Series Thread: Rangers in a short home stand with the A's

[donaldson79]

It would make no sense whatsoever. The national media is almost always wrong about rumors regarding the Rangers. I am thinking you could go back and see who Morosi had going to the Rangers over the last 3 seasons and offseasons and he is probably wrong over 90% of the time. If the Rangers traded for a starting pitcher with all of the starters they have available it would be moronic.

They quoted a Ranger source as saying, "although we have a lot of guys coming back from injury, we view Hamels as a significant upgrade, and one we've at least got to exam."

I don't like this idea at all. But it's not necessarily moronic either.

 

[jta4437]

Gonna have to make some trade here real soon or movie people down to AAA for the pitchers coming back other than possibly Hamels. And signing those draft picks sure increased or will increase our farm system. Interesting times ahead!

Nothing guaranteed with the guys coming back, though Perez's numbers look most encouraging so far,

Harrison I still think is done, I just have no faith in his health anymore unfortunately

Holland is a wait and see what he does in his rehab starts, right now its just MRIs

 

[saddles]

Rangers GM Jon Daniels talks about a possible six-man rotation and his son's issue with an umpire's call | Dallas Morning News

On a possible six-man rotation:

“It’s something that we definitely talked about. A couple questions: one, how long do you go to it? I think the time to go to a six-man rotation is when there’s not a ton of difference is when there’s not a ton of difference between No. 1, No. 3 and No. 6, when guys are all in a similar area. … You wouldn’t see the Dodgers do it and take starts away from Kershaw to give to a sixth starter some of those starts. It doesn’t make much sense. I think we’ve got a lot of guys that are in a similar range, at least right now. So the question would be how long would we stick with it and then you’ve got to take a spot somewhere else. Would we go with a short bench or would we go short in the bullpen? Those are questions we’ve got to answer?”

On if it would be beneficial to Yu Darvish next year to pitch in a six-man rotation:

“I don’t know. I think the extra day of rest that they have in Japan is certainly one of the reasons they potentially have had fewer arm injuries. They have a lot fewer Tommy Johns than we do. They also have a different mound, from what the guys tell us. It’s softer. It has more give to it, so it kind of absorbs some of the shock on your landing leg. They have a different ball. It’s tackier so pitchers don’t have to quite dig in as much and flex that forearm as much to really get the grip that they want. They’re off every Monday. The whole league is off every Monday. The starters sometimes go home when they’re not starting. They get a little rest away from the park. They don’t travel on the road if they’re not starting. So the six-man is one reason potentially but I think it’s not the only one. It’s not the only reason they have. And Darvish was second in the Cy Young voting on a regular rotation so it’s not like he can’t have success over here.”

 

[jta4437]

Rangers GM Jon Daniels talks about a possible six-man rotation and his son's issue with an umpire's call | Dallas Morning News

On a possible six-man rotation:

“It’s something that we definitely talked about. A couple questions: one, how long do you go to it? I think the time to go to a six-man rotation is when there’s not a ton of difference is when there’s not a ton of difference between No. 1, No. 3 and No. 6, when guys are all in a similar area. … You wouldn’t see the Dodgers do it and take starts away from Kershaw to give to a sixth starter some of those starts. It doesn’t make much sense. I think we’ve got a lot of guys that are in a similar range, at least right now. So the question would be how long would we stick with it and then you’ve got to take a spot somewhere else. Would we go with a short bench or would we go short in the bullpen? Those are questions we’ve got to answer?”

On if it would be beneficial to Yu Darvish next year to pitch in a six-man rotation:

“I don’t know. I think the extra day of rest that they have in Japan is certainly one of the reasons they potentially have had fewer arm injuries. They have a lot fewer Tommy Johns than we do. They also have a different mound, from what the guys tell us. It’s softer. It has more give to it, so it kind of absorbs some of the shock on your landing leg. They have a different ball. It’s tackier so pitchers don’t have to quite dig in as much and flex that forearm as much to really get the grip that they want. They’re off every Monday. The whole league is off every Monday. The starters sometimes go home when they’re not starting. They get a little rest away from the park. They don’t travel on the road if they’re not starting. So the six-man is one reason potentially but I think it’s not the only one. It’s not the only reason they have. And Darvish was second in the Cy Young voting on a regular rotation so it’s not like he can’t have success over here.”

One thing I could see is the Rangers piggy-backing Harrison, Perez or Holland with someone else (or each other) 4 innings at a time for the short term, just really depends on what things look like after the all-star break

Quality of the rotation 1-5 makes a big difference here, I don't think I get too bent out of shape if Gallardo/Lewis misses a couple starts in the 2nd half or if we find a way to reduce Chi Chi and Martinez's innings some

 

[saddles]

They quoted a Ranger source as saying, "although we have a lot of guys coming back from injury, we view Hamels as a significant upgrade, and one we've at least got to exam."

I don't like this idea at all. But it's not necessarily moronic either.

They always say they got their info from sources. They must have some really terrible sources because guys like Morosi, Rosenthal, Heyman, Bowden and crew are almost always wrong where it concerns the Rangers.

