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Sony Michel Has Medical Issue

ehb5

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Just to be clear, if anyone can convince me that any of Guice, Chubb and/or Ballage are best fit for this team considering Gruden's penchant to pass first, second, and most times as well as the OL's weaknesses at run blocking, then I'll go with that guy.

Until then, to me the type guy that fits this team best is an Alvin Kamara type. A couple of years ago I kept insisting that we draft Jay Ajayi, despite his reported knee issues. last year it was Joe Mixon, now it's Ronald Jones II. Ajayi just won a SB with Philly, Mixon, despite a so, so, freshman season, is now the feature back in Cincy and no matter where he goes if healthy, Jones will make others wish that they had taken him, in hindsight. If we get him, Thompson will become the perfect compliment to him because with either in the lineup, there's unpredictability. BTW, with Smith at QB the RPO becomes more lethal with the speed guys like Thompson and Jones.

Jones is not at all like Kamara. Hes never been a pass catcher in high school or college and was regularly taken off the field on 3rd downs.

If you do want a Kamara esque back Michel might fit that. John Kelly might be your best bet. Or Ballage.
 

Skins2021

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The thunder and lightning crap doesn’t typically work. Therefore, the thought is crap.

Tiki Barber/Jacobs
Jerome Bettis/FWP
Warrick Dunn/TJ Duckett
Deuce Mccallister/Reggie Bush
Warrick Dunn/Mike Alstott

just to name a few beg to differ... but yeah you need a very creative run game approach on offense which the Skins dont have.
 

Stymietee

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Jones is not at all like Kamara. Hes never been a pass catcher in high school or college and was regularly taken off the field on 3rd downs.

If you do want a Kamara esque back Michel might fit that. John Kelly might be your best bet. Or Ballage.

Maybe we're talking about a different Jones, it is after all an extremely common name. :D

Seriously, I'll not argue your perspective, but everything that I've studied about him says he more than capable in the pass game. In fact his noted and supposed "weaknesses" have everything to do with his slight frame (5' 11" 205 pounds) and whether or not he'll be able to hold up for an entire NFL season being the feature back.

They are pretty much all the same but here's his draft profile: (I say watch film on the guy to see the real football player)

Despite not starting a game as a true freshman in 2015, Jones garnered honorable mention All-Pac-12 honors and broke Heisman Trophy winner Charles White's USC freshman record with 987 rushing yards on 153 carries, scoring eight times. He started slowly in 2016 but took off when starter Justin Davis was injured. Jones finished by earning second-team all-conference recognition (six starts in all 13 games) after leading the Trojans with 1,082 yards and 12 touchdowns on 177 totes. Jones was a third-team Associated Press All-American and first-team All-Pac-12 selection in 2017, finishing in the top ten nationally in rushing yards (1,550) and rushing touchdowns (19) on 261 carries. He also caught 14 passes for 187 yards and one touchdown. The McKinney, Texas native covered over 2,000 yards as a high school junior and senior, totaling 67 touchdowns in those seasons. He also was a district champion in the 100 meters and moonlighted with the USC track team in the spring of 2016.
By Lance Zierlein
NFL Analyst
Draft Projection
Round 2
NFL Comparison
Jamaal Charles
Overview
Jones is a classic slasher with the wiggle and explosiveness to elude open-field tacklers and then burst to chunks of yardage. Jones was a much more assertive runner in 2017 and improved upon areas of improvement from the 2016 season. Jones also has the ability to turn into a much more dangerous pass-catcher than we saw at USC. He should test well at the Combine, but there will still be teams concerned with how many carries he can handle and how that affects his draft value. He's a big play talent with a chance to thrive at a high level wherever he lands.
Strengths
  • Runs with desired level of calm in the face of oncoming traffic
  • Trusts blocking development and hides cut intentions until the last second
  • Plays with light, electric feet that are dynamic in tight quarters
  • Elite plant and acceleration
  • Loose hips able to make rare cuts as sharp as 90 degrees
  • Deadly stop-start to ruin linebackers trying to pace and mirror him
  • Can find side door out of traffic and to the outside track
  • Maintains top play speed and is able to string together moves on moves on moves
  • Has lower body wiggle to dead-leg tackle attempts and slide by defender
  • Willful as a runner
  • Squares pads at impact for improved contact balance
  • Fights for yardage and falls forward
  • Had just two fumbles over 591 carries
  • Wasn't prolific as pass-catcher but is more than capable
  • Willing to stand in and offer some blitz protection
Weaknesses
  • Relatively lean frame
  • Could require limitations with his touch count over the course of a season
  • Coming off of a 275-touch 2017 campaign
  • Interior vision can be a little inconsistent and will leave meat on the bone
  • Lacks a broad base and contact balance could become an issue on next level
  • Reactive runner who could still use a more fine-tuned rush plan
  • Needs to balance pace with patience
  • Can get too far downhill leaving himself limited escape routes
  • Has room for improvement with run track in gap scheme
  • Can improve tempo and rhythm to set up cutbacks on stretch plays
  • Takes too many punishing blows in his quest for additional yardage
Sources Tell Us

