Series Thread: WCF: Golden State Warriors vs San Antonio Spurs

[tlance]

Not really. It was still only one other suitor who was out of the running fairly quickly.

Obviously, until it was done, it could have always been nixed. If memory serves, Love had a no trade clause, so he could have said "Nah, don't want to go to Cleveland" (at the time, Love going to the Lakers as an FA was seen as almost a "done deal" by several GM's).

But, how likely is it that he would choose to stay in Minny and lose when he could go to Cleveland and have a legit shot at a ring? Especially since he could have left via FA after the first season if he didn't like his experience there.

Looking back on it, it was actually Love who held all of the cards, not the Cavs or Wolves. Perhaps I have underestimated the value of a UCLA education? lol

All I am saying here is that there are a lot trade rumors where you hear the deal is basically "done" and then it falls apart at the last minute. Happens all the time. Either another team offers more, or one of the parties gets cold feet. No deal is done until finalized by both teams.

Also, love probably made a gentlemen's agreement to resign in Cleveland, but he could have backed out if he wanted to. Nothing was in ink and he had a rough first year. Signing in Cleveland was a bit of a risk for LeBron even though they had the assets to build an immediate contender.

 

[gordontrue]

All I am saying here is that there are a lot trade rumors where you hear the deal is basically "done" and then it falls apart at the last minute. Happens all the time. Either another team offers more, or one of the parties gets cold feet. No deal is done until finalized by both teams.

Also, love probably made a gentlemen's agreement to resign in Cleveland, but he could have backed out if he wanted to. Nothing was in ink and he had a rough first year. Signing in Cleveland was a bit of a risk for LeBron even though they had the assets to build an immediate contender.

Yep. In fact, this forum was full of people saying it was a bad idea and that CLE shouldn't trade Wiggins for Love.

 

[Heatles84]

Yep. In fact, this forum was full of people saying it was a bad idea and that CLE shouldn't trade Wiggins for Love.

Well......Love is not a good major piece to have against Golden St. and that's likely going to be your Finals opponent for the foreseeable future. He had one good game against them last series and that was it.

In the short term, yes, Love was a good move for the Cavs. In the long term once Wiggins maturates in the NBA and gets better and Lebron has retired, there will be that moment where Cavs fans go "we traded that guy away".

 

[gordontrue]

Well......Love is not a good major piece to have against Golden St. and that's likely going to be your Finals opponent for the foreseeable future. He had one good game against them last series and that was it.

In the short term, yes, Love was a good move for the Cavs. In the long term once Wiggins maturates in the NBA and gets better and Lebron has retired, there will be that moment where Cavs fans go "we traded that guy away".

I'm not trying to get into whether that move made sense or not (I think it as easily the correct move).

My point is that the fact that people thought it was a bad move sort of flies in the face of the narrative that LeBron was going back to an established super team. He obviously knew the Cavs had assets and that his presence would attract people --- but the makeup of the team was not certain outside of LeBron & Kyrie when he commited to coming back.

 

[Heatles84]

I'm not trying to get into whether that move made sense or not (I think it as easily the correct move).

My point is that the fact that people thought it was a bad move sort of flies in the face of the narrative that LeBron was going back to an established super team. He obviously knew the Cavs had assets and that his presence would attract people --- but the makeup of the team was not certain outside of LeBron & Kyrie when he commited to coming back.

They obviously weren't established. But given the landscape and no other team had 3 super starts, at least in the East. They were and are the very definition of a super team comparative to the rest of the league. And for weeks leading up to Lebron's decision, major media outlets like ESPN were reporting that Love was likely heading to Cleveland if Lebron were to go back as they had assets to throw at Minnesota.

 

[gordontrue]

They obviously weren't established. But given the landscape and no other team had 3 super starts, at least in the East. They were and are the very definition of a super team comparative to the rest of the league. And for weeks leading up to Lebron's decision, major media outlets like ESPN were reporting that Love was likely heading to Cleveland if Lebron were to go back as they had assets to throw at Minnesota.