 

[darrylgann]

Rangers GM Jon Daniels talks about a possible six-man rotation and his son's issue with an umpire's call | Dallas Morning News

On a possible six-man rotation:

“It’s something that we definitely talked about. A couple questions: one, how long do you go to it? I think the time to go to a six-man rotation is when there’s not a ton of difference is when there’s not a ton of difference between No. 1, No. 3 and No. 6, when guys are all in a similar area. … You wouldn’t see the Dodgers do it and take starts away from Kershaw to give to a sixth starter some of those starts. It doesn’t make much sense. I think we’ve got a lot of guys that are in a similar range, at least right now. So the question would be how long would we stick with it and then you’ve got to take a spot somewhere else. Would we go with a short bench or would we go short in the bullpen? Those are questions we’ve got to answer?”

On if it would be beneficial to Yu Darvish next year to pitch in a six-man rotation:

“I don’t know. I think the extra day of rest that they have in Japan is certainly one of the reasons they potentially have had fewer arm injuries. They have a lot fewer Tommy Johns than we do. They also have a different mound, from what the guys tell us. It’s softer. It has more give to it, so it kind of absorbs some of the shock on your landing leg. They have a different ball. It’s tackier so pitchers don’t have to quite dig in as much and flex that forearm as much to really get the grip that they want. They’re off every Monday. The whole league is off every Monday. The starters sometimes go home when they’re not starting. They get a little rest away from the park. They don’t travel on the road if they’re not starting. So the six-man is one reason potentially but I think it’s not the only one. It’s not the only reason they have. And Darvish was second in the Cy Young voting on a regular rotation so it’s not like he can’t have success over here.”

Like that mound part of it. MLB may want to look into that.

 

[True Rangers Fan]

Sounds like this is a move they're making for 2016-17, but are having to jump the gun because of the competition for Hamels' services at the deadline and/or during the offseason.

 

[saddles]

Gonna have to make some trade here real soon or movie people down to AAA for the pitchers coming back other than possibly Hamels. And signing those draft picks sure increased or will increase our farm system. Interesting times ahead!

They are certainly in a very unique and interesting situation. I don't believe I can recall such a situation where they have maybe 3 guys, who they felt strong enough about to give multi-year contracts to, who are due to come back to a relatively good rotation. That is, to a rotation where no one really deserves to be demoted. Being on the fringe of being in the wildcard race makes it even more intriguing. There is no clear cut way to handle this situation and that is why it is so much fun to contemplate how they can get this worked out.

 

[Windingmywatch]

Way I see it if PHL values Hamels at $96mil through 2019 ... then if they eat $1 of that they will get $1 in future prospect value in exchange. So you are always paying the $96mil whether in $$$ or assets.

Assume $/win = $6mil. At $24mil/season approximately -- that correlates to 4WAR. Hamels averages 4WAR/season. But presume you don't get four production years. Maybe you only get productive value at 4WAR or higher for two seasons instead of four seasons. That means you need to get $48mil in win value in each of his two productive seasons ... or 8WAR for 2016 and 2017.

That to me is extremely high risk. TEX isn't going to send 2 low level prospects and take over the $96mil contract because that would tie up the salary budget needed to resign Yu at some point. That may be the LAA way but not JD.

If there is something working ... its going to be something different than we all figure because the numbers don't look good otherwise.

The other thing is ... TEX pitchers led MLB with a 1.87 ERA over the last 7 days. If Choo produces as he's supposed to ... and Prince ... and Beltre and Hamilton return ... and Mitch continues to make timely hits.

What is TEX doing with PHL ... getting some outside valuation help on its prospect talent to be used down the road? I don't think its to pay for Hamels.

Somewhere between 4WAR and 8WAR a season is pretty steep expectations.

 

[donaldson79]

Rangers GM Jon Daniels talks about a possible six-man rotation and his son's issue with an umpire's call | Dallas Morning News

On a possible six-man rotation:

“It’s something that we definitely talked about. A couple questions: one, how long do you go to it? I think the time to go to a six-man rotation is when there’s not a ton of difference is when there’s not a ton of difference between No. 1, No. 3 and No. 6, when guys are all in a similar area. … You wouldn’t see the Dodgers do it and take starts away from Kershaw to give to a sixth starter some of those starts. It doesn’t make much sense. I think we’ve got a lot of guys that are in a similar range, at least right now. So the question would be how long would we stick with it and then you’ve got to take a spot somewhere else. Would we go with a short bench or would we go short in the bullpen? Those are questions we’ve got to answer?”

On if it would be beneficial to Yu Darvish next year to pitch in a six-man rotation:

“I don’t know. I think the extra day of rest that they have in Japan is certainly one of the reasons they potentially have had fewer arm injuries. They have a lot fewer Tommy Johns than we do. They also have a different mound, from what the guys tell us. It’s softer. It has more give to it, so it kind of absorbs some of the shock on your landing leg. They have a different ball. It’s tackier so pitchers don’t have to quite dig in as much and flex that forearm as much to really get the grip that they want. They’re off every Monday. The whole league is off every Monday. The starters sometimes go home when they’re not starting. They get a little rest away from the park. They don’t travel on the road if they’re not starting. So the six-man is one reason potentially but I think it’s not the only one. It’s not the only reason they have. And Darvish was second in the Cy Young voting on a regular rotation so it’s not like he can’t have success over here.”