"I love his juice. You have to have some of that to become a good back in the pros and he has a lot of it. He may be a little too light to give it to him more than 12-14 times per game though. I worry if he can hold up." - NFC Personnel executive
 

gkekoa

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Tiki Barber/Jacobs
Jerome Bettis/FWP
Warrick Dunn/TJ Duckett
Deuce Mccallister/Reggie Bush
Warrick Dunn/Mike Alstott

just to name a few beg to differ... but yeah you need a very creative run game approach on offense which the Skins dont have.

Tiki was a workhorse back. They used Jacobs to prolong Tiki.
Bettis was old and a short yardage back.
TJ Duckett was never successful.
Deuce was a do it all back as well. Alston was a short yardage guy.
Dunn was never change of pace.
 

ehb5

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Maybe we're talking about a different Jones, it is after all an extremely common name. :D

Seriously, I'll not argue your perspective, but everything that I've studied about him says he more than capable in the pass game. In fact his noted and supposed "weaknesses" have everything to do with his slight frame (5' 11" 205 pounds) and whether or not he'll be able to hold up for an entire NFL season being the feature back.

They are pretty much all the same but here's his draft profile: (I say watch film on the guy to see the real football player)

Despite not starting a game as a true freshman in 2015, Jones garnered honorable mention All-Pac-12 honors and broke Heisman Trophy winner Charles White's USC freshman record with 987 rushing yards on 153 carries, scoring eight times. He started slowly in 2016 but took off when starter Justin Davis was injured. Jones finished by earning second-team all-conference recognition (six starts in all 13 games) after leading the Trojans with 1,082 yards and 12 touchdowns on 177 totes. Jones was a third-team Associated Press All-American and first-team All-Pac-12 selection in 2017, finishing in the top ten nationally in rushing yards (1,550) and rushing touchdowns (19) on 261 carries. He also caught 14 passes for 187 yards and one touchdown. The McKinney, Texas native covered over 2,000 yards as a high school junior and senior, totaling 67 touchdowns in those seasons. He also was a district champion in the 100 meters and moonlighted with the USC track team in the spring of 2016.
By Lance Zierlein
NFL Analyst
Draft Projection
Round 2
NFL Comparison
Jamaal Charles
Overview
Jones is a classic slasher with the wiggle and explosiveness to elude open-field tacklers and then burst to chunks of yardage. Jones was a much more assertive runner in 2017 and improved upon areas of improvement from the 2016 season. Jones also has the ability to turn into a much more dangerous pass-catcher than we saw at USC. He should test well at the Combine, but there will still be teams concerned with how many carries he can handle and how that affects his draft value. He's a big play talent with a chance to thrive at a high level wherever he lands.
Strengths
  • Runs with desired level of calm in the face of oncoming traffic
  • Trusts blocking development and hides cut intentions until the last second
  • Plays with light, electric feet that are dynamic in tight quarters
  • Elite plant and acceleration
  • Loose hips able to make rare cuts as sharp as 90 degrees
  • Deadly stop-start to ruin linebackers trying to pace and mirror him
  • Can find side door out of traffic and to the outside track
  • Maintains top play speed and is able to string together moves on moves on moves
  • Has lower body wiggle to dead-leg tackle attempts and slide by defender
  • Willful as a runner
  • Squares pads at impact for improved contact balance
  • Fights for yardage and falls forward
  • Had just two fumbles over 591 carries
  • Wasn't prolific as pass-catcher but is more than capable
  • Willing to stand in and offer some blitz protection
Weaknesses
  • Relatively lean frame
  • Could require limitations with his touch count over the course of a season
  • Coming off of a 275-touch 2017 campaign
  • Interior vision can be a little inconsistent and will leave meat on the bone
  • Lacks a broad base and contact balance could become an issue on next level
  • Reactive runner who could still use a more fine-tuned rush plan
  • Needs to balance pace with patience
  • Can get too far downhill leaving himself limited escape routes
  • Has room for improvement with run track in gap scheme
  • Can improve tempo and rhythm to set up cutbacks on stretch plays
  • Takes too many punishing blows in his quest for additional yardage
Sources Tell Us

