Series Thread: tOfficial Mariners 2019 Season Thread

[wazzu31]

I don't like or dislike Jerry as a GM and he has been an improvement over Jack Z and Bill Bavasi, although that's not saying much. I think the way he phrased things was just a PR move. Who the fuck wants to hear the sad truth that the Mariners might contend in 2021 if everything goes right and that 2022 is realistically our best chance?

Every situation is different and I don't think the Mariners should try to copy whatever X or Y team did. We're different from the Royals because we have more money to spend. The Red Sox and Yankees are different because they are able to throw mountains of money at players and every international prospect wants to sign with either of them.

I think Jerry is a pompous prick which doesn't make him any more likable, but as I said I don't think things will go as expected by 2021 and he'll finally get the axe. Whoever replaces him will just need not to fuck up with the pieces in place by then and the amount of money available to spend. I just don't want to see a situation where we go all out and overpay in free agency and end up right back where we were last season with a bunch of bloated contracts bogging us down.

Every situation is different, I’ll grant you that typically but there are teams tanking left and right because they saw how successful the Astros and to a lesser extent the Cubs. You are right in the teams if they don’t have to model themselves but how the farm system is currently set (except really Rodriguez) Every key piece to the success or failure of Jerry’s tenure is in either high A or AA much like the Royals.

I just don’t like how condescending he is when he is pressed with questions and how he essentially called every highly reputable baseball outlet or person fake news when he is asked a question he doesn’t like. I get it that he played in the big leagues and worked his way into a General Manager’s spot but that doesn’t mean he is so much smarter and more knowledgeable about the sport of baseball than any person that questions him. There is no perfect this or that for the game, as I’ve said in another thread Moneyball has been given so much credit for changing the landscape of baseball except a franchise going strictly off of moneyball has never won the World Series or to my knowledge even made one.

 

[wazzu31]

Sounds like Tampa Bay pulled off a quickie yesterday having two pitchers on the field at the same time. LOL Boston protested the remainder of the game after Tampa had a pitcher on the hill and another pitcher playing 1st base ready to take over for the mound pitcher. Against the rules?? Umps weren't sure about the situation so the play continued under the Sox's protest. Must have been a first for the MLB no doubt. BTW - Tampa won the game 3-2.

I remember Lou did that at Fenway one time putting Jeff Nelson in left field while some lefty came into pitch.

 

[mcnabb7542]

You guys have a much better handle on what the future is for Jerry/Mariners and I respect all your opinions (whether I like them or not). LOL I guess the nostalgia of the last couple weeks with Gar getting into the HOF and seeing Lou, Griffey the Bone etc. has put me in a pissy mood about the M's organization screwing fans over year after year. Hiring Jerry and now hearing MAYBE after 7 years on the job we "might" have a post season team just makes me mad and disgusted with the whole situation. Seattle deserves better than that IMO. But, it is what it is, and if I don't like it.....tough shit on me.

Yeah but the one thing that has kept coming up during this reunion tour is how they talk about when Lou came in and changed the culture, this right there is what is going to help these kids Dip has been stock piling. Not saying drag Lou out of his shag apartment, but get a manger in here that will create a winning culture and not sit in the dugout managing from what is computer is telling him to do.

 

[mcnabb7542]

Sometimes we wish for our star guys to go out in a blaze of glory, hell when Jr came back I was more and more hurt watching him struggle and be a quarter of the player he use to be. Felix needs to be released and no there shouldn't be one of those "well he's our guy contracts" end the relationship and move on to an up and comer.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Every situation is different, I’ll grant you that typically but there are teams tanking left and right because they saw how successful the Astros and to a lesser extent the Cubs. You are right in the teams if they don’t have to model themselves but how the farm system is currently set (except really Rodriguez) Every key piece to the success or failure of Jerry’s tenure is in either high A or AA much like the Royals.

I just don’t like how condescending he is when he is pressed with questions and how he essentially called every highly reputable baseball outlet or person fake news when he is asked a question he doesn’t like. I get it that he played in the big leagues and worked his way into a General Manager’s spot but that doesn’t mean he is so much smarter and more knowledgeable about the sport of baseball than any person that questions him. There is no perfect this or that for the game, as I’ve said in another thread Moneyball has been given so much credit for changing the landscape of baseball except a franchise going strictly off of moneyball has never won the World Series or to my knowledge even made one.

