Series Thread: Stanley Cup Freakin' Finals (Sharks v Penguins)

[mr.hockey4242]

Sharks played their best game of the series, by far. Still thought it was pretty even. Murray did not have a good game - two of those were very save-able, and especially the third, Murray's gotta work on that. He gives up that high shot a lot, maybe he's not used to NHL-caliber players who can pick the top shelf like that.

Still kind of annoyed about that 4 min powerplay. One, because they let things go before that, clear game management at it's worst. (Don't know how Crosby doesn't draw one when he gets clearly held on a semi-breakaway.) But also because Crosby and Letang failed to get it deep at the end of the kill. Little mistakes will kill it.

Game 4 looms huge now.

That was about as blatant a penalty as you can get and it drew blood. If the refs missed that one they would never hear the end of it

 

[forty_three]

That was the second most exciting game I saw today.


(My son stopped the last 32 shots for a 3-2 win. 40 saves total.)

 

[Dacks]

That was about as blatant a penalty as you can get and it drew blood. If the refs missed that one they would never hear the end of it

But that's exactly what's so dumb about game management calls. You let all the subjective ones go, but then you have to call things like high-sticking, or pucks over the glass. It disproportionately punishes those plays, not because they are worse than a trip or a slash, but because they are more black and white.

 

[Comeds]

Well that should do it.

Games not even close to over. The refs have the ice tilted toward the sharks. They've turned their heads on several shark penalties. And will continue to give the sharks an edge. I don't want to hear Couture complain about Crosby again after that horse collar tackle with no call. This game isn't even close to over imo

Guess you feel pretty silly now.

 

[TheRobotDevil]

Guess you feel pretty silly now.

Why would I feel silly refs tilted the ice and i told you the game wasn't over? On another note that ice was awful. If they don't clean that ice up in San Jose. They're risking someone getting seriously injured. I don't remember the last time I've seen ice that sloppy

 

[mr.hockey4242]

But that's exactly what's so dumb about game management calls. You let all the subjective ones go, but then you have to call things like high-sticking, or pucks over the glass. It disproportionately punishes those plays, not because they are worse than a trip or a slash, but because they are more black and white.

I hear ya on that. But the high stick was one that was almost impossible to miss. Jumbo was facing towards the ice and in full view for all to see and byBonino full blown swings and drills him in the face.

All the missed high sticks in game 2 while mostly bad misses you could at least see how in real time a ref may not see being behind in the play. But on this one here it was wide open and blatant.

 

[Comeds]

Why would I feel silly refs tilted the ice and i told you the game wasn't over? On another note that ice was awful. If they don't clean that ice up in San Jose. They're risking someone getting seriously injured. I don't remember the last time I've seen ice that sloppy

I was being sarcastic.

 

[TheRobotDevil]

I was being sarcastic.

I know I was hoping to get your thoughts on the ice conditions tonight. It did have a major impact on the game and more importantly player safety.

 

[Comeds]

I know I was hoping to get your thoughts on the ice conditions tonight. It did have a major impact on the game and more importantly player safety.

Honestly I watched about half of the second and then the OT. I didn't notice anything artfully the ice, though I heard the announcers talking about it. In the second I thought the refs let both teams get away with a lot.

 

[TheRobotDevil]

Honestly I watched about half of the second and then the OT. I didn't notice anything artfully the ice, though I heard the announcers talking about it. In the second I thought the refs let both teams get away with a lot.

Rolling pucks and players hitting the ice all night. I know bad ice favors the sharks. But that was terrible. They need to do something with that ice its the finals.

 

[BGDave]

I have a question for the goalies on here, @forty_three et al.

Let's pretend I know nothing about goaltending (cough, cough, sieve, cough, cough)

The OT goal is a great example of what I call the "Catholic Church" style of goaltending. When in doubt, drop to your knees and pray.

It seems to be the go to move for a lot of goalies lately, so I am not picking on Murray right now.

Why do goalies do this? Seems like it is hard enough to stop high shots without exposing more peanut butter space by kneeling. You cant possibly cover the top of the net when you are that low.

Again, not to pick on Murray, but if he stays on his skates, that space over his shoulder is also 3 feet over the net. There is nowhere for the puck to go in.

What advantage does kneeling give a goalie?

 

[Maverick426h]

Pens in 5.

 

[scoutyjones2]

I know I was hoping to get your thoughts on the ice conditions tonight. It did have a major impact on the game and more importantly player safety.

I watch plenty of Pens games and their home ice has to be one of the worst...so no, the ice surface wasn't an issue. And guess what, both teams play on it

 

[forty_three]

I have a question for the goalies on here, @forty_three et al.

Let's pretend I know nothing about goaltending (cough, cough, sieve, cough, cough)

The OT goal is a great example of what I call the "Catholic Church" style of goaltending. When in doubt, drop to your knees and pray.

It seems to be the go to move for a lot of goalies lately, so I am not picking on Murray right now.

Why do goalies do this? Seems like it is hard enough to stop high shots without exposing more peanut butter space by kneeling. You cant possibly cover the top of the net when you are that low.