"I love his juice. You have to have some of that to become a good back in the pros and he has a lot of it. He may be a little too light to give it to him more than 12-14 times per game though. I worry if he can hold up." - NFC Personnel executive

Ive watched a little more than half of his games from 2017. They just dont throw the ball to him often. He never caught 15 passes in HS then goes to USC and ALSO never catches 15 passes in a season AND gets replaced on 3rd downs and in the passing game by a true freshman even though hes one of USC's best playmakers? Thats the same sort of stuff that raises red flags with Chubb and Guice (arguably worse than their red flags).

So based on all the evidence we have, he is not a pass catcher. Now maybe he can develop into a capable one at the next level but Kamara isnt a capable pass catcher. Hes somebody whos a natural at it including running routes downfield and lining up out wide. Even if Jones is capable of pass catching to some degree, he's almost definitely miles from where Kamara is.

I think Saquon, Kelly, and Ballage are the only 3 guys who Ive done any research on who are possibly that kind of pass catcher.
 

Stymietee

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Ive watched a little more than half of his games from 2017. They just dont throw the ball to him often. He never caught 15 passes in HS then goes to USC and ALSO never catches 15 passes in a season AND gets replaced on 3rd downs and in the passing game by a true freshman even though hes one of USC's best playmakers? Thats the same sort of stuff that raises red flags with Chubb and Guice (arguably worse than their red flags).

So based on all the evidence we have, he is not a pass catcher. Now maybe he can develop into a capable one at the next level but Kamara isnt a capable pass catcher. Hes somebody whos a natural at it including running routes downfield and lining up out wide. Even if Jones is capable of pass catching to some degree, he's almost definitely miles from where Kamara is.

I think Saquon, Kelly, and Ballage are the only 3 guys who Ive done any research on who are possibly that kind of pass catcher.

OK, we'll soon see how this all shakes out, but, let's say that you're right about this, for this type of runner Thompson is a natural 3rd down back and damned near perfect substitute, so we have what's necessary, right?
 

ehb5

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OK, we'll soon see how this all shakes out, but, let's say that you're right about this, for this type of runner Thompson is a natural 3rd down back and damned near perfect substitute, so we have what's necessary, right?

Yes. But I dont really like Jones all that much as a runner anyways. Plenty of guys Id prefer.
 

ehb5

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OK, we'll see

For sure. The experts don't even know what'll happen and I'm certainly no expert. Just some guy on a message board telling you what ive seen and heard. For all i know jones is gonna be the next jamaal Charles after all.
 

Ruzious

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Just to be clear, if anyone can convince me that any of Guice, Chubb and/or Ballage are best fit for this team considering Gruden's penchant to pass first, second, and most times as well as the OL's weaknesses at run blocking, then I'll go with that guy.

