The Official 2014 Lions Draft Thread

[Thruthefog]

Had to get this thread to 800.

Carry on.

 

[Coach_Ed_LPW]

but I believe he was there because of how weak our CBs were outside of Chris Houston.

So you've declared them weak after one(injury filled) year.

I believe Mayhew knows he is on shaky ground as the GM and if the Lions have another year like 2012, he could be looking for a new job.

Thats really laughable. I don't think Mayhew is on shaky ground at all. Most people realize that last year's 8 losses by a TD or less could have easily went the other way had the entire defensive backfield and receiving corps been ravaged by injuries. Mayhew started with only Calvin and has started to build a nice team around him, that takes time but the Lions are most certainly headed in the right direction.

I don't think it was a coincidence the Lions drafted DE, CB, OL, DE, P, WR, Blocking TE, LB. It was the first year Detroit actually drafted needs. IMO, the only two picks the Lions made that can truly be considered BPA were Ansah and Riddick. Even the Ansah pick could be argued.

Totally agree with you here Mike D. 2012's draft of a T,Wr,2 LB's, 3Corners, and a DE did not fill needs at all.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Thats really laughable. I don't think Mayhew is on shaky ground at all. Most people realize that last year's 8 losses by a TD or less could have easily went the other way had the entire defensive backfield and receiving corps been ravaged by injuries. Mayhew started with only Calvin and has started to build a nice team around him, that takes time but the Lions are most certainly headed in the right direction.

I will try and find the interview in the Free Press with Mayhew. Might be tough, as for some reason, older articles in the Freep are removed or they say it can't be found in the archive. In the interview though -- Mayhew readily admitted he was on the hot seat and the Lions must improve. He also admitted the Lions needed to get more production out of their draft picks.

I will try and find it this afternoon.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

So you've declared them weak after one(injury filled) year.

i declared them weak because just like everyone else outside of the Lions fans who refuse to admit it -- they are weak at CB.

all the lions did last year by drafting a CB in the 3rd, 5th and 6th round is draft quantity over quality, with the hopes of hitting on one of the picks.

if detroit was confident with their stable of CBs -- Darius Slay wouldn't have even been on the Lions draft board (IMO -- have to throw that in, or the literal fans get upset)

 

[tpaulus_2]

You certainly have interesting opinions, that's for sure. From what I can see you're the type who doesn't let any evidence influence them at all... once you make a snap decision on something then that's that, it's settled and set in stone...

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

You certainly have interesting opinions, that's for sure. From what I can see you're the type who doesn't let any evidence influence them at all... once you make a snap decision on something then that's that, it's settled and set in stone...

what snap decisions have i made, out of curiosity?

 

[Vader]

it's now being reported that Slay had surgery to fix the knee. while that is a minor operation the trend from the Lions to draft players with injuries is disturbing

 

[Coach_Ed_LPW]

i declared them weak because just like everyone else outside of the Lions fans who refuse to admit it -- they are weak at CB.

Greenwood is weak....yet you've never seen him play. SMH

 

[Coach_Ed_LPW]

what snap decisions have i made, out of curiosity?

Ummm IDK....declaring a guy weak without ever seeing him play...or after 4 games...

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Greenwood is weak....yet you've never seen him play. SMH

you can shake your head all you'd like. greenwood played in the MIAA, which is basically glorified high school football. the last time a player from the MIAA was drafted in the NFL was 1967. he was drafted on nothing more than the numbers he put up at Michigan's pro day.

he is a project player, who the Lions hope they can teach how to play CB. here is the writeup on Greenwood from the National Football Post about him after the East/West Shrine game:

Possesses a tall, physically put together frame. Looks the part and exhibits good straight-line speed. Has a good first step and can run well as a linear athlete. However, isn't real natural in his drop. Isn't real quick footed, is a bit tighter in and out of his breaks and is slow to quickly re-direct and close. Looks leggy trying to change directions and gives up a ton of separation vs. the jump in competition at the East/West Shrine game. Doesn't do a great job identifying routes and is too often slow to reach the receiver out of his breaks.

Impression: A good looking kid who can run and warrants a spot in a camp. Better athlete than football player at this stage as he struggles to sit low and quickly get out of his breaks.

If Greenwood contributes for the Lions -- I think it will be on special teams and maybe as a 5th CB. If he does contribute on the field as a CB, it won't be for quite some time IMO. Missing out on the year of practices doesn't help him cause either, as it could have helped him get acclimated to the enormous change in athletes he will be covering at the WR position.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Ummm IDK....declaring a guy weak without ever seeing him play...or after 4 games...

I said the jury is still out on Bentley. I also gave my reasons why I didn't like Bentley when they drafted him. He only weighed 176 lbs, at 5'10" he tied for the lowest vertical at the combine with a guy from Wayne State and in the one event at the combine you want to see a CB excel on -- the shuttle, which tests your burst in a short area, Bentley finished last at 4.50. The CB with the next worst time was 4.28.

At his size, i think he will struggle against the run. I think what he will end up being for the Lions is a nickel back who comes in for passing situations. I just don't think he could handle being an every down starter at CB right now and after his 1st 4 games, while he was the best option the Lions had last year, he struggled mightily in those 4 games.

