Post Draft...

[Caliskinsfan]

 

[Caliskinsfan]

I think that's a very realistic scenario (most realistic maybe?) But definitely not worst case. The case for Cousins is essentially a9 game sample. We can't really be sure of anything. See: Foles, Nick.

Possibly.

Main reason I don't see him as Nick Foles is Phillys Oline and running game that year covered for a lot of fundamental flaws. Had tons of time in the pocket. Plus dropped INTs and playing a lot of teams at the perfect time, i.e. Minus their starting QB

 

[Caliskinsfan]

Truth

 

[ehb5]

Possibly.

Main reason I don't see him as Nick Foles is Phillys Oline and running game that year covered for a lot of fundamental flaws. Had tons of time in the pocket. Plus dropped INTs and playing a lot of teams at the perfect time, i.e. Minus their starting QB

TBH that sounds a lot like Cousins though. Strong Oline play + elite reciever play covering up a lot of flaws. Plus dropped INTS. All those things were highlighted in that article you posted. Now I don't think he ends up being the next foles either but it's not out of the realm of possibility especially considering the similarities between their hot streaks.

 

[ehb5]

Interesting. Sounds like what I was saying we should do. And yet I caught all hell for saying SM might share my view on the situation.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

Kirk Cousins wanted better offer, Redskins want more proof
12:46 PM PT

• 
  John KeimESPN Staff Writer

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The minute Brock Osweiler signed his deal with the Houston Texans in March, life changed for Washington Redskins quarterback Kirk Cousins. If Osweiler, who had started just seven games during his four years in Denver, could receive a contract worth an average of $18 million a year, then Cousins could expect more. Problem is, the Redskins weren’t willing to go that high.

The Redskins used the franchise tag on him, so Cousins' camp believed he should receive at least $20 million in the first year of a new deal. After all, Cousins had the leverage and the franchise tag was $19.95 million. The thinking was any salary should average that amount.

From the Redskins’ perspective, it was a matter of belief. Publicly and privately, key members on the football side say Cousins is their long-term guy. But that belief by the organization is only to a certain degree, considering their offer to Cousins for most of the offseason averaged $16 million a year -- or $4 million less than the get-it-done price. The guaranteed money didn’t come close at all, either -- it was around $13-14 million less than Osweiler's $37 million.

Drew Brees. He’s the only other quarterback to have played under the franchise tag, having done so in 2004 with San Diego.

But Cousins' talks with Brees and other quarterbacks have been more about the journey they’ve traveled and work they’ve done -- and how they handle a leadership role. That’s what Cousins is focusing on, not necessarily how to play under the tag.

“His work ethic is not new, his desire to be better isn’t new,” one teammate said this offseason, “but it’s grown.”

Another risk to not reaching a deal: What happens if both Cousins and outside linebacker Junior Galette have big seasons? The Redskins would need to sign one before free agency, knowing they could franchise only one (if necessary). But the cap won’t be an issue: The Redskins are approximately $40 million under and can clear more room.

It’s not as if the entire organization is uncertain what Cousins will do. He has major fans in key places within the football side -- some who felt, even as he struggled in 2014, that he could be special. But it’s also true that some in the organization want to see more, hence their offer. Was Cousins' 2015 season the start of something big or a Nick Foles-like anomaly and byproduct of a kinder schedule? We’ll find out this year, but you don’t luck your way into a 29-touchdown, 11-interception season. Yes, he has excellent talent around him, but he made it work. Ask the linemen how much he helped them with how he handled things. Now he just has to do it again. He’s definitely capable. He'll also have a bigger chip on his shoulder, knowing what he still must prove to people in the building.

However, some facts worked against him. Cousins has never led his team to a win over an opponent with a winning record in 25 regular-season starts, a stat some in the organization are very familiar with. He’s 0-1 in the postseason. It’s not all on him, but just like the money is wild for quarterbacks so are expectations and responsibility. For $20 million per year, and perhaps then some, being better in one of those areas clearly would have helped his cause.

This isn’t exactly a game of chicken as both sides can emerge happy. If Cousins excels, he’ll get the deal he wants and the Redskins get their franchise quarterback.

