nd or 3rd from anyone....this wasn't a DJAX gang fabrication.

Tenn would have been hosed taking those 2 players, and a 1st and 3rd.......that is why they didnt take the deal if offered to them!!! Neither player at this point is worth that much....Foles...Maybe a 2nd...maybe...and Mccoy...although good.....is older with a big price tag.......might be worth a 2nd...but doubtful.....so in your plan...tenn gets...a first, and 2nd to make a pick...a QB at a #2 if lucky pick and mccoy another #2 if you are being generous...so dropfrom there 3rd pick for the #20 pick, a 3rd round pick and 2 2nds.....No thanks!!!!

 

[Skin'EmAll]

Tenn would have been hosed taking those 2 players, and a 1st and 3rd.......that is why they didnt take the deal if offered to them!!! Neither player at this point is worth that much....Foles...Maybe a 2nd...maybe...and Mccoy...although good.....is older with a big price tag.......might be worth a 2nd...but doubtful.....so in your plan...tenn gets...a first, and 2nd to make a pick...a QB at a #2 if lucky pick and mccoy another #2 if you are being generous...so dropfrom there 3rd pick for the #20 pick, a 3rd round pick and 2 2nds.....No thanks!!!!

In my plan I said Tennessee would get McCoy and Foles - (who clearly showed he is above average in the pocket and even has some mobility) and philly's 1st 2nd and 3rd picks to avoid having to surrender 2016 picks.
Philly would then secure Tennessee's 2nd overall pick.

...I'm not sure how a team wouldn't jump at this...Leonard Williams is not going to be the savior there.
...The only threat in that division is the Colts, and getting two teammates that have chemistry together would have been huge. The Titans could have still landed a stud on defense at the #20 spot. IMO this was by far an EPIC FAIL. Foles, and McCoy would also have attracted FA's on the fence. Easy, easy chance to get 9 wins lost!!!

 

[Lonewate44]

In my plan I said Tennessee would get McCoy and Foles - (who clearly showed he is above average in the pocket and even has some mobility) and philly's 1st 2nd and 3rd picks to avoid having to surrender 2016 picks.
Philly would then secure Tennessee's 2nd overall pick.

...I'm not sure how a team wouldn't jump at this...Leonard Williams is not going to be the savior there.
...The only threat in that division is the Colts, and getting two teammates that have chemistry together would have been huge. The Titans could have still landed a stud on defense at the #20 spot. IMO this was by far an EPIC FAIL. Foles, and McCoy would also have attracted FA's on the fence. Easy, easy chance to get 9 wins lost!!!

I see what your saying and I say...tenn would be getting hosed.... Above is different then what you originally said...no 2nd was included you had 2 players, a 1st and 3rd....now you are saying...2 players a 1st, 2nd and 3rd round and I still say getting hosed...Foles...maybe a 2nd and Mccoy maybe a 2nd ( but doubtful)...so you are giving up 1 1st (20th at that) (3) 2nd round value picks (2 players and a pick) and a 3rd......Pretty freaking light if you ask me to move back.. Considering the age and cap # of Mccoy...and foles had 1 good year (aided by lots of dropped interceptions) and a mediocre 2nd year.....I think assigning a 2nd to eaither player is being generous

 

[Skin'EmAll]

I see what your saying and I say...tenn would be getting hosed....

How so? I weaken my competitor's ability to draft talent(Eagles). I now can establish a legit QB competition, I have a top 3 HB. And I can look at my big board and say we lost L.Williams but we like "X". We can't get him with the 20th overall but we can trade both our 2nd rounders and the 20th can draft in the 10th overall spot.
...You said Foles fell off? I think tape and o-line injuries contributed to that. He is still a good QB, however he shouldn't be running any read option.

IMO the Titans blew a chance to do a complete 180.
....Hate to jump topics but exactly how do the Eagles get Mariota now?
for example would we take their 20th overall, their 2nd and their 2016 1st rounder?

 

[skinsdad62]

In my plan I said Tennessee would get McCoy and Foles - (who clearly showed he is above average in the pocket and even has some mobility) and philly's 1st 2nd and 3rd picks to avoid having to surrender 2016 picks.
Philly would then secure Tennessee's 2nd overall pick.

...I'm not sure how a team wouldn't jump at this...Leonard Williams is not going to be the savior there.
...The only threat in that division is the Colts, and getting two teammates that have chemistry together would have been huge. The Titans could have still landed a stud on defense at the #20 spot. IMO this was by far an EPIC FAIL. Foles, and McCoy would also have attracted FA's on the fence. Easy, easy chance to get 9 wins lost!!!

i have to side with you in this trade . you get foles a solid qb you get mccoy who gave us fits plus 3 extra picks in this draft

 

[Lonewate44]

How so? I weaken my competitor's ability to draft talent(Eagles). I now can establish a legit QB competition, I have a top 3 HB. And I can look at my big board and say we lost L.Williams but we like "X". We can't get him with the 20th overall but we can trade both our 2nd rounders and the 20th can draft in the 10th overall spot.
...You said Foles fell off? I think tape and o-line injuries contributed to that. He is still a good QB, however he shouldn't be running any read option.