Again, not to pick on Murray, but if he stays on his skates, that space over his shoulder is also 3 feet over the net. There is nowhere for the puck to go in.

What advantage does kneeling give a goalie?

Essentially, you are covering net. When you are standing, you are covering maybe one total foot of net along the ice. Plus, a large portion of your body is above the crossbar not protecting anything. Most goalie pads in the pros are 36" plus, so when you drop to your knees and spread out you are covering 65-70 inches of net along the ice (plus 12" or so high). And your shoulders are now where your waist would be if you were standing.This is very effective when shots are coming from above the circles and/or outside the dots.

Goaltending is probabilities and risk. You want to be in position to stop 90 out of every 100 that come at you. And you do that by simply covering net and leaving yourself available to move to the next spot to make the next one. The best goalies are the ones that the puck "just hits". Patrick Roy was the best at it, and he inspired Brodeur. The two of them changed goaltending forever.

On that goal, Murray had the post completely closed off low. He had his elbow outside the post so there was no hole (such a hard thing to teach young goalies to do). His skate was hard on the post. He had his left pad covering any far side attempt. And he was leaning a bit to be ready to shove out to the top of the crease in case Donskoi passed. He left a space about the size of a shoe box exposed, and Joonas hit it. While getting it through two defenders.

If he squeezed that off and Donskoi passed to the slot we'd be asking about his panicked lunge and how he missed with his glove because there is no way he'd have gotten there. I think he obviously got lower than he wanted, but I can't say I'd have done anything different myself. I don't fault him for that one at all.

Ward's goal on the other hand...

 

[Groo]

Rolling pucks and players hitting the ice all night. I know bad ice favors the sharks. But that was terrible. They need to do something with that ice its the finals.

I have to wonder if the weather played an extra part. It was very muggy game day. Not the usual weather we have.

 

[Dacks]

Essentially, you are covering net. When you are standing, you are covering maybe one total foot of net along the ice. Plus, a large portion of your body is above the crossbar not protecting anything. Most goalie pads in the pros are 36" plus, so when you drop to your knees and spread out you are covering 65-70 inches of net along the ice (plus 12" or so high). And your shoulders are now where your waist would be if you were standing.This is very effective when shots are coming from above the circles and/or outside the dots.

Goaltending is probabilities and risk. You want to be in position to stop 90 out of every 100 that come at you. And you do that by simply covering net and leaving yourself available to move to the next spot to make the next one. The best goalies are the ones that the puck "just hits". Patrick Roy was the best at it, and he inspired Brodeur. The two of them changed goaltending forever.

On that goal, Murray had the post completely closed off low. He had his elbow outside the post so there was no hole (such a hard thing to teach young goalies to do). His skate was hard on the post. He had his left pad covering any far side attempt. And he was leaning a bit to be ready to shove out to the top of the crease in case Donskoi passed. He left a space about the size of a shoe box exposed, and Joonas hit it. While getting it through two defenders.

If he squeezed that off and Donskoi passed to the slot we'd be asking about his panicked lunge and how he missed with his glove because there is no way he'd have gotten there. I think he obviously got lower than he wanted, but I can't say I'd have done anything different myself. I don't fault him for that one at all.

Ward's goal on the other hand...

Thanks 43. Question though - is it just a bit of bad luck that Murray seems to have been beaten quite a few times high from bad angles? Is he trading that risk for taking away the low part of the net, or should he be making some adjustments? I agree with another poster, who mentioned that he and Vasilevsky both seemed to get really low in those situations.

 

[Groo]

I have to wonder if the weather played an extra part. It was very muggy game day. Not the usual weather we have.

It seems the SAP center booked a concert for the 4th of June.
So they then move the concert up to the 3rd. I'm sure that didn't help.

 

[mr.hockey4242]

It seems the SAP center booked a concert for the 4th of June.
So they then move the concert up to the 3rd. I'm sure that didn't help.

Yup, sounds like the concert didn't get done til 1 am

 

[Darkstone42]

I watch plenty of Pens games and their home ice has to be one of the worst...so no, the ice surface wasn't an issue. And guess what, both teams play on it

San Jose was worse than Consol last night. A lot worse. Several reporters covering the game, and even Pierre noted there were sections of ice which were unplayable.

I noticed it affecting Kessel more than anyone else, though. He looked like he couldn't get any traction to get moving, like he was skating underwater, which was actually kind of true in a way. I think slow ice impacts the fastest players the most, and that definitely disproportionately impacts the Penguins whose entire team identity is speed.

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

Well, I'm new here but I think this series will be a nail-biter right down to the end. Good for the Sharks to get back in this thing although they need to get off to a better start in games. They were being dominated by the Pens early on and that shouldn't happen when you have your backs against the wall. At any rate, good game for them even though I'm not a fan of San Jose.
As for the ice, there is little that can be done when the humidity is that bad and you have a packed building. They probably have it cranked to the max already. It is what it is and both teams just have to work through it. It reminds me of the Dallas/ Buffalo series in 99. The ice in Dallas was this bad too.