Ted Ginn resigned

[iHATEdodgers]

That doesn't really answer the question.

I beg to differ. The video of Williams breaking a 56 yarded shows exactly what people see in him as a WR. #1 he can catch (very important attribute) #2 he has blazing speed.

 

[maniax]

Here's a stat I just read on Ginn, amazing stat:

In two seasons with the 49ers, Ginn hasn't lost a fumble on either a kickoff or punt return.

I wish I could say the same about Kyle Williams.

We'll draft a rookie WR hopefully high so Kyle Williams may be fighting for a roster spot, or we keep 6 WRs with Ginn as a return specialist.


I'm gonna go with we keep 6 WRs on the roster.

Moss, Crabtree, Manningham, Williams, Ginn, rookie. Suddenly WR position is looking deep.

 

[DoobieKeebler]

Those are the kinds of plays where Ginn is valuable, but there are others. Did you see how far the DB was off him on a slant (think it was a slant) in the playoff game against the Saints where he got the first down?

He's a good weapon to have, IMO, but Kyle hasn't proven anything to me yet (except that he's a good route runner & shouldn't be allowed within 500 yards of a punt).

Yes, but Ginn shows difficulty in catching balls thrown at him.

I used "at" because I believe having a ball thrown "to" you involves it being moderately within reach. Alex doesn't have great deep ball accuracy, but Ginn has worse route running abilities. I'm thinking of the game (forget who they were playing) where Ginn completely missed 2 deep balls that would have been TDs. And we must not forget his stone-hands.

 

[NinerSickness]

I beg to differ. The video of Williams breaking a 56 yarded shows exactly what people see in him as a WR. #1 he can catch (very important attribute) #2 he has blazing speed.

So one play convinced you Kyle Williams will be a good WR?

 

[iHATEdodgers]

So one play convinced you Kyle Williams will be a good WR?

Don't be obtuse. You asked for evidence, evidence has been provided. The play typifies in some people's minds Williams' ability and potential. It shouldn't be necessary for me to spell that out for you.

 

[NinerSickness]

Don't be obtuse. You asked for evidence, evidence has been provided. The play typifies in some people's minds Williams' ability and potential. It shouldn't be necessary for me to spell that out for you.

You say don't be obtuce, but you just confirmed my doubt in your rationale in the bold. "The play typifies."

I'm not asking for what actual plays he's made in the pro's necessarily; it could be that, but it's one of the only big plays he's made in 2 seasons with the Niners. That's why the arguement is lacking. Also, in 2 playoff games where he was essentially a starting WR due to injuries, he had 2 catches for 12 yards. That doens't exactly scream "good."

You cited blazing speed. I wouldn't exactly call his speed "blazing." He's fast. Yes. But fast for a small NFL WR? I don't know about that. Ginn has "blazing speed." Desean Jackson and Mike Wallace have blazing speed. Kyle Williams actually looks like he has average speed for a tiny WR NFL WR (5'10, 186).

He "can catch" as you put it. Really? He has 21 career receptions. That's not a large enough sample to determine how good his hands are.

What else do people see? Because I haven't really seen anything to show he'll be a a good WR.

 

[Bemular]

Just another important piece of last years success put back in place - I am glad this worked out.

So we now have Moss; Manningham; Crabtree; Williams; Ginn; Bogan and Hastings, not to mention any additions from the draft all competing for essentially two prominent spots on our WR squad. I get a strong sense that Michael Crabtree's foot will be just super duper this entire off-season.

 

[tallglassofwater007]

Here's a stat I just read on Ginn, amazing stat:

In two seasons with the 49ers, Ginn hasn't lost a fumble on either a kickoff or punt return.

I wish I could say the same about Kyle Williams.

We'll draft a rookie WR hopefully high so Kyle Williams may be fighting for a roster spot, or we keep 6 WRs with Ginn as a return specialist.


I'm gonna go with we keep 6 WRs on the roster.