“It’s a critical moment for Kirk and the franchise,” one teammate said. “If this pans out, the franchise is set for the next eight years.”

At this point, nobody involved wants to consider the alternative

 

[ehb5]

I call Bullshit. Cousins more often than not has had a better than 60% completion percentage. And until recently he has NOT had a good team around him. Until last year, the line he played behind was a joke more often than not, and aside From Garcon and an off and on Jackson he has had suspect WRs at best. Or does the excuse that no one could have done well behind that line not count for him??

He had 2 good wrs and at least solid TE play. And the worst INT rate in history by era going into this past season. He was pretty damn bad, I don't think that's really debateable.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

TBH that sounds a lot like Cousins though. Strong Oline play + elite reciever play covering up a lot of flaws. Plus dropped INTS. All those things were highlighted in that article you posted. Now I don't think he ends up being the next foles either but it's not out of the realm of possibility especially considering the similarities between their hot streaks.

Agree with your points but the main difference I see here is that our Oline play was not as strong as Phillys was that year and should hopefully be better this season. Again supporting cast hopefully will be better than Foles had in Philly that year.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

Have to agree here

 

[Caliskinsfan]

 

[Sharkinva]

He had 2 good wrs and at least solid TE play. And the worst INT rate in history by era going into this past season. He was pretty damn bad, I don't think that's really debateable.

Then you will be pleased when we are trading away another draft for the next great thing. You win, he likely going to fail.. .got it.

And actually the worst TD to INT ratio for a career would be Rogers...

NFL Career Passing Touchdown/Interception Ratio Leaders | The Football Database

Hell Kirk didnt even rank in the top 50 for a single season...

NFL Single Season Passing Touchdown/Interception Ratio Leaders | The Football Database

But yea, you right... he sucked .

 

[Caliskinsfan]

 

[Caliskinsfan]

Looks like Mo deal got done at the 12th hour

 

[Sportster 72]

Not to mention Cousins worst case is more like nick foles. That's the problem.

Or more like Griffin.

We don't know what we don't know. If they could have had a deal with a guaranteed $44 million and out after 2 years and didn't do then shame on them. If Cousins agent held out for a lot more than they were probably dreaming. The $100 question is did Snyder hold this up or was it SM's choice.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

Mannys take on Scot

 

[Sharkinva]

Mannys take on Scot

Problem with this line of thinking is, As of now, its going to cost us more coins to keep Kirk than it would have long term (over the next three years) If we had just gotten a deal done. $20 Million this year, $24 million next year. On a five year deal, odds are we could have gotten his actual cost (Cap number) to fit in around that $14-16 million a year they wanted.

But no, I digress... we did the right thing. So who are we trading up for next year now becomes the question.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

As of now, its going to cost us more coins to keep Kirk than it would have long term (over the next three years) If we had just gotten a deal done.

True. And likely a lot more coin if he plays well.

However with rising salary cap and recent cap management, skins can easily get a deal done next year if they choose to.

I just dont see the no LTD argument equals no Kirk down the road as a given myself.

 

[Sharkinva]

True. And likely a lot more coin if he plays well.

However with rising salary cap and recent cap management, skins can easily get a deal done next year if they choose to.

I just dont see the no LTD argument equals no Kirk down the road as a given myself.

HIstory of the NFL shows that a franchised player does one of two things.

1. He performs well enough to ask for outrageous money and tells the team he wont play under the tag again.
2. He gets injured 3-6 weeks into the season.

In either case, most guys who play under the tag, are on a different team the following season. Going to miss Kirk.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

HIstory of the NFL shows that a franchised player does one of two things.

1. He performs well enough to ask for outrageous money and tells the team he wont play under the tag again.
2. He gets injured 3-6 weeks into the season.

In either case, most guys who play under the tag, are on a different team the following season. Going to miss Kirk.

Seems difficult to use history with a franchise tagged QB that only had 1 year as a starter under his belt.

Only Drew Breez to compare him to. And not very similar situation.

This is a unique set of circumstances with no apparent animosity on either side.

I just see the pros and cons of both points of view. Not married to either of them.

 

[Caliskinsfan]