Could he develop into a solid option at CB? Yes. I don't think he is there right now though. Do I believe Darius Slay is a much better option to start opposite Chris Houston? Absolutely. Slay is bigger, stronger, faster and played against elite competition on a game to game basis in college in the SEC.

 

[tpaulus_2]

you can shake your head all you'd like. greenwood played in the MIAA, which is basically glorified high school football. the last time a player from the MIAA was drafted in the NFL was 1967. he was drafted on nothing more than the numbers he put up at Michigan's pro day.

he is a project player, who the Lions hope they can teach how to play CB. here is the writeup on Greenwood from the National Football Post about him after the East/West Shrine game:



If Greenwood contributes for the Lions -- I think it will be on special teams and maybe as a 5th CB. If he does contribute on the field as a CB, it won't be for quite some time IMO. Missing out on the year of practices doesn't help him cause either, as it could have helped him get acclimated to the enormous change in athletes he will be covering at the WR position.

That one source that you're apparently basing all of your criticism of Greenwood on is the polar opposite of pretty much everything else that was out there last year. The part about him being leggy and having tight hips especially stands out as Mayhew went out of his way to talk about what a fluid athlete he was for a guy his size and how smooth his hips were when he transitioned to run with the WR.

Of course you gravitated towards the one negative piece of press you could dig up though...

 

[tpaulus_2]

He only weighed 176 lbs

He weighed in at 182 at the combine.

5 lbs isn't much, but this is a classic tactic of yours- constantly trying to make our players seem just a little worse than they really are if it furthers your argument.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

He weighed in at 182 at the combine.

5 lbs isn't much, but this is a classic tactic of yours- constantly trying to make our players seem just a little worse than they really are if it furthers your argument.

I apologize -- he was listed as 176 on numerous sites. I even made sure to put 176, instead of 175, because I didn't want to get a post like this from you.

Doesn't change the fact, at 182, he is still going to struggle against physical receivers. Also doesn't change the fact he tied for the worst vertical at the combine and had the slowest shuttle drill time by a wide margin.

 

[tpaulus_2]

Yeah, we never should draft guys based on their play... just pick whomever does the best at the combine, obviously.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

That one source that you're apparently basing all of your criticism of Greenwood on is the polar opposite of pretty much everything else that was out there last year. The part about him being leggy and having tight hips especially stands out as Mayhew went out of his way to talk about what a fluid athlete he was for a guy his size and how smooth his hips were when he transitioned to run with the WR.

Of course you gravitated towards the one negative piece of press you could dig up though...

TP -- The MIAA is basically high school football. It is a league made up of private colleges. You have two types of players who go to these schools (the cost is 20-40,000 a year depending on which school you go to -- at least the one's in Michigan):

1. you have parents with alot of money and they don't mind spending it on a private school education. football is secondary.

2. you have really poor parents and qualify for a boatload of financial aid and you are strapped with a ton of student loans when you are done.

In case you forgot -- I transferred to a MIAA school because of my girlfriend and finished out my last 2 years of eligibility for football. The school I went to had 900 students TOTAL. In 2 years -- I racked up over 30,000 in student loans (no such thing as an athletic scholarship in D-3). My high school football team could have given my college team a run for its money, that is how poor the competition was.

Now maybe it has changed over the last 10 years or so, as I haven't stepped foot on my old campus since I graduated. But the fact the last player to be drafted from a MIAA school tells you the quality of competition he faced. It also goes right down the line -- He didn't have elite coaching, didn't have elite facilities, didn't have elite training staffs.

Could he develop into a starting CB? Sure. Will it happen any time soon? IMO, no way. It will take the Lions alot of time to develop his technique and the general understanding needed for the CB position, which he didn't get in college. It will also take him a lot of time to get acclimated to the speed of the game and the elite athletes he will be trying to cover, as it is something he didn't come close to seeing in college.

 

[tpaulus_2]

You're trying to sell the one point that I wasn't even arguing against. He played DIII, obviously that makes him a long-shot right from the get-go.

My comment was that the article you referenced differs greatly from the majority of the others on his athletic ability, especially as it pertains to playing CB...

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Yeah, we never should draft guys based on their play... just pick whomever does the best at the combine, obviously.

If you are going to base it on their play -- Chris Greenwood should have been drafted in the 1st round. He was a shutdown corner at Albion and named defensive player of the year in the MIAA.

What you seem to be forgetting is -- players can look great on tape until you realize they aren't facing the talent level of players at the top schools and divisions.

There is a big difference from the SEC, Big 12, Big 10, etc. than there is at Louisiana-Lafayette.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

My comment was that the article you referenced differs greatly from the majority of the others on his athletic ability, especially as it pertains to playing CB...

he was drafted on nothing more than his athletic ability. he wasn't drafted based on his ability to play CB at a high level, because the Lions have no way of knowing if he can, as he faced D-3 players all thru college. he was not only bigger and stronger than anyone he faced, but MUCH faster.

 

[Coach_Ed_LPW]

I'm glad I wore my waders