POLL Who is going to win the AFC North?

[NWPATSFAN]

Well this is what I see from the Ravens...6 of their 8 wins last year came by a touchdown or less. Same with their losses last year. So while you say they could have easily won more games I see it as they could have easily lost more games. That usually shows a team that is about right where they belong. Right now I"m looking at talent added compared to talent lost and pretty much calling it a wash. Ricky Wagner is a big loss to that OL that had some shaky moments last year as is. Stanley and Yanda are about the only 2 I would trust on that OL to be anything good this year. So Flacco behind an average at best OL is not looking great. On offense Maclin is about all you really gained of note and he has lost a bit of a step. Throw in then the TE position maybe being the worst in the NFL after the suspensions/injuries. The defense in Baltimore I think can be pretty darn good but that offense is a bottom half of the league if not bottom-5 type unit this upcoming season.

So again because of good coaching and a strong defense I think they can win 8 games but that offense will continue to struggle to score points putting the defense in a bind over and over.

Some posters are such homers they have no idea how stupid they sound when they play the what if game? We could've won more games if... If we didn't have injuries... if they didn't run that trick play against us... you got to love blind homerism. They only time they quantify anything with facts is when it supports their weak argument. All other times facts don't matter.

 

[cdumler7]

Some posters are such homers they have no idea how stupid they sound when they play the what if game? We could've won more games if... If we didn't have injuries... if they didn't run that trick play against us... you got to love blind homerism. They only time they quantify anything with facts is when it supports their weak argument. All other times facts don't matter.

Agreed. I know at times I can be a blind homer about my team. At the same time it is easy to see trends and know that certain things are most likely to happen. Such as most teams when it comes to close games finish near .500 when it comes to games decided by 7 points or less. The Pats even in their last 11 games decided by a touchdown or less are 7-4. And that is with the greatest QB to ever play the game. It is why I tell Raiders fans to be careful about getting way too excited about this upcoming season as this last year they went 10-1 in such games. Most teams after such an anomaly come back to earth the next year. Broncos in 2015 went crazy in those types of games and this last year came back to earth. Biggest difference between 2015 and 2016 for the Broncos were how they did in those close games.

And yes as homers we always overestimate how much the FA/Draft picks we brought in will matter to our team. The truth is most of the time year 1 neither of those groups do a whole lot for the team. It is why I always laugh when they talk about which team "won" FA as usually that is the kiss of death on the upcoming season for a team. I don't think any of the Ravens FA signings will do a whole lot. Maclin will give them maybe 750 yards receiving if he stays healthy. Tony Jefferson can help out on defense quite a bit but other than that not seeing a whole lot of help to the defense either unless some 2nd year guys really step up big time.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Agreed. I know at times I can be a blind homer about my team. At the same time it is easy to see trends and know that certain things are most likely to happen. Such as most teams when it comes to close games finish near .500 when it comes to games decided by 7 points or less. The Pats even in their last 11 games decided by a touchdown or less are 7-4. And that is with the greatest QB to ever play the game. It is why I tell Raiders fans to be careful about getting way too excited about this upcoming season as this last year they went 10-1 in such games. Most teams after such an anomaly come back to earth the next year. Broncos in 2015 went crazy in those types of games and this last year came back to earth. Biggest difference between 2015 and 2016 for the Broncos were how they did in those close games.

And yes as homers we always overestimate how much the FA/Draft picks we brought in will matter to our team. The truth is most of the time year 1 neither of those groups do a whole lot for the team. It is why I always laugh when they talk about which team "won" FA as usually that is the kiss of death on the upcoming season for a team. I don't think any of the Ravens FA signings will do a whole lot. Maclin will give them maybe 750 yards receiving if he stays healthy. Tony Jefferson can help out on defense quite a bit but other than that not seeing a whole lot of help to the defense either unless some 2nd year guys really step up big time.

Right on. We're all homers especially when we're backed into a corner. That's part of being a fan. But blind homerism and "what if" is being an idiot. I fight tooth and nail on here about so called fans using the injury or ref card. Sorry homers it's part of the game. Just like bounces. Sometimes it bounces for you. Sometimes it doesn't.

 

[cdumler7]

Right on. We're all homers especially when we're backed into a corner. That's part of being a fan. But blind homerism and "what if" is being an idiot. I fight tooth and nail on here about so called fans using the injury or ref card. Sorry homers it's part of the game. Just like bounces. Sometimes it bounces for you. Sometimes it doesn't.

Exactly. The bounces go as they go. The reality is that the bounce went against your team and you lost. Throw in throughout the game the team made it where one bad bounce could cost them the game. Maybe they had something like 6 3-and-out drives that could have also made the difference.