I mean, I think they are a super team now. No way do I think that was the perception when LeBron went back. I'm curious to go back and see what the perception on here was. People knew LeBron would make them an instant contender... but there was also a lot of questioning Kyrie and Love (and whether the Cavs should even give up Wiggins for Love).

 

[trojanfan12]

All I am saying here is that there are a lot trade rumors where you hear the deal is basically "done" and then it falls apart at the last minute. Happens all the time. Either another team offers more, or one of the parties gets cold feet. No deal is done until finalized by both teams.

Also, love probably made a gentlemen's agreement to resign in Cleveland, but he could have backed out if he wanted to. Nothing was in ink and he had a rough first year. Signing in Cleveland was a bit of a risk for LeBron even though they had the assets to build an immediate contender.

I agree that it was more of a risk than when he went to Miami because there were more moving parts and the potential for one of those parts to screw everything up was there until everyone signed (including having to wait out the season to lock up Love on a longer deal). When he went to Miami, pretty much everything was set up for 4 years via FA and all of the main players were already on board from the start.

When Lebron returned to Cleveland, all of the key moves had likely been agreed to "in principle" and Lebron obviously felt comfortable enough that everything would work out that he went ahead and signed. If didn't, he never would have signed.

So, there was more risk in his return to Cleveland, but that risk was the difference between a sure thing and an almost sure thing.

 

[trojanfan12]

I mean, I think they are a super team now. No way do I think that was the perception when LeBron went back. I'm curious to go back and see what the perception on here was. People knew LeBron would make them an instant contender... but there was also a lot of questioning Kyrie and Love (and whether the Cavs should even give up Wiggins for Love).

Actually, the perception was that they were a super team as soon as everything was put together. Until that happened, they were a "potential super team." lol

 

[Heatles84]

I mean, I think they are a super team now. No way do I think that was the perception when LeBron went back. I'm curious to go back and see what the perception on here was. People knew LeBron would make them an instant contender... but there was also a lot of questioning Kyrie and Love (and whether the Cavs should even give up Wiggins for Love).

We all knew that the Cavs would be the likely number 1 team in the East - we thought they would face minimal resistance (although we didn't think it would be this bad). The general consensus is that Lebron would be truly tested in June - which seems to remain true going on 3 years later.

I thought it was a mistake for Love given that Wiggins has the higher upside and for the Warriors he's more valuable given the small ball lineups that Golden St. is so effective with where Love seems to sometime be on an island. Having said that, fully aware that Cleveland's in win now mode and at the time you didn't know what you were going to get with Wiggins and that getting a an established all star player was key for Lebron.

 

[Heatles84]

It's official. No Kawhi for game 3 tonight.

Crazy that it's looking like Golden St. and Cleveland will go to the Finals undefeated.

 

[gordontrue]

It's official. No Kawhi for game 3 tonight.

Crazy that it's looking like Golden St. and Cleveland will go to the Finals undefeated.

Damn

 

[Hornsstampede2.0]

has there ever been a team more lucky than Golden State??
We talk about all the teams that Cleveland plays....but at least those teams are healthy

GS has played exactly 2 healthy teams in this entire 3 year run
And they went (1-1)

Although some might suggest "LUCK" means something else when it comes to Zasa Pachulia and his 10 year record of questionable plays.

I fully expect Cleveland to lose a key player to injury versus Boston.

 

[tlance]

It's official. No Kawhi for game 3 tonight.

Crazy that it's looking like Golden St. and Cleveland will go to the Finals undefeated.

Wow. That really sucks about Kawhi. I Can't say I am shocked, but the fact he has been ruled out so early makes me think we probably won't see him in game 4 either.

I know the playoffs have not been great, but wow, what a Finals. Honestly, I won't even care if THAT is a sweep. We know that the two teams promised to meet are legitimate powerhouses.

