RB depth chart

[Tubbs1518]

Don't you normally piss on Big 10 running backs?

No, not normally, just Wisconsin RB's. I'd rather have Burkhead than Montee Ball.

 

[cincygrad]

No, not normally, just Wisconsin RB's. I'd rather have Burkhead than Montee Ball.

Sure.... Why not? I mean, Ball's just a faster, more productive running back with better hands. Go Rex!

 

[Tubbs1518]

Sure.... Why not? I mean, Ball's just a faster, more productive running back with better hands. Go Rex!

1. Ball does not have better hands.

2. He is productive back the same way John Clay and Ron Dayne were.

3. Ball was faster only in the 40. Ball ran a 4.66 and Burkhead ran a 4.73. In ever other measurable catefory at the combine Burkhead was better.

Bench Reps - Ball - 15 Burkhead - 21
Vertical Jump - Ball - 32 Burkhead - 39
Broad Jump - Ball 118 Burkhead - 125
3 Cone - Ball 6.88 Burkhead - 6.85
20 Yard Shuttle - Ball 4.40 Burkhead - 4.09
60 Yard Shuttle - Ball NA Burkhead - 11.51

Burkhead was in the top 5 of all running backs at the combine in Vertical, Broad Jump, 3 Cone, 20 Yard Shuttle and 60 Yard Shuttle.

 

[cincygrad]

Ron Dayne played 14 years ago.... And had significant weight issues that Ball does not posses. Clay was never considered to be a great pro prospect and I don't think he was even drafted.

I'm not sure that Ball will break the Wiscy running back curse, but it only takes one.... Keep in mind that years ago folks used to talk about how Michigan quarterbacks were lousy pros. It only takes one.

Regardless, it's sort of a moot point. Barring injury, Ball is going to get a ton of carries this season and Burkhead is going to get very few. So there really won't be a fair comparison.

 

[Tubbs1518]

I didn't compare them, I just said I didn't like Ball and you said Ball was faster and what not. He isn't really faster and he didn't measure nearly as well. Does that mean a ton? No, I happen to think Burkhead is a far superior back.

 

[cincygrad]

That's basically what I'm getting at. Even if Ball impresses, you could still consider Rex a better back. There will simply be no way to know.

 

[Cincyfan78]

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20130812/SPT02/308120136/Bengals-Bernard-his-own-worst-critic

Decent read on RB's.

Also forgot that Herron had 2 blocked punts last year, and nearly blocked another this past game against ATL.

The first 3 spots seemed to be locked with Law-Firm, Gio, and Peerman. Still saying that special teams experience, and productions, gives Herron a good inside track. Burkhead will have to really impress.

 

[Cincyfan78]

Another good night for the RB's. Herron had a nice run, and Gio continues to showcase what he can do in the open field, and catching the ball.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

Another good night for the RB's. Herron had a nice run, and Gio continues to showcase what he can do in the open field, and catching the ball.

Herron had a really nice cut back, but I was still most impressed with Burkhead. He has speed to get it outside, but what seems like more thunder at the point of impact to push guys, where Herron doesn't seem to do that. Burkhead just keeps gaining yards even when nothing is there.

This is a really hard decision. I would almost prefer to get rid of BJGE...LOL. I know that is not happening and BJGE is a decent short yardage back, but man, not real sure which one I want to cut, because Peerman is the QB of the special teams punt unit. He sets up the plays, he is the guy that runs with it on fakes, he is a good tackler, always in on a play, and good on kickoff coverage.

Simmons is not going to lose Peerman and Miles, there is just no way. So expect both those guys to return regardless, because Simmons is at least going to get his special teams captains back.

 

[Cincyfan78]

A good look by Reedy:

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/...Burkhead-Herron-in-tight-race-for-roster-spot

 

[bengaldoug]

Either way, looks like a good back will be cut. That's a problem we haven't had for awhile.
'

 

[cincygrad]

I'm glad that Reedy clarified Herron's PS eligibility. That could be a real factor here. If you feel that one might clear wavers and make our PS it could definitely influence the decision. There's no reason to believe that Firm, Gio, and Peerman will all make it through the season without some injuries. Having both on the roster would be a nice luxury. I guess the even money is on Burkhead having less chance of making it to the PS, but at this point I think both might be risky cuts.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

I'm glad that Reedy clarified Herron's PS eligibility. That could be a real factor here. If you feel that one might clear wavers and make our PS it could definitely influence the decision. There's no reason to believe that Firm, Gio, and Peerman will all make it through the season without some injuries. Having both on the roster would be a nice luxury. I guess the even money is on Burkhead having less chance of making it to the PS, but at this point I think both might be risky cuts.