As for injuries I'm one that it depends a bit on the injury. If Aaron Rodgers goes down week 1 for the Packers they go from Super Bowl contender to maybe top-10 pick with just that one injury. So a bad season i can see that easily pointing towards Rodgers being a big reason why. Losing your 3rd string TE though during training camp doesn't move the needle for me. If one injury can derail your entire season beyond some of the key positions/key players then I'm sorry you were not a very good team to begin with. Depth is just as big of a quality of a team as that of good starters. Injuries are not a matter of if but when for every team. And it is amazing how many teams with losing seasons all of a sudden had the worst luck ever injury wise. Not hard to look up games lost and by who for a team and see that injuries are not the biggest reason a team lost. Had a Raiders fan 2 years ago do that when his team had like the 3rd fewest injuries in the league. When I pointed that out somehow it switched to those were All-Pro caliber players and that is why when they were safeties on their 3rd team or a NT that only played like 40% of the snaps on defense.

 

[Dude]

Whodey gonna beat dem Bengals?
No worry they will beat themselves.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Exactly. The bounces go as they go. The reality is that the bounce went against your team and you lost. Throw in throughout the game the team made it where one bad bounce could cost them the game. Maybe they had something like 6 3-and-out drives that could have also made the difference.

As for injuries I'm one that it depends a bit on the injury. If Aaron Rodgers goes down week 1 for the Packers they go from Super Bowl contender to maybe top-10 pick with just that one injury. So a bad season i can see that easily pointing towards Rodgers being a big reason why. Losing your 3rd string TE though during training camp doesn't move the needle for me. If one injury can derail your entire season beyond some of the key positions/key players then I'm sorry you were not a very good team to begin with. Depth is just as big of a quality of a team as that of good starters. Injuries are not a matter of if but when for every team. And it is amazing how many teams with losing seasons all of a sudden had the worst luck ever injury wise. Not hard to look up games lost and by who for a team and see that injuries are not the biggest reason a team lost. Had a Raiders fan 2 years ago do that when his team had like the 3rd fewest injuries in the league. When I pointed that out somehow it switched to those were All-Pro caliber players and that is why when they were safeties on their 3rd team or a NT that only played like 40% of the snaps on defense.

I look at injuries as part of the game. Your starting QB or the 3rd string PS player. It's still a team sport. Good teams find a way to overcome.

 

[cdumler7]

I look at injuries as part of the game. Your starting QB or the 3rd string PS player. It's still a team sport. Good teams find a way to overcome.

I get that it just is that for most teams it is hard to have 2 starting caliber QB's that can do anything. It is the one position that can dictate good or bad for a team more than any other in football. You have a good QB and well good chance you are fighting for the playoffs. You don't have a QB well do whatever it takes to find one. So while I do think a team like the Pats would be ok because they have a good succession plan for Brady I don't think but maybe a couple of other teams in the league could say the same.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

I get that it just is that for most teams it is hard to have 2 starting caliber QB's that can do anything. It is the one position that can dictate good or bad for a team more than any other in football. You have a good QB and well good chance you are fighting for the playoffs. You don't have a QB well do whatever it takes to find one. So while I do think a team like the Pats would be ok because they have a good succession plan for Brady I don't think but maybe a couple of other teams in the league could say the same.

Other teams aren't run as well. What can I say. Dumb ownership and GMs hurt their teams. It's all about building a balanced roster. One player of 53 on a team sport should not take your team out of contention. That assumes they were in contention.

 

[cdumler7]

Other teams aren't run as well. What can I say. Dumb ownership and GMs hurt their teams. It's all about building a balanced roster. One player of 53 on a team sport should not take your team out of contention. That assumes they were in contention.

Well I would say the Pats haven't always had a back up I would say would continue to make them a contender though. Back in 2012 when Ryan Mallett was the back up. You lose Brady week 1 and I'm thinking that team is an 8-8 type team. Not terrible by any means but out of the playoffs.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Well I would say the Pats haven't always had a back up I would say would continue to make them a contender though. Back in 2012 when Ryan Mallett was the back up. You lose Brady week 1 and I'm thinking that team is an 8-8 type team. Not terrible by any means but out of the playoffs.

But there you go starting the would if game. We could second guess that till we die. Maybe BB makes a trade? Maybe they go run heavy? Maybe Mallett shines in that system. Heck Castle did. It's not about one player even as good as they may be. If the offense struggles the D and STs need to pick it up because likely they're on thd field more because of it.