I have heard many people say that great teams require great rivals. It doesn't get much better than this. The only thing lacking is decades of history like the Celtics/Lakers rivalry.

 

[tlance]

has there ever been a team more lucky than Golden State??
We talk about all the teams that Cleveland plays....but at least those teams are healthy

GS has played exactly 2 healthy teams in this entire 3 year run
And they went (1-1)

Although some might suggest "LUCK" means something else when it comes to Zasa Pachulia and his 10 year record of questionable plays.

I fully expect Cleveland to lose a key player to injury versus Boston.

Cmon man.

Kawhi's injury sucks. But, who is fully healthy this time of year?

Just this season, Durant, Iggy, Barnes, Livingston and Pachulia have all missed time. That is through 10 games. The Warriors also were hit hard by the injury bug last season.

Injuries happen. A Spurs fan calling the Warriors entire run lucky just sounds like sour grapes. Every team has luck, both good and bad during championship runs. Kind of like when Amare Stoudamire and Diaw got suspended in the 2007 conference Finals.

 

[Shanemansj13]

No Kawhi lol. Warriors couldnt get it any easier

 

[Shanemansj13]

Cmon man.

Kawhi's injury sucks. But, who is fully healthy this time of year?

Just this season, Durant, Iggy, Barnes, Livingston and Pachulia have all missed time. That is through 10 games. The Warriors also were hit hard by the injury bug last season.

Injuries happen. A Spurs fan calling the Warriors entire run lucky just sounds like sour grapes. Every team has luck, both good and bad during championship runs. Kind of like when Amare Stoudamire and Diaw got suspended in the 2007 conference Finals.

Well the Warriors have avoided key and huge injuries the past 3 years. They continue to beat unhealthy teams, it isnt their fault but there is always luck involved with that sort of thing. Who knows what happens two years ago if teams were healthy. Who know what happens if Kawhi is healthy, I would venture to say it would be a long series anc I would take the Spurs to win. Lucky is definitely the word but doesnt need to be used as an excuse.

 

[Four4Four]

Welp Kawhi is out for tonight. No sense on watching another debacle

 

[Heatles84]

Wow. That really sucks about Kawhi. I Can't say I am shocked, but the fact he has been ruled out so early makes me think we probably won't see him in game 4 either.

I know the playoffs have not been great, but wow, what a Finals. Honestly, I won't even care if THAT is a sweep. We know that the two teams promised to meet are legitimate powerhouses.

I have heard many people say that great teams require great rivals. It doesn't get much better than this. The only thing lacking is decades of history like the Celtics/Lakers rivalry.

Yeah it seems like Cavs Warriors are shaping up to be identical in that respect. Having said that, there's no way the Cavs or the Warriors are going to sweep the other opponent in the Finals. Warriors have too many weapons to be swept, and the Cavs have Lebron. If Lebron somehow sweeps the Warriors (fully healthy no suspensions), I'm putting him 1b with Jordan.

 

[DorianRo]

Leonard out again? Well they didn't have a shot at the warrior anyways but he should have at least tried and go this game. THIS is their season essentially.

If Spurs pick up CP3 it may be their time though. They are a piece away still. At least to get by GS. I think they can beat the Cavs without that extra piece. But they will never get by the Warriors without someone like CP3 joining them

 

[trojanfan12]

Injuries happen. A Spurs fan calling the Warriors entire run lucky just sounds like sour grapes. Every team has luck, both good and bad during championship runs. Kind of like when Amare Stoudamire and Diaw got suspended in the 2007 conference Finals.

^^^This^^^

Luck is part of every single championship. Sometimes, it's just being lucky enough to get to the finals with everyone healthy, sometimes it's the opponents not having everyone healthy, a lucky shot (or missed shot) here and there.

Last year, the Cavs were lucky that Bogut got hurt and Dray is an idiot. The year before, the Warriors were lucky that Kyrie and Love got hurt.

Whatever it might be, luck is always part of the equation.