Top 14 NHL defensemen (NHL.com)

[Hank Kingsley]

I'd give him Subban's spot.

That's why they don't let you have a vote.

 

[DaBoltsNIsles]

That's why they don't let you have a vote.

Pietrangelo is a complete player. Subban needs to work a bit on the Defense part.

 

[Hank Kingsley]

Pietrangelo is a complete player. Subban needs to work a bit on the Defense part.

But obvoiusly not as good or he'd be ranked higher in this poll.....

Norris scoreboard: 1-0 Subban

Big buck contract: 1-0 Subban

 

[Slimpikins]

Vlasic should be higher. Before he got hurt the Sharks had the Kings beat. Hedman has no business in the top 10. Pietrangelo should be in the top 5. I'd give him Subban's spot.

Vlasic was phenomenal last year. Heads above any other Sharks defenseman and he was on the top pair of Canada's gold winning olympic team. He lacks offense and he's not a flashy player so he gets overlooked a lot.

I don't think he's a top five dman but I think an argument can be made for top ten.

 

[KennyBanyeah]

That's why they don't let you have a vote.

Pietrangelo is a complete player. Subban needs to work a bit on the Defense part.

Subban's overall impact on the game is much more positive than Pietrangelo's. Pietro's defensive abilities are highlighted by a purely defensive system. He's a fantastic player but he doesn't take over games like Subban can.

The single most desirable asset for any skater in the NHL is to create offense. Goals are hard to come by. Subban creates goals plain and simple.

 

[Hank Kingsley]

Subban's overall impact on the game is much more positive than Pietrangelo's. Pietro's defensive abilities are highlighted by a purely defensive system. He's a fantastic player but he doesn't take over games like Subban can.

The single most desirable asset for any skater in the NHL is to create offense. Goals are hard to come by. Subban creates goals plain and simple.

Merci.

 

[DaBoltsNIsles]

But obvoiusly not as good or he'd be ranked higher in this poll.....

Norris scoreboard: 1-0 Subban

Big buck contract: 1-0 Subban

The Norris Trophy is strictly for the top offensive defenseman every year. The year Subban won it he led all defenseman in points. Which is why he won it.

 

[DaBoltsNIsles]

Subban's overall impact on the game is much more positive than Pietrangelo's. Pietro's defensive abilities are highlighted by a purely defensive system. He's a fantastic player but he doesn't take over games like Subban can.

The single most desirable asset for any skater in the NHL is to create offense. Goals are hard to come by. Subban creates goals plain and simple.

It's all about the system the player is in. If Hitchcock was coaching the Habs, Subban wouldn't be putting up the same numbers.

 

[Comeds]

It's all about the system the player is in. If Hitchcock was coaching the Habs, Subban wouldn't be putting up the same numbers.

Well that finishes that debate.

 

[Oldtom]

1. Drew Doughty, Los Angeles Kings
2. Shea Weber, Nashville Predators
3. Zdeno Chara, Boston Bruins
4. Duncan Keith, Chicago Blackhawks
5. P.K. Subban, Montreal Canadiens
6. Erik Karlsson, Ottawa Senators
7. Alex Pietrangelo, St. Louis Blues
8. Ryan Suter, Minnesota Wild
9. Mark Giordano, Calgary Flames
10. Victor Hedman, Tampa Bay Lightning
11. Ryan McDonagh, New York Rangers
12. Oliver Ekman-Larsson, Arizona Coyotes
13. Marc-Edouard Vlasic, San Jose Sharks
14. Niklas Kronwall, Detroit Red Wings


Going down this list - 1 Doughty, 2 Weber, (Chara's lucky to make the top 15 based on last season's performance - where's Johnny Boychuk, where's Seabrook, where's Methot?) - I'd probably slide the #4 and #5 up one, and put Boychuk at #5, Suter at #6, McDonough at #7, Vlassic at #8, Seabrook at #9, (Hedman is a bad joke - not even in the top 25), Giordano at #10, Methot at #11 - Kjalmarson at # 12, Ekman- Larsonn #13, Pietrangelo #14, Chara #15, Karlsson #16, Kronwall fits in at about #20. Petry would be outside the top 25, too.

 

[Hank Kingsley]

The Norris Trophy is strictly for the top offensive defenseman every year. The year Subban won it he led all defenseman in points. Which is why he won it.

I fail to see that it matters.

He won it.

Deal with it.

Probably going to win more.

 

[DaBoltsNIsles]

I fail to see that it matters.

He won it.

Deal with it.

Probably going to win more.

It matters in this regard. The Norris has become a joke to me. It doesn't matter if a defenseman actually plays defense anymore. All the people who vote on the award care about is how many points they produce. So the glorified forward will win the Norris every year. It's like all the so called experts on prospects who have Griffin Reinhart low on their list. He's not going to put up numbers like Karlsson, but he's going to be a nightmare for forwards to play against.