In previous post you said there was no evidence that Burkhead was a better overall RB than Herron, and the proof is in the pudding, and in this case, this article.

Herron was always projected as a 6th to 7th round pick.

It shows right here what me and Tubbs have been saying for more than a week now...Burkhead was projected as a 2nd to 3rd down RB before the injuries. He is 100% healthy, btu his overall numbers did not go over well when it came to the draft, especially coupled with his 4.73 - 40 at the combine. He fell drastically. Difference is, straight line speed with no pads is a whole lot different than game speed. Burkhead also had the 2nd fastest time in the short shuttle at the combine, so he is explosive. So once you get through that initial line with your burst, it is all about, vision, power and agility. Burkhead has all those, at least more so than Herron.

Plus, it is not like Burkhead will be a complete scrub on speecial teams where he is learnign to be the QB of the punt team in hopes of replacing Peerman at some point. Maybe the best thing to do is lose Peerman and try to hold on to both Herron and Burkhead.

 

[Cincyfan78]

In previous post you said there was no evidence that Burkhead was a better overall RB than Herron, and the proof is in the pudding, and in this case, this article.

Herron was always projected as a 6th to 7th round pick.

It shows right here what me and Tubbs have been saying for more than a week now...Burkhead was projected as a 2nd to 3rd down RB before the injuries. He is 100% healthy, btu his overall numbers did not go over well when it came to the draft, especially coupled with his 4.73 - 40 at the combine. He fell drastically. Difference is, straight line speed with no pads is a whole lot different than game speed. Burkhead also had the 2nd fastest time in the short shuttle at the combine, so he is explosive. So once you get through that initial line with your burst, it is all about, vision, power and agility. Burkhead has all those, at least more so than Herron.

Plus, it is not like Burkhead will be a complete scrub on speecial teams where he is learnign to be the QB of the punt team in hopes of replacing Peerman at some point. Maybe the best thing to do is lose Peerman and try to hold on to both Herron and Burkhead.

Not sure why you want to bring up the stats portion of this. If you say the proof is in the pudding, per the article: "Herron is tied for the team lead in carries (17) and has the highest yards-per-carry average among the running backs at 6.5."

Herron has better stats all across the board.

He also has NFL game experience running the ball, and has been productive on special teams in live NFL games (which we can all agree is not the same as fake-season).


Burkhead may have been projected as a second rounder, but that is not what the Bengals invested in him. Whether you like it or not, all things being equal, Herron has outplayed Burkhead this pre-season. Now, the only question left is if the Bengals are worried about losing Burkhead through waivers. That's really what this is going to come down to.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

Not sure why you want to bring up the stats portion of this. If you say the proof is in the pudding, per the article: "Herron is tied for the team lead in carries (17) and has the highest yards-per-carry average among the running backs at 6.5."

Herron has better stats all across the board.

He also has NFL game experience running the ball, and has been productive on special teams in live NFL games (which we can all agree is not the same as fake-season).


Burkhead may have been projected as a second rounder, but that is not what the Bengals invested in him. Whether you like it or not, all things being equal, Herron has outplayed Burkhead this pre-season. Now, the only question left is if the Bengals are worried about losing Burkhead through waivers. That's really what this is going to come down to.

On Herron's 40 yard run, Gruden called it a TD before the snap even was called in Hard Knocks. He saw the defense alignment, he knew what the play was, and Herron did a good job of running his counter.

A majority of Herron's yards and average come from that one play where it was basically gift wrapped for him.

Burkhead has been running inside and outside consistantly gaining yards. If Herron cannot run outside, he gains next to nothing on the inside. Burkhead has had the vision to find those small holes, explode through them and consistantly push the ball up field with a couple runs over 15 yards and put up more conistant runs than Herron.

