What QBs are approaching all-time great status?

[Nasty_Magician]

My knock on Peyton and Warner, is they played in domes. If either of them played in the Meadowlands, Foxboro, Pitt their entire careers there is no way they put up the numbers they did and they probably suffer more injuries than they did. Some people will look past that and just go to the numbers but I can't.

I hate Eli and his window licking face, but the guy is just a winner. He makes the plays when he has to, he takes a beating both on the field and in the media, and he's won two Super Bowls without much of a running game.

 

[NinerSickness]

My knock on Peyton and Warner, is they played in domes.

That's a good point. Playing in domes is a huge statistical advantage. They're still 2 of the 5 greatest of all time IMO.

 

[TheNinerMind]

Aikman was a great quarterback. There's no lack of respect there at all. But I wouldn't put him in that greatest of great category. It speaks to his fortune and misfortune. He played in an offense that didn't force him to throw for a lot of yards or touchdowns, but didnt let him show off that talent either.

 

[fordman84]

Well, the thread is talkin' about current players, but Aikman is deservedly a HOFer. I don't know that he was a top 10 all time QB, but he was certainly a great one who came up big in the postseason.

I actually think Roger Staubach was a better QB than Aikman.

The '90's Cowboys probably had the best & deepest offensive lines of all time though. Those guys were unnaturally big, strong & fast. They had guys like Ron Stone at 4th or 5th on the depth chart.

I'm talking about the guys who have their lists including Unitas, Young, Montana, etc. An no QB does well by themselves. If you are going to discount QB's because of players around them, then Jerry Rice is going to screw over Montana and Young

 

[NinerSickness]

I'm talking about the guys who have their lists including Unitas, Young, Montana, etc. An no QB does well by themselves. If you are going to discount QB's because of players around them, then Jerry Rice is going to screw over Montana and Young

I wasn't discounting Aikman because of his players around him. That was just a random comment about the '90's Cowboys. In fact, I think the most spoiled player on that list was Warner. Nevertheless, they still have to throw the rock.

P.S. Montana won 2 SBs before Rice was even drafted (or John Taylor).

 

[threelittleturds]

I can see why you'd lose respect for Brady over the spygate stuff. But they have still gotten to the Super Bowl twice without that advantage and lost two very close games to two really good Giants teams.

It would seem spying helped them on the surface, because without it they are losing the close games in the Super Bowl instead of eeking out wins with last minute FGs. But realistically, both times Manning and one of his WRs made a miracle pass and catch big play near the end of the game to help win the game.

In my opinion the cheating obviously helped, but I don't think that takes away from Tom Brady being a great QB. It's just he is more like Elway (without Terrell Davis) instead of Montana when he doesn't have the advantages that came along with spying.

 

[NinerSickness]

I can see why you'd lose respect for Brady over the spygate stuff. But they have still gotten to the Super Bowl twice without that advantage and lost two very close games to two really good Giants teams.

It would seem spying helped them on the surface, because without it they are losing the close games in the Super Bowl instead of eeking out wins with last minute FGs. But realistically, both times Manning and one of his WRs made a miracle pass and catch big play near the end of the game to help win the game.

In my opinion the cheating obviously helped, but I don't think that takes away from Tom Brady being a great QB. It's just he is more like Elway (without Terrell Davis) instead of Montana when he doesn't have the advantages that came along with spying.

I think videotaping the opposing defense is worth the 3 points by which they won each of their 3 SBs.

If Brady only had 1 or 2 SB victories (or zero) he would't have gotten anywhere near the hype he has.

I'm not saying he's not a great QB. I'm saying his pre-2008 legacy is tainted, so you can't compare him to a QB who, by all indications, won fair & square. That's why I don't put him on any top 5-10 list.

 

[threelittleturds]

Before you mention him, I think it's impossible to cmopare Otto Graham to SB era QBs, but he was amazing too. And I think Elway, Marino & Favre are 3 of the most overrated QBs of all time. I'd take the super-efficient, accurate, quick release of Kurt Warner over them any day.

With all the rule changes put in place to help these QBs today, I kind of find it hard to compare them to even the guys in the 80s and 90s. The guys like Montana, Marino, Elway, Young, Favre and Aikman took some serious hits throughout the season.

While in today's league it is practically illegal to even hit the quarterback hard. That gives these guys a pretty big advantage, and it reflects in the stats. Shit, Marino might have thrown for 6000 yards and 60 TDs if he played in an NFL where you couldn't hit him or touch his WRs.