JD is talking out of both sides of his mouth here. Surprises me a little.

Anyone think there's much difference in Darvish vs our # 3 or # 6?

I never seen a 6 man rotation, but I sure see some upside to trying it.

 

[Windingmywatch]

Its not that I don't think he won't be worth the money, I just don't want to pay the Phillies asking price prospect wise AND pay his salary, and then we have a potential logjam forming in the rotation over the next couple years as it is, just seems counterproductive, I'd rather continue the youth movement and if we're going to pay a high salary make it for one season (Gallardo) as a stop gap.... what happens with Gallardo aftter this seaosn is not really relevant, so don't start with the "what ifs" as of now he's a one and done

I agree. Even if TEX puts 20% on Harrison returning and has concern with Yu returning ... I don't see taking on or paying a team $96mil when they overpaid to begin with.

I think TEX is talking to PHL because that's what JD does. Conversation may include talking about Hamels ... but could be something totally different.

 

[WastinSomeTime]

Had an article but it turns out it was something already sort of posted by darryl. If we had Hamels we would have trade chips with some of our current/rehabbing pitchers.

 

[donaldson79]

I agree. Even if TEX puts 20% on Harrison returning and has concern with Yu returning ... I don't see taking on or paying a team $96mil when they overpaid to begin with.

I think TEX is talking to PHL because that's what JD does. Conversation may include talking about Hamels ... but could be something totally different.

Can't imagine it, the conversation, being about anything much more than Hamels. Their ML roster is awful and their minor league system is ranked 20th by SB Nation.

For me, I want nothing to do with Hamels. And the main reasons are cost (either in players or cash to him), how many innings he's thrown (almost 1700) and he'll be 32 in Dec.

Don't like any of this.

 

[True Rangers Fan]

JD is talking out of both sides of his mouth here. Surprises me a little.

Man, in today's sports media, that's a skill I think GM's are going to need more and more.

 

[WastinSomeTime]

Nothing guaranteed with the guys coming back, though Perez's numbers look most encouraging so far,

Harrison I still think is done, I just have no faith in his health anymore unfortunately

Holland is a wait and see what he does in his rehab starts, right now its just MRIs

You are exactly right there jta. We have thought a couple of these guys were coming back once before. Keeping pitchers healthy can be a tough task.

 

[romeo212000]

You mean like a trade with another team or what?

Possibly. They may not even have anything in the works now, but will use the opportunity of the media linking them to Hamels to throw everyone off whatever they may be seeking to do leading up to the trade deadline.

 

[jta4437]

Way I see it if PHL values Hamels at $96mil through 2019 ... then if they eat $1 of that they will get $1 in future prospect value in exchange. So you are always paying the $96mil whether in $$$ or assets.

Assume $/win = $6mil. At $24mil/season approximately -- that correlates to 4WAR. Hamels averages 4WAR/season. But presume you don't get four production years. Maybe you only get productive value at 4WAR or higher for two seasons instead of four seasons. That means you need to get $48mil in win value in each of his two productive seasons ... or 8WAR for 2016 and 2017.

That to me is extremely high risk. TEX isn't going to send 2 low level prospects and take over the $96mil contract because that would tie up the salary budget needed to resign Yu at some point. That may be the LAA way but not JD.

If there is something working ... its going to be something different than we all figure because the numbers don't look good otherwise.

The other thing is ... TEX pitchers led MLB with a 1.87 ERA over the last 7 days. If Choo produces as he's supposed to ... and Prince ... and Beltre and Hamilton return ... and Mitch continues to make timely hits.

What is TEX doing with PHL ... getting some outside valuation help on its prospect talent to be used down the road? I don't think its to pay for Hamels.

Somewhere between 4WAR and 8WAR a season is pretty steep expectations.

I quit reading after the first sentence

 

[jta4437]

Did one of these a while back when we were really struggling on offense, things haven't picked up that much

Pos - Avg/OBP/SLG/OPS

C - .197/.285/.365/.649
1B - .286/.333/.491/.824
2B - .207/.277/.307/.584
3B - .256/.316/.421/.737
SS - .236/.295/.313/.608
LF - .215/.301/.391/.692
CF - .256/.314/.357/.671
RF - .231/.324/.385/.708
DH - .326/.398/.490/.888

Starter's ERA has dropped down to 3.57, but bullpen's is up to 4.41

 

[PDay8810]

Interesting news....having a hard time seeing the value in Hamels for this team at this particular moment.

 

[True Rangers Fan]

Interesting news....having a hard time seeing the value in Hamels for this team at this particular moment.

Hypothetically speaking, in my opinion, if this trade were to theoretically go through, I'm 99% certain Nick Martinez goes to the phils as part of the package. That would reduce the logjam in the rotation for the Rangers, phils get a young starter back that can immediately go into their rotation.

Just my guess towards the incredibly long shot of this even happening.