One of the issues with tanking like that is that in the case of the Astros they're going to have so many contract extensions coming up that they realistically won't be able to afford them all. The Cubs on the other hand likely have the money for that.

I agree on Jerry's personality. In hindsight the trade for Marco Gonzales has worked out well for us, but at the time it didn't appear to make all that much sense and when faced with criticism he gave off that exact attitude you described. He acted as if he's above criticism and anyone who disagreed with him is stupid.

When it comes to Moneyball I think it depends on how you define it. Obviously you need to spend, but you also need to find good value in players. I know it's Apples and Oranges but to a certain extent the Seahawks did that by signing Cliff Avril and Michael Bennett to cheap, prove it deals. When I think of Moneyball I think you can't 100% commit to having a low-payroll roster and just rely on somehow finding underrated players, but finding cheap underrated players should obviously be a priority that is subsidized by rewarding those guys and continuing to improve the roster through other means.

 

[NWinAZ]

When it comes to Moneyball I think it depends on how you define it. Obviously you need to spend, but you also need to find good value in players. I know it's Apples and Oranges but to a certain extent the Seahawks did that by signing Cliff Avril and Michael Bennett to cheap, prove it deals. When I think of Moneyball I think you can't 100% commit to having a low-payroll roster and just rely on somehow finding underrated players, but finding cheap underrated players should obviously be a priority that is subsidized by rewarding those guys and continuing to improve the roster through other means.

100%.

 

[Duders]

I hope to hell the M's don't lose this game with Detroit. Kikuchi pulled top of 7th. Gave up a couple bombs earlier. M's haven't been able to produce anything so far. Going into the bottom of the 7th Detroit leading 2-0. Tigers have worse record in all the MLB

 

[wazzu31]

Yeah but the one thing that has kept coming up during this reunion tour is how they talk about when Lou came in and changed the culture, this right there is what is going to help these kids Dip has been stock piling. Not saying drag Lou out of his shag apartment, but get a manger in here that will create a winning culture and not sit in the dugout managing from what is computer is telling him to do.

If remember correctly it was the perfect pairing of Lou demanding better while Jay Buhner also took a role in being a vocal leader as he despised coming to Seattle and seeing the goal of the players was a .500 record. Lou seemed to be able to get the best out of players in Cincinnati and Seattle, just he got unlucky that Woody made dumb trades and Pat Gillick either didn’t have the support from upper management or actually lived up to his moniker of stand pat. I know Lou begged for a LF his whole career and he finally got a good young player in Cruz Jr but Woody dealt him for scrub relievers.

Unfortunately managers like Lou are dinosaurs. It doesn’t seem managers any longer are guys who try to motivate his players, his job is read and do what people that think baseball is a math equation say to do.

 

[mcnabb7542]

If remember correctly it was the perfect pairing of Lou demanding better while Jay Buhner also took a role in being a vocal leader as he despised coming to Seattle and seeing the goal of the players was a .500 record. Lou seemed to be able to get the best out of players in Cincinnati and Seattle, just he got unlucky that Woody made dumb trades and Pat Gillick either didn’t have the support from upper management or actually lived up to his moniker of stand pat. I know Lou begged for a LF his whole career and he finally got a good young player in Cruz Jr but Woody dealt him for scrub relievers.

Unfortunately managers like Lou are dinosaurs. It doesn’t seem managers any longer are guys who try to motivate his players, his job is read and do what people that think baseball is a math equation say to do.

I think Cora plays a little old school with his players, Boone has flashes of it ( wait did I just name to mangers of teams that are in contention that roll a little old school managerial style)

I understand the game is going away from that. Its a new world where folks have to be sensitive to others now.

 

[PolarVortex]

Jeff McNeil is a hitting machine and now he is starting to add a little power to his game. If only we could have gotten him from the Mets.

Of course, if we had gotten him from the Mets, he'd be hitting .237 for us with 18 RBI. Amirite?