 

[cdumler7]

But there you go starting the would if game. We could second guess that till we die. Maybe BB makes a trade? Maybe they go run heavy? Maybe Mallett shines in that system. Heck Castle did. It's not about one player even as good as they may be. If the offense struggles the D and STs need to pick it up because likely they're on thd field more because of it.

Haha as soon as I hit send I knew exactly what you would type. I guess on this we will just have to agree to disagree. To me if you lose a top-3 QB in this league it hurts big time. There have just been too few teams in the league to be able to handle such a loss and still be Super Bowl contenders. I'm not just talking about staying competitive but actual Super Bowl contenders. I look at Green Bay as a Super Bowl contender with Rodgers at the helm. They are nowhere near that without him.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Haha as soon as I hit send I knew exactly what you would type. I guess on this we will just have to agree to disagree. To me if you lose a top-3 QB in this league it hurts big time. There have just been too few teams in the league to be able to handle such a loss and still be Super Bowl contenders. I'm not just talking about staying competitive but actual Super Bowl contenders. I look at Green Bay as a Super Bowl contender with Rodgers at the helm. They are nowhere near that without him.

Well you are moving the goal posts slightly. It was never about being a SB contender.

 

[blue_suns]

On paper, it's the Steelers div. to lose.

Ravens will have a shot if they stay healthy and the offense can stay consistent and balanced for once.

idk about the Bengals other then they'll be a pain in the ass for the Ravens again

Browns are in perpetual rebuild mode so not expecting much for the moment

 

[Tubbs1518]

Yeah, I'd like to agree with you and I do if we're talking about SB challengers.

But, CIN still has a lot of talent from a team that went the playoffs 5 yrs in a row...strangely, they let some key pieces on the OL go so I'm thinking the OFC will take a few games to find some consistency and the DEF is not strong enough to carry them.

BAL, they will find a way to be competitive, but I'm not sure what they will look like on OFC.

I mean they only had a top 10 defense, only gave up 15.75 ppg after their bye week, got their 1st rounder from last year and their new starting NT plus 2 pass rushers to join that defense. But no, it's not a good defense.

 

[SteelersPride]

On paper, it's the Steelers div. to lose.

Ravens will have a shot if they stay healthy and the offense can stay consistent and balanced for once.

idk about the Bengals other then they'll be a pain in the ass for the Ravens again

Browns are in perpetual rebuild mode so not expecting much for the moment

flacco needs to cross the 60% completion percentage plateua

 

[NEhomer]

Right on. We're all homers especially when we're backed into a corner. That's part of being a fan. But blind homerism and "what if" is being an idiot. I fight tooth and nail on here about so called fans using the injury or ref card. Sorry homers it's part of the game. Just like bounces. Sometimes it bounces for you. Sometimes it doesn't.

Some injury excuses are valid and some are not. Injury to several starters in key positions is not to be compared with losing a 2nd string lineman. It's really as simple as that so save your tooth and nail. Good teams find a way to win.....um, yeah, to a degree. Some teams are better at it than others but the Raiders were finished when Carr went down last year....Cowboys were done without Dak.

 

[SteelersPride]

another thread turned into a pats thread

 

[Oldschool739]

Well this is what I see from the Ravens...6 of their 8 wins last year came by a touchdown or less. Same with their losses last year. So while you say they could have easily won more games I see it as they could have easily lost more games. That usually shows a team that is about right where they belong. Right now I"m looking at talent added compared to talent lost and pretty much calling it a wash. Ricky Wagner is a big loss to that OL that had some shaky moments last year as is. Stanley and Yanda are about the only 2 I would trust on that OL to be anything good this year. So Flacco behind an average at best OL is not looking great. On offense Maclin is about all you really gained of note and he has lost a bit of a step. Throw in then the TE position maybe being the worst in the NFL after the suspensions/injuries. The defense in Baltimore I think can be pretty darn good but that offense is a bottom half of the league if not bottom-5 type unit this upcoming season.

So again because of good coaching and a strong defense I think they can win 8 games but that offense will continue to struggle to score points putting the defense in a bind over and over.

And there you have the complete negative assumption as compared to the positive.....Now let's hear that same view about your 7-9 Broncos as I see them with virtually no proven qb at all, no Wade and no Kubes that was obviously the main ingredient of any success to talk about there....That ship has taken on some major water !!!

 

[Oldschool739]

another thread turned into a pats thread

 

[Southieinnc]

And there you have the complete negative assumption as compared to the positive.....Now let's hear that same view about your 7-9 Broncos as I see them with virtually no proven qb at all, no Wade and no Kubes that was obviously the main ingredient of any success to talk about there....That ship has taken on some major water !!!

Damn, OS. You nailed it!