Sorry to twist the daggar.

[threelittleturds]

So, I just got around to watching the final goal line stand again... and I saw something that really sucks.... and I figured most of you would want to at least see it if you haven't already.

This was the 2nd down call with the roll out to the right where Colin eventually threw it to Crabtree and the Ravens guy played through him to make sure he didn't catch it.

I honestly don't know why CK missed Randy Moss wide open in the back of the endzone, and I can't tell if guys at the line were blocking his view because he seemed to scan to his left and finally went back to Crabtree at the last second and tried to push it in.

To me this sucks because it shouldn't even have came down to the refs ignoring penalties, the 49ers just let it slip away

I watched the next play a lot too, and I can't confirm it but it is just my suspicion that Moss did an ole' block on the guy that clocked Crabtree in the chin. Everyone had to know that play was meant to be a quick pass to Crabs and he'd hopefully beat his guy around the edge for the score. My guess is that as unbelievable as it seems considering the stage and what was at stake, Randy pouted that they missed his chance to be the hero and called Crabs number instead... and let his guy go free.

It probably doesn't matter because the pass was behind Crabs and the Ravens guy had his arms wrapped around Crabtree's waist before he even started to turn up field...

 

[threelittleturds]

LOL, oops, I misspelled dagger.

 

[threelittleturds]

Oh by the way on that 3rd down, if anyone thinks CK might have missed Delanie Walker for an easy TD at the goalline. As far as I can tell Ray Lewis was directly in the middle of that throwing lane by pure luck as he was trying to follow Gore out of the backfield.

 

[TobyTyler]

Wow! Talk about wide open! It looks like Kaepernick was looking that way too. Bummer.

 

[Flyingiguana]

we shoulda ran it the fuck in

 

[Bemular]

I don't think Colin missed Moss at all - He clearly sees him but just doesn't pull the trigger. In motion, I can see where the LOS(ight) may have been blocked by Ellerbe.

As for Moss' Ole block - You are dead right about that. In fact it was the absence of any effort at all to block his man that lead to my change of heart on Moss for next season.

On another, perhaps somewhat controversial note, Crabtree HAS to win that battle and make that catch!!

 

[CalamityX11]

 

[TobyTyler]

I don't think Colin missed Moss at all - He clearly sees him but just doesn't pull the trigger. In motion, I can see where the LOS(ight) may have been blocked by Ellerbe.

As for Moss' Ole block - You are dead right about that. In fact it was the absence of any effort at all to block his man that lead to my change of heart on Moss for next season.

On another, perhaps somewhat controversial note, Crabtree HAS to win that battle and make that catch!!

Agreed. He was probably remembering that pick six from a couple of weeks before the last time he threw late back across the middle.

 

[Bemular]

Agreed. He was probably remembering that pick six from a couple of weeks before the last time he threw late back across the middle.

That, plus the window in that "still" is NOT the window he would have been throwing into.

 

[TobyTyler]

That, plus the window in that "still" is NOT the window he would have been throwing into.

It sure looks like Moss is running into space though.

 

[MHSL82]

That, plus the window in that "still" is NOT the window he would have been throwing into.

It sure looks like Moss is running into space though.

I've seen these throughout the years, especially now with All-22 available, and I've always said that the vantage point we have isn't what the QB has. I argued that with Smith (sometimes it's just Smith, sometimes it's not), I wouldn't stop arguing that when it's Kaep.

I know that Kaep has better vision than Smith, so I'm not trying to equate the two, just saying that some things that might prevent one QB from seeing something might also prevent another, regardless of relative ability of the two. I'm consistent in acknowledging that there's only so much video can show us. I'm not defending Smith, just Kaep, Alex certainly had his share of struggles with vision/hesitancy/skill/etc. and this might not even be a vision thing for Kaep. His angle wasn't the same as this one.

Some factors include what the play was supposed to be. If Moss was the intended read of the play before the snap, that's a factor. If Moss came open as a scramble drill, that's a factor. As some say, his reputation should lead to you looking for him. But if the vision is blocked or Kaep saw something we didn't, I'm going to trust his judgment over the video. If Kaep feels he was too focused on getting it to Crabtree, he'll learn from it.

 

[threelittleturds]

I don't think Colin missed Moss at all - He clearly sees him but just doesn't pull the trigger. In motion, I can see where the LOS(ight) may have been blocked by Ellerbe.

As for Moss' Ole block - You are dead right about that. In fact it was the absence of any effort at all to block his man that lead to my change of heart on Moss for next season.

On another, perhaps somewhat controversial note, Crabtree HAS to win that battle and make that catch!!

I tend to use missed as a blanket statement, to me that includes not seeing and not pulling the trigger. Like NN said, maybe he was thinking about that endzone INT against Seattle.

That ole block swings me on Moss too, I don't want him back.

 

[bvanthielriceyoung]

Didnt Kaep thrown an INT against the Seahawks in a similar situation too?? I thought it was kind of like this play and Kaepernick tried to pass it to Moss in a similar throw and it was picked.

 

[MHSL82]

That ole block swings me on Moss too, I don't want him back.

