The PAC12 THREAD v.2

[seahawksfan234]

This is a long read but worth it if you have time to read it. Posted by one of the folks on a Stanford board I frequent. Raises the question of how much of this goes on outside the SEC?

Meet the Bag Man: How to buy college football players, in the words of a man who delivers the money - SBNation.com

Didn't read the article, but I have a good idea of what it is about just based on the title since I've read a lot on this topic before. I believe illegal benefits are extremely frequent all throughout the largest programs, I don't believe it is limited to the SEC. I would assume there is a huge correlation between program size/expectations to win and illegal benefits.

Not sure if this is included in the interview, but most schools (including UW) do just about everything possible to get these guys to pass their classes and graduate, even creating classes a toddler could pass.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Still here... Suppose to leave tonight but I don't know if I want to get on the plane!
This place sucks you in and slows everything down, I've never just sat and watched a sunset every night like I did here....

I don't blame you man. Hope your vacation was awesome! We have actually had some pretty good weather these past few games, so hopefully your drive home from Sea-Tac won't be too bad.

 

[seahawksfan234]

He did just fine in his first 2 seasons. He kept his mouth shut, coached his team and had the 2nd best overall record over his 1st two seasons in USC history.

I think USC being ranked #1 going into his 3rd season went to his head and things started falling apart in the pre-season when he decided that he had enough "juice" to ban a writer who was a total USC homer for asking about an injury was a good idea. The media turned on him, he kept doing and saying more stupid things which just created more negativity. Then he started using the sanctions as an excuse which no one bought.

I think Kiffin is a very good OC, recruiter and QB coach. However, he's shown himself to be a terrible head coach. He's just not a leader like that.

It's like Saban said when he hired him as his OC "The things that caused problems for him in the past are not things that he's going to be asked to do at Alabama".

He did okay his first two seasons. I say that because in 2011 he had 12-0 type talent IMO, but blew it against ASU and barely lost against Stanford.

You're right that his 3rd season was where things really fell apart. Once again, I personally thought USC had national championship type talent on the roster, but we all know how things went that year.

I can't speak to Kiffin's abilities outside of HCing, but I thought that he was a terrible hire to begin with.

 

[mrwallace2ku]

Sup Pacnutz?


FEAR THE BEAVER!

 

[trojanfan12]

He did okay his first two seasons. I say that because in 2011 he had 12-0 type talent IMO, but blew it against ASU and barely lost against Stanford.

You're right that his 3rd season was where things really fell apart. Once again, I personally thought USC had national championship type talent on the roster, but we all know how things went that year.

I can't speak to Kiffin's abilities outside of HCing, but I thought that he was a terrible hire to begin with.

No one thought he was the best hire when Garrett brought him in. I think Garrett was trying to replace Carroll with someone who was a big part of that run and Kiffin was there for most of it. Carroll was an extremely unpopular hire when Garrett hired him and I think that he thought he could duplicate that hire with Kiffin.

As for NC level talent for his 1st two seasons, yes and no on that. When the sanctions were handed down part of the deal was that players could transfer without losing any eligibility and could play immediately. As a result, USC lost several key players and recruits. Kiffin did a good job in keeping the de-commits and transfers from getting too out of hand, but there were definite losses that hurt, especially in the first season.

In the 2nd season, the team started kind of slow, but hit their stride and by the end of the season was in the conversation for the best team in the country. That, coupled with beating Oregon at Autzen and taking Stanford to OT is what got us the pre-season #1 and we all saw what happened from there.

 

[WizardHawk]

Watched the Pac12's one hour replay of the Apple Cup this morning. Sark's last game on our sideline. As much as I was pissed at how he left, I now just watched that game and was overall happy it was his last. No anger, just at peace with the fact he wasn't worthy of the title of UW head coach to begin with and with his timing of departure we ended up finding someone truly worthy of it. Things have a way of working out for the better in the end and that's exactly what happened in this case.

Oh and watching Leach and his many faces in defeat was worth it too.

 

[Vitamike]

He did okay his first two seasons. I say that because in 2011 he had 12-0 type talent IMO, but blew it against ASU and barely lost against Stanford.

You're right that his 3rd season was where things really fell apart. Once again, I personally thought USC had national championship type talent on the roster, but we all know how things went that year.

I can't speak to Kiffin's abilities outside of HCing, but I thought that he was a terrible hire to begin with.

Truth be told, Kiffin outperformed my expectations when he was hired.

 

[UtahUte]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iaboCvSOOzs

Live action today! Go Utes!

 

[mcnabb7542]

so hopefully your drive home from Sea-Tac won't be too bad.

We actually flew out of Portland and returned there as well. ( I did bitch it was cold outside when we got outside) It actually is cheaper to catch a flight out of PDX then Sea Tac...