Moss, Crabtree, Manningham, Williams, Ginn, rookie. Suddenly WR position is looking deep.

He may not have fumbled but a ball did bounce off his face for an interception.

i find it hard to forgive kyle williams after his two fumbles that cost us the chance to go to the super bowl...But ginn is more important to the team cause of the field position ginn gave us last year.I'm sorry but williams got to go....

You gotta take the emotion out of it. Would you have cut Roger Craig after fumbling in 91?? I get that he was established, but you are basing your wanting Williams gone because you can't forgive him for a bad game.

Williams, in his limited time last year showed that he is already a better receiver than Ginn. The only play I remember Ginn making on offense all year was called back for a penalty. Williams had the great TD against the Rams showing his speed on a good route. He made a nice catch for a TD vs Dallas. And a nice route for a TD vs the Cards.

Williams had 20 catches and 14 of them were for first downs. Ginn has hit his ceiling already. I think Williams can be a really good receiver in this league.

 

[iHATEdodgers]

You say don't be obtuce, but you just confirmed my doubt in your rationale in the bold. "The play typifies."

I'm not asking for what actual plays he's made in the pro's necessarily; it could be that, but it's one of the only big plays he's made in 2 seasons with the Niners. That's why the arguement is lacking. Also, in 2 playoff games where he was essentially a starting WR due to injuries, he had 2 catches for 12 yards. That doens't exactly scream "good."

You cited blazing speed. I wouldn't exactly call his speed "blazing." He's fast. Yes. But fast for a small NFL WR? I don't know about that. Ginn has "blazing speed." Desean Jackson and Mike Wallace have blazing speed. Kyle Williams actually looks like he has average speed for a tiny WR NFL WR (5'10, 186).

He "can catch" as you put it. Really? He has 21 career receptions. That's not a large enough sample to determine how good his hands are.

What else do people see? Because I haven't really seen anything to show he'll be a a good WR.

Geezus man - I'm pointing out what most people are talking about when they say Williams is a good WR or that he has potential. Which is why I said that one play typifies in some people's minds what Williams brings to the table. Just trying to clue you in on what people see in him that you don't. Big play ability, good hands, blazing speed.

You can't hold his stats against him - being reasonable that is - he's a 6th rounder with 2 seasons under his belt, he's shown what he can do in limited time -and it's more than Ginn can offer as a WR.

That 56 yarder disagrees with your assessment of his speed. And yes Ginn has blazing speed but his hands are suspect - which is why most people would disagree with your assessment of Ginn vs Williams.

 

[NinerSickness]

You can't hold his stats against him - being reasonable that is - he's a 6th rounder with 2 seasons under his belt, he's shown what he can do in limited time -and it's more than Ginn can offer as a WR.

That 56 yarder disagrees with your assessment of his speed. And yes Ginn has blazing speed but his hands are suspect - which is why most people would disagree with your assessment of Ginn vs Williams.

I'm not holding anything against Williams. He's proven at least worthy of the draft pick the Niners used to get him (at least at WR). I just don't think he's proven that he's a "good" WR. And a just because a WR catches a 56 yard TD pass doesn't mean he's blazing fast. That should be obvious.

Again; he's fast. But I don't know of any tiny, young WRs in the NFL who are slower than he.

 

[iHATEdodgers]

I'm not holding anything against Williams. He's proven at least worthy of the draft pick the Niners used to get him (at least at WR). I just don't think he's proven that he's a "good" WR. And a just because a WR catches a 56 yard TD pass doesn't mean he's blazing fast. That should be obvious.

Again; he's fast. But I don't know of any tiny, young WRs in the NFL who are slower than he.

Do you know what play I'm talking about? The one where he catches a 10-12 yard pass and takes it to the house running past everyone else up the middle of the field. I think that speaks to his speed more than your musings that he's probably not faster then every other tiny young WR out there.

 

[h0ckeysk83r]

So one play convinced you Kyle Williams will be a good WR?