Until then, to me the type guy that fits this team best is an Alvin Kamara type. A couple of years ago I kept insisting that we draft Jay Ajayi, despite his reported knee issues. last year it was Joe Mixon, now it's Ronald Jones II. Ajayi just won a SB with Philly, Mixon, despite a so, so, freshman season, is now the feature back in Cincy and no matter where he goes if healthy, Jones will make others wish that they had taken him, in hindsight. If we get him, Thompson will become the perfect compliment to him because with either in the lineup, there's unpredictability. BTW, with Smith at QB the RPO becomes more lethal with the speed guys like Thompson and Jones.
Now, if you can play Thompson and Jones together, that would be interesting. But has Gruden ever shown that type of creativity?
 

Ruzious

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True but it doesnt have to be relative to size.... think of some of the best RB tandems in the NFL

Falcons: Freeman and Coleman neither is a bruiser. Coleman has long speed Freeman has quick short speed.
Saints: Ingram and Kamara. I wouldnt call Ingram a Blount like bruiser. Similar to Freeman has quick short speed.

I think people are convinced change of pace backs need to be 1 big and 1 large because of the thunder and lightning with Tiki Barber and Brandon Jacobs... I disagree.

If you have a big back and quick back you may become predictable. Every time the big back comes in you are running between the tackles, every time the fast back comes in you are running off tackle etc etc.
Bradshaw and Jacobs helped win 2 SB's for the Giants. That was before Bradshaw bulked up - he was a little guy back then. New England's running game was at its best when they had LaGarette Blount offsetting a host of small running backs like Lewis.
 

Skins2021

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Bradshaw and Jacobs helped win 2 SB's for the Giants. That was before Bradshaw bulked up - he was a little guy back then. New England's running game was at its best when they had LaGarette Blount offsetting a host of small running backs like Lewis.

I did not include New England they are a bit different. They also have Bellicheck.

How many lead back between the tackle runners are there left in the NFL aside from Blount? Marshawn Lynch? who else
 

redskin4209

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This yrs RB class is deep. So deep I think you can get a good RB in at least the 3rd to 4th rds. Michel is an all round back with some good explosive speed and good power. There are reports about him staying healthy. He seems to get dinged up occasionally but I bet he will not slip down very long.
 

Ruzious

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I did not include New England they are a bit different. They also have Bellicheck.

How many lead back between the tackle runners are there left in the NFL aside from Blount? Marshawn Lynch? who else
I have no idea, and I don't know what that's got to do with the discussion.
 

Stymietee

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Now, if you can play Thompson and Jones together, that would be interesting. But has Gruden ever shown that type of creativity?

Good point, but, in fairness has Gruden as HC ever had that type of talent to play in tandem? BTW; if as has been mentioned Gruden now has a QB that makes the RPO more viable. Gruden's ability will certainly be tested with that now and if he gets that tandem he'll have more options to explore.
 

Skins2021

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I have no idea, and I don't know what that's got to do with the discussion.

I agree the NFL is moving to a 2 back system.

What I dont agree about is that 1 of the backs have to be a big bruiser and the other has to be a small speed guy.
 

SeanTaylor21

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I did not include New England they are a bit different. They also have Bellicheck.

How many lead back between the tackle runners are there left in the NFL aside from Blount? Marshawn Lynch? who else

Le'veon Bell, Mark Ingram, Todd Gurley, Melvin Gordon off the top of my head.
 

SeanTaylor21

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Forgot about Zeke Elliott and David Johnson....now that i think about, we need a game changing running back or at least an above average one.
 

countryroads316

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Not Good

to The Ringer's Mike Lombardi, NFL teams have concerns Georgia RB Sony Michel has a bone-on-bone condition in his knee.

It can be a career-shortening condition, and contributed to Jay Ajayi's fall in the 2015 draft. NFL Network's Mike Mayock has also alluded to medical concerns surrounding Michel, but still sent Michel to the Steelers in the first round in his mock draft on Thursday night. Lombardi said teams have concerns Michel won't last long enough to play out a second contract.


Source: GM Street Podcast
Apr 25 - 10:55 PM
 
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