 

[mcnabb7542]

I believe illegal benefits are extremely frequent all throughout the largest programs, I don't believe it is limited to the SEC. I would assume there is a huge correlation between program size/expectations to win and illegal benefits.

I find it amazing that fans don't believe this is going on more and more with all programs. It's kinda like the whole debate, " oh no he doesn't use steroids!" Plu---ssssee! I cheer for my teams and I'm not naive to the way they get there...

Budda I will read it, I like reading stuff like that cause folks can be naive to things in life...

 

[trojanfan12]

Truth be told, Kiffin outperformed my expectations when he was hired.

I think in a few years, he'll be looked at a little differently and will at least get credit for getting us through most of the sanction years in much better shape than most thought was possible.

 

[mcnabb7542]

Vegas has the Ducks 5-1 winning it all this year.

Talk about the kiss of death before a season even starts....

 

[TheLonestarDUCK]

Vegas has the Ducks 5-1 winning it all this year.

Talk about the kiss of death before a season even starts....

However it is nice to walk into the living room of a recruit and use things of this nature, plus being only one of two programs in the last six years that started the year ranked and ended the year ranked.

Oh and beating the ever living dog shit out of that team up north ten years and counting. Sorry for the pun

 

[ugafan6612]

GO CAL!!!!

 

[trojanfan12]

Vegas has the Ducks 5-1 winning it all this year.

Talk about the kiss of death before a season even starts....

Kiss of death isn't official until OD guarantees a "natty on a platter".

 

[WizardHawk]

Kiss of death isn't official until OD guarantees a "natty on a platter".

I'm not sure if that still works since his lobotomy. Whatever happened when he went to the time out toilet bowl left him without that edge. I don't know if his curse is still in tact after it.

 

[mcnabb7542]

Oh and beating the ever living dog shit out of that team up north ten years and counting. Sorry for the pun

I don't know bragging about wins against Willingdone and 7 win Sark .....

 

[mcnabb7542]

Kiss of death isn't official until OD guarantees a "natty on a platter".

I'm sure he 'll get that feeling once August comes around.....

 

[seahawksfan234]

No one thought he was the best hire when Garrett brought him in. I think Garrett was trying to replace Carroll with someone who was a big part of that run and Kiffin was there for most of it. Carroll was an extremely unpopular hire when Garrett hired him and I think that he thought he could duplicate that hire with Kiffin.

Even prior to the hire I thought it was terrible. Kiffin was garbage with the Raiders and the Volunteers only improved modestly during his first season there. As a college football fan I always liked watching USC play, which was why I thought the hiring was such a shame.

Some were skeptical of Carroll's ability as an NFL coach when the Seahawks hired him. For whatever reason his 27-21 record with the Patriots in the late 90s was supposed to be evidence he couldn't coach at the NFL level, when in reality he never had a losing season in New England. It is easy to say the Carroll hiring didn't look bad in hindsight, but I don't understand why the hiring was unpopular. But then again, USC fans are always expecting the huge name. Sort of like how the Sark hiring was semi-unpopular when I think with USC's talent Sark can do well.

As for NC level talent for his 1st two seasons, yes and no on that. When the sanctions were handed down part of the deal was that players could transfer without losing any eligibility and could play immediately. As a result, USC lost several key players and recruits. Kiffin did a good job in keeping the de-commits and transfers from getting too out of hand, but there were definite losses that hurt, especially in the first season.

In the 2nd season, the team started kind of slow, but hit their stride and by the end of the season was in the conversation for the best team in the country. That, coupled with beating Oregon at Autzen and taking Stanford to OT is what got us the pre-season #1 and we all saw what happened from there.

I'm probably still just overrating Matt Barkley's ability, but I thought that team was capable of great things.

 

[seahawksfan234]

We actually flew out of Portland and returned there as well. ( I did bitch it was cold outside when we got outside) It actually is cheaper to catch a flight out of PDX then Sea Tac...

When we got back from Sea-Tac and got in the cab I was absolutely freezing and the cab driver left the window down for some reason. My flight from Orlando to Seattle stopped in Chicago and it was overcast there so I got to have a bit of adjustment before coming back to Seattle.

I find it amazing that fans don't believe this is going on more and more with all programs. It's kinda like the whole debate, " oh no he doesn't use steroids!" Plu---ssssee! I cheer for my teams and I'm not naive to the way they get there...

Budda I will read it, I like reading stuff like that cause folks can be naive to things in life...

I think a lot of fans just ignore it or believe it is limited to very rare occasions at few programs when in reality the benefits athletes receive are extensive and not just limited to cash.

These reasons are why I think David Shaw should be considered one of the top coaches in the country. The fact that Stanford's graduation rate is so high and the team performs so well when Stanford is unlikely to provide the benefits to football players other schools would is incredibly impressive. The phantom GPA booster classes in African American studies are unlikely to exist at Stanford.