As a returner ginn far surpassed Williams. But I have seen Williams catch almost everything thrown his way in just this last yr. ginn not so much. Williams all season showed when given playing time far surpassed ginn. That's what I saw anyways.

 

[wartyOne]

They have to grab someone in the draft. Moss is 1 year, Ginn 1 year, Manningham 2 years and none of those guys are a #1.

Is it just me, or does it seem like we've been somewhat cursed at QB and WR? We had all those years of Montana and Young, followed by a few good Garcia years, but mostly garbage in between. We had all those years of Rice and Owens, and since Owens, we haven't had a thousand yard receiver.

Am I reading too much into this?

JTO'sullivan
Tim Rattay
David Carr
Ken Dorsey
Troy Smith
Cody Pickett
Shaun Hill
Trent Dilfer
Chris Weinke
Steve Stenstrom
Alex Smith (not counting this year, has been mostly terrible)

It's not as bad as Miami's list of QB's since Marino, but still. Marino, who wore #13, incidentally, retired in 1999. Here's what followed him:

Jay Fiedler (and his ears) Played 16 games in his second season
Damon Huard
Ray Lucas
Brian Griese
A.J Feeley
Sage Rosenfels
Gus Frerotte
Joey Harrington
Daunte Culpepper
Cleo Lemon
Trent Green
John Beck
Chad Pennington (16 games) Also the infamous WildCat season
Chad Henne
Tyler Thigpen
Matt Moore
And so far they have signed David Garrard, and will likely draft a QB high this year.

Ouch.

Here's a llama:

 

[NinerSickness]

Do you know what play I'm talking about? The one where he catches a 10-12 yard pass and takes it to the house running past everyone else up the middle of the field. I think that speaks to his speed more than your musings that he's probably not faster then every other tiny young WR out there.

Yes, I know to what you're referring, and I agree Kyle is a fast WR. I just don't know that he's fast for his size. Calvin Johnson is fast for his size. Desean Jackson is fast for any size.

How does his speed compare to other small WRs in the NFL? Is he faster than Santonio Holmes? Desean Jackson? Faster than Santana Moss used to be? Jeremy Maclin? Eddie Royal? Percy Harvin?(who's short but not small) Steve Smith when he was young? Mike Williams (Tampa Bay version; no relation), Devin Hester? Jonny Nox?

His diminutive size is the flip side of his fast-but-not-blazing-fast coin.

 

[clyde_carbon]

So one play convinced you Kyle Williams will be a good WR?

Williams has showed more in one year than Ginn has in four.

 

[tallglassofwater007]

Williams has showed more in one year than Ginn has in four.

Ha... you just summed up in one sentence what I was trying to say in my short story a bit ago.

 

[NinerSickness]

Williams has showed more in one year than Ginn has in four.

But if he's a "good" WR he's going to have to compare to much better WRs than a specialty player like Ginn.

 

[grunionca911]

He may not have fumbled but a ball did bounce off his face for an interception.



You gotta take the emotion out of it. Would you have cut Roger Craig after fumbling in 91?? I get that he was established, but you are basing your wanting Williams gone because you can't forgive him for a bad game.

Williams, in his limited time last year showed that he is already a better receiver than Ginn. The only play I remember Ginn making on offense all year was called back for a penalty. Williams had the great TD against the Rams showing his speed on a good route. He made a nice catch for a TD vs Dallas. And a nice route for a TD vs the Cards.

Williams had 20 catches and 14 of them were for first downs. Ginn has hit his ceiling already. I think Williams can be a really good receiver in this league.

Without looking things up, I am 99% positive that Craig was cut after that fumble or at least not resigned.

 

[clyde_carbon]

But if he's a "good" WR he's going to have to compare to much better WRs than a specialty player like Ginn.

I don't know if he's good right now, but I think he has the potential to be one of the better slot guys in the league.

 

[wartyOne]

Without looking things up, I am 99% positive that Craig was cut after that fumble or at least not resigned.

I'm pretty sure he made it through the game before being cut.

Llama.