 

[Nasty_Magician]

With all the rule changes put in place to help these QBs today, I kind of find it hard to compare them to even the guys in the 80s and 90s. The guys like Montana, Marino, Elway, Young, Favre and Aikman took some serious hits throughout the season.

While in today's league it is practically illegal to even hit the quarterback hard. That gives these guys a pretty big advantage, and it reflects in the stats. Shit, Marino might have thrown for 6000 yards and 60 TDs if he played in an NFL where you couldn't hit him or touch his WRs.

That's very true. How many more completions do they get with guys going over the middle, compared to back in the day when safeties were decapitating anyone who came across the middle.

 

[grayghost668]

the bullshit about the cheating is piss poor,almost every team does this,the Patsys just got caught,besides the use of a camera does not help you throw the ball

 

[NinerSickness]

the bullshit about the cheating is piss poor,almost every team does this,the Patsys just got caught,besides the use of a camera does not help you throw the ball

Thus is the battle cry of every cheater. "Everyone does it. I don't have a shred of proof everyone does it, but take my ever so reliable word for it. They do. So my cheating is ok."

-The Patriots*

 

[Bemular]

With all the rule changes put in place to help these QBs today, I kind of find it hard to compare them to even the guys in the 80s and 90s. The guys like Montana, Marino, Elway, Young, Favre and Aikman took some serious hits throughout the season.

While in today's league it is practically illegal to even hit the quarterback hard. That gives these guys a pretty big advantage, and it reflects in the stats. Shit, Marino might have thrown for 6000 yards and 60 TDs if he played in an NFL where you couldn't hit him or touch his WRs.

The rule changes have benefitted the QB's of today measurably. And when you consider for whom the two biggest rule changes were made and who was complicit in making those changes it adds a degree of hilarity to all of it.

 

[Bemular]

Thus is the battle cry of every cheater. "Everyone does it. I don't have a shred of proof everyone does it, but take my ever so reliable word for it. They do. So my cheating is ok."

-The Patriots*

I can't get behind your love affair with Eli Manning (at least not yet anyway) But I can certainly get behind this post - Well said, NinerSickness!

 

[NinerSickness]

The rule changes have benefitted the QB's of today measurably. And when you consider for whom the two biggest rule changes were made and who was complicit in making those changes it adds a degree of hilarity to all of it.

That's why you really have to look at a QB's numbers against the average. Kind of like how you can only look at a pitcher's ERA against the average.

 

[BINGO]

I'm very offended that Stafford isn't on this list.

I was about to include Cam Newton...and Stafford as well!

 

[mem49er]

I was about to include Cam Newton...and Stafford as well!

I'm very offended that Stafford isn't on this list.

Luck, RGIII, Barkley and Bray.

 

[Kinzu]

I was about to include Cam Newton...and Stafford as well!

Stafford is off to a great start. He probably had the most low-key 5,000 yards passing in a season ever recorded at only 23 years old. It was also I believe his first season he played all 16 games. He is going to make mistakes though as he is a gunslinger who will trust his arm to make throws that are sometimes not there, but as long as he has Megatron to throw to he will put up stupid numbers in the passing game.

If he and Knowshon had stayed at Georgia for AJ Green's sophomore year they probably would have won National Title.

 

[grayghost668]

Thus is the battle cry of every cheater. "Everyone does it. I don't have a shred of proof everyone does it, but take my ever so reliable word for it. They do. So my cheating is ok."

-The Patriots*

I am not a Patsys fan but Brady still has to make those throws and you can scream cheater cheater until doomsday,,,,no one but Brady made the throws to the recievers,when they make a camera that can get on the field and play the game maybe then you have a gripe,so don't hand me the crap about cheating,,,,and his numbers are as good now as they ever were,no the video taping doesn't complete any passing attemps,,,,,,you and anyone else who wants to scream cheater can go right ahead,it doesn't change the fact that Brady is the best or at least a top 5 QB of all time

 

[Voltaire26]

I'm very offended that Stafford isn't on this list.

Six straight Super Bowl wins with the Detroit Lions (oops I looked into the future):caked:

 

[MHSL82]

Manning (Peyton)
Montana
Unitas
Warner
Young

Montana
Bradshaw ( 4 SB wins in 6 years I don't think it will ever be topped }
Brady
Farve

I'm very offended that Stafford isn't on this list.

No votes for Aikman?

I was about to include Cam Newton...and Stafford as well!

Luck, RGIII, Barkley and Bray.

And Alex Smith!

(Crickets)

Hello?