 

[NWinAZ]

Jeff McNeil is a hitting machine and now he is starting to add a little power to his game. If only we could have gotten him from the Mets.

Of course, if we had gotten him from the Mets, he'd be hitting .237 for us with 18 RBI. Amirite?

Or Pete Alonso and his 31 homers at age 24...

 

[seahawksfan234]

I hope to hell the M's don't lose this game with Detroit. Kikuchi pulled top of 7th. Gave up a couple bombs earlier. M's haven't been able to produce anything so far. Going into the bottom of the 7th Detroit leading 2-0. Tigers have worse record in all the MLB

That was actually one of the few games I watched attentively last night. Was nice to be able to enjoy a game by the Mariners for once.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Jeff McNeil is a hitting machine and now he is starting to add a little power to his game. If only we could have gotten him from the Mets.

Of course, if we had gotten him from the Mets, he'd be hitting .237 for us with 18 RBI. Amirite?

Funny thing is he was initially included in the deal but when rumors of that emerged, the Mets fanbase erupted and he was pulled. Not sure how that impacted the other aspects of the trade though.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Or Pete Alonso and his 31 homers at age 24...

I'm still happy with the deal. Kelenic will be a star, Justin Dunn has really figured it out and shooting up prospect rankings and we rid ourselves of most of Cano's contract. Would've been amazing if we had landed Pete Alonso or Jeff McNeil, but personally I don't think the Mets would've departed with Alonso even with hindsight being 20/20.

 

[seahawksfan234]

I know it's a really small sample size, but what does everyone think of Austin Nola? He has been a career minor league journeyman but he has played really well in his stint with the Mariners so far hitting .322/.365/.559 and just hit a triple. He seemingly can also play just about every position. In the minors + majors he has played 30+ games at 1B, SS, 3B and C.

 

[NWinAZ]

I know it's a really small sample size, but what does everyone think of Austin Nola? He has been a career minor league journeyman but he has played really well in his stint with the Mariners so far hitting .322/.365/.559 and just hit a triple. He seemingly can also play just about every position. In the minors + majors he has played 30+ games at 1B, SS, 3B and C.

He doesn't look overwhelmed in the majors which I love. After watching Romine last year and Moore this year try and play the utility role, Nola looks legit. And to have a utility guy (or maybe more) play catcher, that is huge to me on what you can do with your roster. I hope he sticks.

 

[NWinAZ]

I'm still happy with the deal. Kelenic will be a star, Justin Dunn has really figured it out and shooting up prospect rankings and we rid ourselves of most of Cano's contract. Would've been amazing if we had landed Pete Alonso or Jeff McNeil, but personally I don't think the Mets would've departed with Alonso even with hindsight being 20/20.

I know it was just me dreaming of being on the other side of making the right trade after watching years of asking for Pettitte and getting Hitchcock, or turning down Posada and getting Russ Davis. It would have been nice to have another Buhner-esque trade which is talked about positively decades later. I mean what IF we added Paxto to that deal and got McNeil and Alonso instead of the Yankee deal? Oh what it would be like to see things through the eyes of a winning franchise just once.

 

[NWinAZ]

Not sure if mentioned on here, but we claimed Keon Broxton the ex-Brewer twice removed. This is the kind of move I love. If you can figure out that one thing holding his immense talent back, you hit a homer with this move. Bruxton for Twins finally put it together this year and I think the two have a lot in common. Crossing fingers.

 

[mcnabb7542]

I know it was just me dreaming of being on the other side of making the right trade after watching years of asking for Pettitte and getting Hitchcock, or turning down Posada and getting Russ Davis. It would have been nice to have another Buhner-esque trade which is talked about positively decades later. I mean what IF we added Paxto to that deal and got McNeil and Alonso instead of the Yankee deal? Oh what it would be like to see things through the eyes of a winning franchise just once.

Russ Davis


Though I am going to throw this out there cause its come up with the Lou talk, we need to remember Dan Wilson came over from the Reds where Lou came from, as much as I would love to blame the front office on every crappy move, I think this one might be on Lou, since he already had "his" catcher the Posada deal never came to life

 

[mcnabb7542]

Felix pushed to 60 day DL there done with him.