IMO the Titans blew a chance to do a complete 180.
....Hate to jump topics but exactly how do the Eagles get Mariota now?
for example would we take their 20th overall, their 2nd and their 2016 1st rounder?

so...you are saying.......you trade back to 20....take foles and Mccoy and the 2nd and 3rd rounder ...only to take those picks and move back to the top 10??? thats assuming that St Lousi would deal with you... why do that????? but that doesnt escape the fact, that you are taking the 20th pick, a 2nd and 3rd... and basically 2 (2nd) round picks to trade out...and my contention is.....They would be getting hosed......If Tenn believes in Mettenberger as they say.......why bring in the competition...Mccoy.....Had a serious drop off in production last year....he is 27 and has a HUGE contract.....

Foles ok..oline injuries contributed..but I say...the first year was a fluke...as far as 2 picks...I remember several picks that were dropped....factor those in and he was not as impressive....

 

[Skin'EmAll]

i have to side with you in this trade . you get foles a solid qb you get mccoy who gave us fits plus 3 extra picks in this draft

Thanks, I'm just scratching my head because the report was the Eagles were going to release McCoy but Buffalo was the only team that was willing to deal for him.

I'd gladly take my chances on Foles, McCoy and some extra picks.
But hey the Titans will get a great player in Williams

 

[Skin'EmAll]

so...you are saying.......you trade back to 20....take foles and Mccoy and the 2nd and 3rd rounder ...only to take those picks and move back to the top 10??? thats assuming that St Lousi would deal with you... why do that????? but that doesnt escape the fact, that you are taking the 20th pick, a 2nd and 3rd... and basically 2 (2nd) round picks to trade out...and my contention is.....They would be getting hosed......If Tenn believes in Mettenberger as they say.......why bring in the competition...Mccoy.....Had a serious drop off in production last year....he is 27 and has a HUGE contract.....

Foles ok..oline injuries contributed..but I say...the first year was a fluke...as far as 2 picks...I remember several picks that were dropped....factor those in and he was not as impressive....

No, I'm loading up with my picks, BUT if someone is around at 9 or 15, and I decide "we need this guy" well now the eagles have put me in a position to trade up. Here's the thing, Mettenberger has noooo chance without a run game.

....IMO the Titans could have gotten competitive quickly. If they draft defensively, how have they improved the offense? The Colts and Texans should sweep the Titans, while the Jags should split. I don't see that scenario with Foles/McCoy

 

[Lonewate44]

No, I'm loading up with my picks, BUT if someone is around at 9 or 15, and I decide "we need this guy" well now the eagles have put me in a position to trade up. Here's the thing, Mettenberger has noooo chance without a run game.

....IMO the Titans could have gotten competitive quickly. If they draft defensively, how have they improved the offense? The Colts and Texans should sweep the Titans, while the Jags should split. I don't see that scenario with Foles/McCoy

We agree to disagree on this one...To me Foles and Mcoy, with his age and contract and 1-3 picks are Not enough......I am not impressed with foles...and Mccoys age and contract to me are not worth it...butim a hard ass I guess!!!

 

[redskinsfan]

That is skewed logic. Just because the Redskins gave up that much does not mean that it was the correct move according to guidelines, charts, etc & it does not mean that other teams will make the same type of trades (let alone better ones). Do some research & you will see that the Redskins overpaid in that situation (regardless of the career of RG3 & please folks let's not use this as a starting pt for the 1000th RG3 debate).

You have to remember that these charts are guidelines and not gospel. There is also a major chance that most teams are wary of these type of trades because of the outcome of the RG3 trade. You also have to remember that the trading partner is the 2015 Eagles not the 2012 Redskins - huge difference.

I would love to see the Redskins net something like this in a trade but don't count on the fact that it will happen nor the fact that other teams like the Titans won't make a trade with the Eagles.

It really isn't. I'll agree the charts are more of a guideline than past deals. But the latter are more significant: they set the market. It's true that an outlier of a deal may be more the exception rather than the rule. But keep in mind that the two other firsts were one and two years down the road. Like the time value of money, deferred picks like that -- especially those pushed back one than a year -- carry less value. For instance, a second rounder in 2012 is worth far more than a first rounder in 2014.

And even if the trade value charts aren't as probative as you may say, that would skew in favor of the Titans (or other team's) bargaining position. They'd argue that a 20-to-2 jump is far more significant than one involving a 6-to-2 move. For that reason, they'd submit that more than double the RGIII would be coming to them. After all, such a move would be one from the top third of the first round to near the top of it.

 

[Skin'EmAll]

We agree to disagree on this one...To me Foles and Mcoy, with his age and contract and 1-3 picks are Not enough......I am not impressed with foles...and Mccoys age and contract to me are not worth it...butim a hard ass I guess!!!

Its all good, maybe this will help the Redskins!

 

[redskinsfan]

We agree to disagree on this one...To me Foles and Mcoy, with his age and contract and 1-3 picks are Not enough......I am not impressed with foles...and Mccoys age and contract to me are not worth it...butim a hard ass I guess!!!

Can I split the difference here? Foles is a pretender. He flourished two years ago because he was playing behind a great o-line and with D-Jax, Shady, and two great pass catching TEs. In 2014, when his o-line got hurt and he didn't have D-Jax, he fell apart.

As for Shady, he's still the real deal. Remember that he didn't play a whole lot in his first two years, so he hasn't lost nearly as much tread on his tires as some may believe. In his first two years, he averaged 11.7 carries a game. And he's not averaged more than 20 carries per game in his career.

 

[skinsdad62]

i dont think he fell apart . his team was 6-2 in his starts last season till he got hurt

i think anyone will take that .

 

[redskinsfan]

His team ran that record despite his performance. They were really lucky in some of those games, including ours and the Jags. They could've easily lost those two and sunk to 4-4.