I'll defend Moss, but my defense may be as inspired as his ole block. His block could have been ole not because of the grudge he had for the previous play, but maybe for the grudge in general? Kaep may have been pretty focused on Crabs and I don't know what Moss saw there. Maybe a bad side of him shined through. He wouldn't say this of consciously felt this way, but maybe part of him wanted him to be the hero or no receiver. I'd have to watch the ply again to see if he could have blocked Crabs man or just his man. It's a bad predicament to be in, if this is true, I don't want him to have a ring, but I wanted us to win, even if it meant him to get it. Even if he was the hero.

Or just laziness in blocking in general. I would say that in the biggest game of the year on his last good shot at a ring, he should have worked harder, even if it might not have prevented the INT or might not have lead to a TD, here. Perhaps if we were on the 3 or 4 they would have run it? Probably not on 4th, though.

 

[MHSL82]

Didnt Kaep thrown an INT against the Seahawks in a similar situation too?? I thought it was kind of like this play and Kaepernick tried to pass it to Moss in a similar throw and it was picked.

NN, Bem, and Three agree with you previously in the thread, I think. I'd have to watch the play again, but by memory, yes, I agree, too. I can't say what was in Kaep's head, of course, just the similarity of the plays.

 

[Bemular]

I tend to use missed as a blanket statement, to me that includes not seeing and not pulling the trigger. Like NN said, maybe he was thinking about that endzone INT against Seattle.

That ole block swings me on Moss too, I don't want him back.

Yep, that was a cheap shot on his own teammate as far as I'm concerned. Not to mention, it removed any hope, no matter how slim, of Crabtree getting into the end-zone on that play.

 

[Bemular]

It sure looks like Moss is running into space though.

Oh Moss was definitely open from the WR's perspective, but Colin is looking at about a 17-18 yard pass thrown behind him as he is running in the opposite direction. Thus, from a QB's perspective those defenders are alot closer and that window is alot narrower than it may seem in the photos.

Hidsight, I would have sent Gore out into the flat to (hopefully) draw Reed out and Moss would have had a classic Montana to Rice six on a second window slant because Moss absolutely raped Williams off the line.

 

[MHSL82]

Oh Moss was definitely open from the WR's perspective, but Colin is looking at about a 17-18 yard pass thrown behind him as he is running in the opposite direction. Thus, from a QB's perspective those defenders are alot closer and that window is alot narrower than it may seem in the photos.

Hidsight, I would have sent Gore out into the flat to (hopefully) draw Reed out and Moss would have had a classic Montana to Rice six on a second window slant because Moss absolutely raped Williams off the line.

Obviously, line of sight takes precedence over reads, but watching the play again, was Moss a first/second/third read or a scramble drill (Meaning did he come open after running to where he should the play was still going)? If it was a read, was Moss, Kaep, Gore, and Crabs in the right place and it was just covered (incidentally or not), in your opinion? Or should one player be somewhere else.

It was an audible, but those have reads, too, right? Audibles don't mean I'm going to this guy no matter what or else scramble.

 

[Bemular]

Obviously, line of sight takes precedence over reads, but watching the play again, was Moss a first/second/third read or a scramble drill? If it was a read, was Moss, Kaep, Gore, and Crabs in the right place and it was just covered (incidentally or not), in your opinion? Or should one player be somewhere else.

It was an audible, but those have reads, too, right? Audibles don't mean I'm going to this guy no matter what or else scramble.

Actually, LOSight and Reads are two different things. Having or not having a LOS will determine where you throw the ball but your reads/progression stay the same regardless of LOSight

By my observation, it appears Kaps first read, was Reed. We were in bunch and the Ravens had 4 to cover 3 - Reed was the wild card. This is where sight-adjusts come into play. Immediately on the snap Reed was either going to sink on Davis or come up on Crabtree.

If Reed sinks, Crabtree, who had Graham playing soft, should have adjusted his route to open up in two steps - Reed did sink and instead Crabtree opened up at five steps; which, by that time he had ran his route into coverage - something he loves to do in tight spaces.

The read progression was likely Crabtree/Davis or Davis/Crabtree then Moss, then run or throw-away. Yes pass audibles have reads even if it is just one; however, I did not see Kap audible on that particular play.

 

[MHSL82]

Actually, LOSight and Reads are two different things. Having or not having a LOS will determine where you throw the ball but your reads/progression stay the same regardless of LOSight

By my observation, it appears Kaps first read, was Reed. We were in bunch and the Ravens had 4 to cover 3 - Reed was the wild card. This is where sight-adjusts come into play. Immediately on the snap Reed was either going to sink on Davis or come up on Crabtree.

If Reed sinks, Crabtree, who had Graham playing soft, should have adjusted his route to open up in two steps - Reed did sink and instead Crabtree opened up at five steps; which, by that time he had ran his route into coverage - something he loves to do in tight spaces.

The read progression was likely Crabtree/Davis or Davis/Crabtree then Moss, then run or throw-away. Yes pass audibles have reads even if it is just one; however, I did not see Kap audible on that particular play.

Thanks for the insight. I meant that even if Moss were the first/second read, if the LOS shows no go, LOS overrides the first/second read and Kaep moves onto second, third, etc. LOS was a visual perspective, read is a play objective or alternative.

But, I learned that reads, like Reed, is defense, not just targets. I had always thought of reads as targeted players to scan for openings. Reading the defense, pre and post snap I saw as different.