 

[DragonfromTO]

It matters in this regard. The Norris has become a joke to me. It doesn't matter if a defenseman actually plays defense anymore. All the people who vote on the award care about is how many points they produce. So the glorified forward will win the Norris every year. It's like all the so called experts on prospects who have Griffin Reinhart low on their list. He's not going to put up numbers like Karlsson, but he's going to be a nightmare for forwards to play against.

The reason people are dropping Griffin Reinhart is because even defensemen who are strong in their own end but end up not putting up a ton of offense in the NHL usually put up big point numbers in the CHL. I haven't looked lately but traditionally it's been pretty tough to find a defenseman playing in a team's top 4 in the NHL (let alone top pair) who didn't score a lot in the CHL.

 

[Hank Kingsley]

It matters in this regard. The Norris has become a joke to me. It doesn't matter if a defenseman actually plays defense anymore. All the people who vote on the award care about is how many points they produce. So the glorified forward will win the Norris every year. It's like all the so called experts on prospects who have Griffin Reinhart low on their list. He's not going to put up numbers like Karlsson, but he's going to be a nightmare for forwards to play against.

Well fuck the Norris then.

I'm not losing any sleep over it.

I don't think the MVP should be the guy who won the Art Ross either.

I'm just glad PK is on Montreal.

 

[Oldtom]

Seem to be a fair few that don't like PK? - when Doughty, Keith and Chara are 'way worse with the cheap shots - not to mention little Doogie Hamilton, who will never even be mentioned in the Norris wimplefutz, ever.

 

[DaBoltsNIsles]

The reason people are dropping Griffin Reinhart is because even defensemen who are strong in their own end but end up not putting up a ton of offense in the NHL usually put up big point numbers in the CHL. I haven't looked lately but traditionally it's been pretty tough to find a defenseman playing in a team's top 4 in the NHL (let alone top pair) who didn't score a lot in the CHL.

All I know is according to Arthur Staple of Newsday, Reinhart is a lock to make the Isles opening night roster.

 

[DragonfromTO]

All I know is according to Arthur Staple of Newsday, Reinhart is a lock to make the Isles opening night roster.

Which really seems to me to tell us very little about how good he'll end up being. It tells us that the Islanders' decision makers like him right now (and possibly that Arthur Staple has good enough connections to have that information passed to him), which isn't entirely meaningless. But we'll have to see what happens. Like I said before, defensemen that aren't able to put up points in the CHL (especially in their post-draft years) historically tend to have trouble becoming serious impact players in the NHL. Which is why I always shake my head when teams draft a D and tell us "he doesn't have much offense but he's a good stay-at-home guy in the CHL"... a guy who's limited as a good stay-at-home guy in the CHL has a tendency to top out as a stay-in-the-AHL guy at the next level.

 

[Darkstone42]

The classic stay-at-home guys in the NHL have their place, but even their defensive value, to me, is overstated. I want a guy who can get the puck out of the defensive zone and moving the other way. There is a lot of defensive value to a good skater and puck mover for just that reason, and while Subban, for example, may not necessarily pass the defensive eyeball test, it is quite clear, especially in the numbers, that he is really good at making sure play doesn't stay in his own end for very long.

You can break up passes and block shots all day long, but if you can't exit the zone, or if you have to settle for just dumping the puck back to the other team in the neutral zone, how much good have you really done your team?

 

[DragonfromTO]

The classic stay-at-home guys in the NHL have their place, but even their defensive value, to me, is overstated. I want a guy who can get the puck out of the defensive zone and moving the other way. There is a lot of defensive value to a good skater and puck mover for just that reason, and while Subban, for example, may not necessarily pass the defensive eyeball test, it is quite clear, especially in the numbers, that he is really good at making sure play doesn't stay in his own end for very long.

You can break up passes and block shots all day long, but if you can't exit the zone, or if you have to settle for just dumping the puck back to the other team in the neutral zone, how much good have you really done your team?

I remember hearing some random story about an argument where someone employed by an organization pointed out that you could count the number of "hits" Lidstrom had been credited with at the halfway point of that season on one hand and someone else in the org didn't believe him. Can't remember the exact details obviously, I'll have to search for it.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

The classic stay-at-home guys in the NHL have their place, but even their defensive value, to me, is overstated. I want a guy who can get the puck out of the defensive zone and moving the other way. There is a lot of defensive value to a good skater and puck mover for just that reason, and while Subban, for example, may not necessarily pass the defensive eyeball test, it is quite clear, especially in the numbers, that he is really good at making sure play doesn't stay in his own end for very long.

You can break up passes and block shots all day long, but if you can't exit the zone, or if you have to settle for just dumping the puck back to the other team in the neutral zone, how much good have you really done your team?

Watch a videography of the Leafs' 2013-14 season and you will have your answer.