I mean if you watch the games again, Herron does very little with the rock when runing between the tackles. Burkhead is consistantly pushing the ball up the field regardless of inside or outside. Plus, he is a better receiver out of the backfield than Herron.

I know he has not proved anything on an NFL field yet, but neither has Eifert and Gio. Sometimes you just have to keep potential over a one trick pony.

 

[cincygrad]

In previous post you said there was no evidence that Burkhead was a better overall RB than Herron, and the proof is in the pudding, and in this case, this article.

Herron was always projected as a 6th to 7th round pick.

It shows right here what me and Tubbs have been saying for more than a week now...Burkhead was projected as a 2nd to 3rd down RB before the injuries. He is 100% healthy, btu his overall numbers did not go over well when it came to the draft, especially coupled with his 4.73 - 40 at the combine. He fell drastically. Difference is, straight line speed with no pads is a whole lot different than game speed. Burkhead also had the 2nd fastest time in the short shuttle at the combine, so he is explosive. So once you get through that initial line with your burst, it is all about, vision, power and agility. Burkhead has all those, at least more so than Herron.

Plus, it is not like Burkhead will be a complete scrub on speecial teams where he is learnign to be the QB of the punt team in hopes of replacing Peerman at some point. Maybe the best thing to do is lose Peerman and try to hold on to both Herron and Burkhead.

There is no evidence that Rex is a better running back. None. They had similar stats in college and Burkhead has never been a pro.

The 'projected 2nd or 3rd rounder' things is completely overplayed. There are plenty of guys that are projected in the top 3 rounds after their junior years that never come close to those rounds. And it's not just because of injury.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

There is no evidence that Rex is a better running back. None. They had similar stats in college and Burkhead has never been a pro.

The 'projected 2nd or 3rd rounder' things is completely overplayed. There are plenty of guys that are projected in the top 3 rounds after their junior years that never come close to those rounds. And it's not just because of injury.

I mean except for the fact that experts projected Burkhead as a 2nd and 3rd rounder, while Herron never exceeded a 6th round grade. I mean besides that aspect, I guess they are identical. :rollseyes:

 

[cincygrad]

I mean except for the fact that experts projected Burkhead as a 2nd and 3rd rounder, while Herron never exceeded a 6th round grade. I mean besides that aspect, I guess they are identical. :rollseyes:

Experts projected Landry Jones as the top overall pick in the draft a few years before he came out.

Experts projected Michael Johnson as a first round draft pick before his final season and the combine.

Experts projected Burfict to be a first round pick before his final year at ASU.

These projections from when guys are not finished with college are worthless.

Go back and look at some of those 'way to early' next year's draft posts where August or someone else posts the Scouts rankings for guys before they even begin their next season. It's comical.

 

[Tubbs1518]

Experts projected Landry Jones as the top overall pick in the draft a few years before he came out.

Experts projected Michael Johnson as a first round draft pick before his final season and the combine.

Experts projected Burfict to be a first round pick before his final year at ASU.

These projections from when guys are not finished with college are worthless.

Go back and look at some of those 'way to early' next year's draft posts where August or someone else posts the Scouts rankings for guys before they even begin their next season. It's comical.

Those 2 turned out pretty well too. There is a reason these people are projected in the high rounds, they have the talent. Some of them fall due to injuries (Burkhead), some of them fall due to concerns about how hard they play (Dunlap and Johnson IIRC), some fall because they are stupid (Burfict), but the talent is always there. It's just a matter of if they can stay healthy and put it together. I'd like to see what Burkhead has in a couple years, not a guy who will forever be relegated to ST.

 

[Tubbs1518]

Experts projected Landry Jones as the top overall pick in the draft a few years before he came out.

Experts projected Michael Johnson as a first round draft pick before his final season and the combine.

Experts projected Burfict to be a first round pick before his final year at ASU.

These projections from when guys are not finished with college are worthless.

Go back and look at some of those 'way to early' next year's draft posts where August or someone else posts the Scouts rankings for guys before they even begin their next season. It's comical.

And I don't recall anyone every saying Jones would be the top pick. A 1st round pick? Yeah people said he could be, but I don't remember many actually projecting him there, and they definitely didn't before his Senior year.